Requests for new languages/Wikipedia Gheg

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[edit] Gheg Wikipedia

←main page Requests for new languages (Wikipedia Gheg)
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Gheg is spoken today by an around 2.8 million people (quoted from Omniglot) in Kosovo, Northern Albania, parts of Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia, Montenegro and in Serbia

[edit] Arguments in favour

  • &Y  Support 2.8 million people speaking Gheg... We shall definitely have a Gheg Wikipedia.--Dardan Prishtina 16:52, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
  • Native speakers are willing to contribute to the project in the long term. The language code for Gheg exists and is classified as "active". The difference between Gheg and Albanian are substantial enough. Literature in Gheg do exist. --Jose77 22:07, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
  • &Y  Support I support this requested. Gheg is the native language of over 2 million people, including most Kosovars. Literary Albanian is unfairly said to be a unified dialect, but in reality it is based almost entirely on Tosk. --Node ue 23:07, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
  • &Y  Support In line with similar projects in regional languages often considered dialects. It has its own ISO code and the Albanian Wikipedia does not permit articles in Gheg. Should the Albanian Wikipedia start admitting articles in Gheg, I will withdraw my support. Steinbach (formerly Caesarion) 18:37, 14 January 2008 (UTC)
  • &Y  Support There are quite some differences between gheg and tosk albanian , and gheg is the native language (dialect) for all people living in kosovo , northern albania,montenegro,serbia and macedonia--Cradel
  • &Y  Support Per Node ue. Timpul 09:21, 14 July 2008 (UTC)
  • &Y  Support I think we need to make a new alphabet with Gheg letters. After a bit of years the Gheg will be Kosovars official language. Kosovar2
  • &Y  Strongly Support Letting people speak and write in gheg will boost also the tosk standard as it has been isolated and petrified, even the dictionary wasn't updated since Bresta

[edit] Arguments against

  • &N  Oppose There is an Albanian Wikipedia. Gheg is an Albanian dialect. Other countries have their own miscellaneous dialects, but have only ONE Wikipedia. ~~Aeternus
    Other countries have their own miscellaneous dialects, but also have MULTIPLE Wikipedias. Eg. (Dutch - West Flemish, Zeelandic, Limburgs, Frysk, Saterlandic; Italian - Sardinian, Corsican, Piedmontese, Venetian, Lobardian; French - Norman French, Arpitan, Walloon French, Occitan; Spanish - Castillian, Extremaduran, Aragonese, Asturian, Galician). Tell me if I am incorrect in any way.--Jose77 22:05, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
    Limburgish doesn't belong in your opsomming. --OosWesThoesBes 18:39, 14 January 2008 (UTC)
    It has been corrected. --Jose77 22:16, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
  • &N  Oppose I think any well written article would be welcomed at the Albanian Wikipedia no matter whether it's written in gheg or tosk. The Albanian Wikipedia is small enough that a fractioning of the community wouldn't be good for the current or the new one. Dori | Talk 22:24, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
  • &N  Oppose Like Dori. Better open sq.wikipedia for articles written in the Gheg language. Many Wikipediae allow for articles in multiple dialects (cf. Alemannic, Kurdish, etc.) --Thogo (talk) 13:25, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
  • &N  Oppose I'm broadly opposed to splitting Wikipedias between mutually intelligible varieties, especially if these differences can be taken care of on a technological level. I haven't seen that at least the literary forms of these two varieties are mutually unintelligible, but I remain open to be convinced. If it does remain one Wikipedia it should be open to all written varieties of Albanian. - FrancisTyers 23:57, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
  • &N  Strongly oppose - There is an Albanian wikipedia, and there you can write both in Gheg Albanian. It has no sense divide a language in his dialects. There is a wikpedia in Occitan (no in Gascon os Aranese or other dialect), a wikipedia in Asturian (no one in Leonese), etc. Jose77, Castillian is the same language as Spanish, and Asturian, Aragonese, etc, aren't spanish dialects. You don't undertand that? --Norrin strange 11:21, 26 March 2008 (UTC)
Actually in the albanian wikipedia you cant write articles in the gheg dialect , only in tosk --Cradel 20:53, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] General discussion

  • Our arguments in favour of the creation of a Gheg Wikipedia do not mean that we are against the Albanian Standard Literary language, which is mainly based on Tosk. We are just for making use of a living tongue as it is spoken by its native speakers, and for the advancement of the tongue itself. We have no political aims.--Dardan Prishtina 16:58, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
I would be interested in how different Gheg and Tosk Albanian are. Are they intelligible to each other? --Thogo (talk) 18:17, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
Yes, they are intelligible on a level of educated people, but there are some differences. I'd be OK if a Gheg Wikipedia could not be set up... Just thought we could do some more work and it wasn't my initial idea whatsoever.--Dardan Prishtina 21:30, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
They're somewhat like British English and American English (or different dialects of English). You take someone who talks with a pretty thick Louisiana accent and he wouldn't be understood by a British lord (or likewise someone from the streets of Britain to someone in Idaho). But take two modern proses from each region and they're mostly understood everywhere. There are some words that may be new in usage to the two Albanian dialects, but written prose can be mostly understood across the two dialects. Some of the most well known Albanian literary works are in gheg and they're read and cherished by tosk speakers as part of the overall language. It's mostly a personal disturbance some people have similar to color and colour and more importantly the justified feeling that the gheg dialect is being repressed due to the accepted standard/official language being based mostly on tosk (even in areas inhabited by gheg speakers). A problem that I see is that's not a problem in British vs American English is that there is no standard rules for writing gheg, just some understood change in forms. Two different gheg writers could write the same words in different ways, and there wouldn't be a way to judge which one is correct (or rather they could both be correct) as far as I know. Since I am a tosk speaker I can't say for sure as I wouldn't be familiar with any potential gheg academic publishings on the language. Dori | Talk 22:40, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
  • We need to note that differences are greater than between British and American English. Take a look at the original Gheg text of an excerpt from the Kanun and its adoption to Standard Albanian (mainly Tosk Albanian):
GHEG ALBANIAN
Burri â' në detyrë:
a) me u përkujdesë per veshë e mathë e per gjitshka të lypet per me mbajtë jeten;
b) me ruejtë nderen e grues e mos me e lânë me u ankue per kurrnji nevojë.
STANDARD ALBANIAN
Burri është i detyruar:
a) të përkujdeset për veshmbathje e për gjithçka që lipset për ta mbajtur jetën;
b) ta ruajë nderin e gruas e mos ta lë të ankohet për asnjë nevojë.
I took this from the Albanian wikipedia article on Gheg Albanian[1].--Dardan Prishtina 17:16, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
Can you give lexical analyses (e.g. grammatical category and sub-categories) for those two snippets? Surface forms can often be deceptive. Also mention for each word that differs if the word is also present in the other dialect or likely to be understood. - FrancisTyers 23:51, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
Heres another example with the verb "working" : Tosk: duke punuar , gheg : tuj punue --Cradel 11:39, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Localisation update

  • Currently 60.74% of the most used messages have been localised... Thanks, GerardM 20:58, 3 April 2008 (UTC)
  • Currently 59.26% of the most used messages have been localised... Thanks, GerardM 10:20, 27 July 2008 (UTC)
  • Currently 59.05% of the most used messages have been localised... Thanks, GerardM 07:31, 2 August 2008 (UTC)
  • Currently 58.42% of the most used MediaWiki messages have been localised. Localisation of these messages is a requirement before your request is finally assessed. This is the recent localisation activity for your language. Thanks, GerardM 11:58, 12 November 2008 (UTC)
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