Talk:Wikimedia LGBT+/Archive 3

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IdeaLab: Wiki Loves Pride 2014

So, I am not exactly sure how this process works, or what all is required going forward, but I thought I would put this idea out into the world and see what happens. If anything, it will be a way to gain feedback (and hopefully support) for the Wiki Loves Pride campaign, which is scheduled to take place this June. Please feel free to contribute to the "idea" by providing feedback, voicing your concerns, showing your support, adding your name as an "idea" participant, or doing whatever you feel is appropriate. Again, just posting for the sake of getting the ball rolling on LGBT projects. Thanks! --Another Believer (talk) 17:37, 28 March 2014 (UTC)

WikiConference USA LGBT Meetup

WikiConference USA attendees might be interested in the planned LGBT Meetup. This is an opportunity to meet fellow enthusiasts, discuss LGBT-related Wikimedia activities, and consider future plans for the proposed user group. This will be casual and is not a conference submission or formal meeting. Please sign up if you are interested! --Another Believer (talk) 18:29, 23 April 2014 (UTC)

Wikimedia Commons challenge as part of Wiki Loves Pride

See here regarding the possibility of having an LGBT photo challenge at Wikimedia Commons as part of Wiki Loves Pride and pride celebrations. Any comments and/or support would be very helpful at this time. Thanks! --Another Believer (talk) 19:00, 13 May 2014 (UTC)

This request has been approved. So glad to see interwiki collaboration for Wiki Loves Pride! --Another Believer (talk) 15:18, 14 May 2014 (UTC)

Opposing Mass Surveillance on the Internet - apart from LGBT minorities

Re: http://blog.wikimedia.org/2014/05/09/opposing-mass-surveillance-on-the-internet

I have left this reply to the blog post:

The document will be offensive to many, as LGBT minorities have been explicitly excluded from the “Legitimate Aim” section, despite “sexual orientation” being mentioned in the unenforceable preamble. As a consequence this policy supports any Government who wish to track LGBT minorities for any reason. In the light of countries recently attempting to make having a profile on Grindr a crime for its citizens, this is not a theoretical scenario.
Could someone please provide some links to the necessary community consultation in advance of this political action of the WMF?

Wikimedia UK has this same document under consideration for the chapter board to publicly support here (being lobbied for a second time).

Thanks --Fæ (talk) 17:30, 14 May 2014 (UTC)

Wiki Loves Pride page translation?

Would anyone (possibly Verdy p or Varnent?) know how to submit a request for a Wikipedia page to be translated for Wikipedias of other languages? I speak only English, so my ability to leverage participation and support in other languages is limited. It would be great if the main Wiki Loves Pride page at English Wikipedia could be translated into at least some of the most popular languages. Translating the page may encourage speakers of many languages to indicate support and/or organize events around the world. --Another Believer (talk) 00:31, 18 May 2014 (UTC)

You can try emailing the Translation committee and asking for help, but given that it's on a language-specific wiki - the options are basically just ask folks on other Wikipedias to translate it over. I will go ahead and start setting up the WLP pages here on Meta to be translate friendly.  :) --Varnent (talk)(COI) 03:49, 19 May 2014 (UTC)
Done. Thanks for the suggestion. And for marking other pages for translation. --Another Believer (talk) 05:23, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

Progress

Concerns

  • My request for a translation into Arabic raised an interesting question. For the record, I am completely fine with Meno25's response; no criticism there, especially if particular actions make someone uncomfortable. Should we still have the goal of translating to languages like Arabic given concerns like these? I guess this gets back to the privacy issues... --Another Believer (talk) 19:27, 19 May 2014 (UTC)
Are there any project members willing to have a conversation with Iberocoop re: translating and the request for a Wiki Loves Pride page at Spanish Wikipedia? See here for more info.) Thanks, --Another Believer (talk) 15:33, 20 May 2014 (UTC)
Why not host on meta and utilize the translate extension like we do with the main Wikimedia LGBT page. --Varnent (talk)(COI) 17:14, 20 May 2014 (UTC)
Because the best way to advertise Wikipedia events to Wikipedians is on Wikipedia, not Meta. :) (But, yes, I understand your point.) --Another Believer (talk) 19:01, 20 May 2014 (UTC)
I think that makes a logical argument for a portal on Wikipedia that feeds to a Meta-page. But I think you're unlikely to find resolutions to most of these translation problems. I would personally recommend having an "ad" of sorts on Wikipedia - but hosting the organizing content on Meta. Aside from the problems with Wikipedia translation, another problem here is the amount of outreach that will be required when updates to the EnWP page are made - whereas on Meta no outreach needs to be done - there is already a team of translators looking for updated content to translate. Part of this conversation reminds me of why Meta and Outreach wiki were setup to house multi-lingual event pages. I also think you will draw more editors from other Wikimedia projects if it's not on enWP. Just my two cents - I'm not committing the time to running the event this year or anything - so take it all with a grain of salt. Ultimately, do whatever works best for you.  :) --Varnent (talk)(COI) 19:41, 20 May 2014 (UTC)
Do people use Meta much for organizing events? If people choose to organize a WLP event, it will most likely be because they happened upon the page at Wikipedia. Is the U.S. actually the exception, perhaps because there is no U.S. chapter? I see Meta as a place for top-level discussion and planning, but campaigns like Wiki Loves Libraries, Art+Feminism, the Great American Wiknic, etc. are all done at Wikipedia. I do see your point re: the need to constantly update pages. This is the reason why I created a very general overview page, Wiki Loves Pride. This will remain more static and link to the subpages for each year, 2014, 2015, etc. My hope is that eventually, Spanish Wikipedia will organize its own Wiki Loves Pride pages and activities, German Wikipedia will do the same, etc. That being said, this is my first attempt at co-spearheading a multi-national, multi-lingual project, with limited external support, so sometimes I can only scatter seeds and see what takes hold. --Another Believer (talk) 20:10, 20 May 2014 (UTC)
I do not know if there is data on what areas of the world use Meta for what purposes. It has been my experience that the instinct to go to enWP lessens greatly when you leave the US. Someone probably has it - I can ask around if you would like - but I do know that multi-project efforts like GLAM have at one time been run via Meta or Outreach (GLAM and Wiki Loves Monuments now have their own Wiki). I imagine one day it could be housed on a Wikimedia LGBT wiki (if that ever happens) - similar to how a lot of affiliates do their outreach projects via their wikis for a variety of reasons. I will ponder the "best practice" a bit - but my personal experience has been that active Wikimedians are comfortable jumping between project wikis. The Wiki Loves Monument page on enWP is an example of a promo page that directs you to the ultimate wiki-home. I also think it depends on how multi-project you hope this becomes. I suspect if it is housed on Wikipedia, people will be less likely to make the connection to things like LGBT content on Commons or Wikisource. Again, I could be wrong, that is just my gut reaction. I don't think it's a major concern either way actually, but it popped up in my head after hearing about the translation problems. The use of translator extension is relatively new, so I do not know that we fully know yet what impact it being on Meta will have to Meta being more of an international activity hub. However, given the complexities of doing it on other wikis, I think it makes sense that this will occur more over time (again - this is something I concede I could easily be proven wrong). --Varnent (talk)(COI) 22:16, 20 May 2014 (UTC)
Thanks for sharing your perspective. Don't trouble yourself with searching for global usage trends, I think I was just sharing my experience as an English speaker who uses English Wikipedia as a home wiki. I kind of assumed that having project pages at Wikipedia (in any language; translated or created organically) was an obvious way to recruit participation for Wikipedia-related outreach initiatives. I don't really have a problem using Meta, but there is not a critical mass of organizing activity here yet, for a starter project where its best outcomes may likely be driven by "sword sourcing" or drive-by exposure. Also, I appreciate your point about the potential disconnect with other WIkimedia projects like Commons or Wikisource. I am trying to include references to meta:WLP, meta:WMLGBT, Commons (see photography section), etc. whenever possible. I do think sister projects could be mentioned on the main WLP page (ENWP), so I can make that improvement soon. --Another Believer (talk) 23:47, 20 May 2014 (UTC)
Some events are organized via meta, for a sample of stuff, see Events. I suggest separating the idea of the overarching WLP programme from individual LGBT projects. This means that you might use meta or outreach to coordinate the 2014 WLP programme of activities and preparing communications around them (which may tie in nicely with Wikimania), while a project within the programme for events like editathon(s) as part of Europride this year in Oslo, might well need project pages on the Wikipedias (or chapters if active enough) that have leaders to drive them, as well as a subpage of the LGBT media project on Commons. As a general tip, don't create a maintenance headache for yourself, if there are insufficient volunteers to maintain pages (or to help with translations), then a fall-back of coordination by email may be more effective. At the end of the day, it may only take two active Wikimedians in Oslo to make a massive difference to photographic coverage of Europride and related blog posts to then stimulate a handful of interesting LGBT Wikipedia articles to be praised as a successful return for a tiny amount of volunteer expenses, if any. Keeping it local and small but supporting with global coordination is a tricky thing to balance.
A smattering of events this year will actually provide a rather good foundation, and track record of value, for proposals in 2015, even if several ideas for events just end up running into the sand. Some "non-successes" are going to be a natural part of growing the LGBT programme. --Fæ (talk) 22:22, 20 May 2014 (UTC)
Thanks, Fae. You are right to point out the inefficiency of constantly requesting translations for evolving content. Perhaps my time is better spent posting invites on chapter talk pages here at Meta. Then, if there is interest, chapters/groups can determine which sites they want to use for organizing activities. The de/fr/it WLP pages are there for future reference and organizing, but I will not attempt to translate the English Wikipedia page into similar pages for other Wikipedias. --Another Believer (talk) 14:20, 21 May 2014 (UTC)
I agree. I think getting SOME events going this year is key to building momentum toward next year. The main things are persistence and being open to collaboration. As you both know, I am a big believer in planting seeds and seeing where they grow organically. One or two good events this year, even if the rest do meet expectations, can be enough to jumpstart a healthy snowball growth of the project. My personal hunch is this project has staying power and this is the start of something you will indeed be very proud in a few years to have started.  :) --Varnent (talk)(COI) 23:11, 20 May 2014 (UTC)
That is very thoughtful to say--much appreciated. I am trying to encourage collaboration by planting seeds at multiple Wikimedia sister projects and by encouraging people to participate even in the smallest ways if they are uninterested in hosting an edit-a-thon, such as taking pictures in their area or uploading free ones from Flickr. There is also a page (which still needs to be constructed) for Remote participation, for those who wish to contribute but live in areas devoid of either LGBT culture or a Wikimedia community. I am pleased with the amount of U.S. participation, but had a personal goal of at least a couple activities in Europe and South America. I think I might do a round of chapter talk page invites here at Meta. Thanks again, Varnent. --Another Believer (talk) 14:20, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

Wiki Loves Pride 2014

It looks as though June 21 is going to be the date for Wiki Loves Pride, a planned edit-a-thon series to improve coverage of LGBT-related content on Wikipedia. If you are able to participate somehow that would be so great!

Here is the project page for Wiki Loves Pride 2014: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Wiki_Loves_Pride_2014

You will notice a section for edit-a-thons and a section for photography campaigns. Each month, WikiProject Oregon organizes two photography projects (see examples here). For June, one of the two will be "Pride PDX", an attempt to photograph LGBT culture and history in Portland. My hope is that people will duplicate this for their city. So, even if you are unable to host an editathon, you might consider photographing LGBT culture in your city. It is nice because you have a whole month to contribute! (Here is the project page for Pride PDX, and here is what it can look like once the gallery is filled.)

If you know others who might be interested in organizing an edit-a-thon or photo project as part of Wiki Loves Pride, be sure to twist their arm or even let me know their information and I will reach out to them appropriately. My hope is that cities around the world will participate. Let me know if you have any questions. Thanks!--Another Believer (talk) 17:03, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

Cities in Canada and the US are participating, which is great, but it would be even better if events were organized on other continents, too. Does anyone have contacts in South America, Europe, Asia, Africa or Australia? --Another Believer (talk) 14:59, 2 May 2014 (UTC)
There are now designated pages for Remote Participation and Results. Please feel free to improve/update these pages between now and the end of the Wiki Loves Pride campaign. No contributions are too small! --Another Believer (talk) 19:27, 22 May 2014 (UTC)

Is anyone in Seattle interesting in hosting a Wiki Loves Pride event? See here. --Another Believer (talk) 05:01, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

Sign on to be a Founding Member of a WikiLGBT Usergroup

At WikiConference USA we have held a session, "LGBT Meetup" discussing the founding of a WikiLGBT Usergroup. We are looking for founding members/leadership for a Wikipedia Usergroup and request that if you would like to be included as a founding member of the Usergroup, you please sign your Username below. We will send an email to the Affiliations Committee when we have 3 or more signatures here and the founding members have agreed that we are ready to go forward with this proposal to the Affiliations Committee.

  • Will do. I am currently traveling, but I can do this at my earliest convenience unless someone beats me to the punch. We definitely discussed a mailing list notice at WikiConference USA to allow others the opportunity to be a founding member, or voice their support or concerns. --Another Believer (talk) 12:03, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

I believe sufficient time has been given to those who may wish to sign on as a founding member, but were not present at WikiConference USA. Are we ready to send an email to AffCom as the next step toward user group status? --Another Believer (talk) 21:56, 5 June 2014 (UTC)

I would say to always give a full week for this kind of thing, which will have been fulfilled from UTC evening this coming Sunday. CT Cooper · talk 03:27, 6 June 2014 (UTC)
Sounds good! --Another Believer (talk) 14:00, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

Concern regarding Wiki Loves Pride

Please take a few moments to read this concern regarding Wiki Loves Pride:

Please share your thoughts here. --Another Believer (talk) 03:23, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

I would suggest that when we design processes for coordination and communication of WM-LGBT projects we take care to ensure that people can easily (and non-publicly) opt out of public notices or public communications. There may be a range of reasons as to why someone may want to both stay informed and involved but at the same time not be publicly seen to be associated with an LGBT initiative. Certainly being gay but living in a country where the authorities may prosecute you for 'immoral practices' is a good reason to be cautious in public. This is why *both* having public forums like this page and a closed email list where emails are intended to be kept private have good reasons to exist.
With regard to the specific complaint, this is a hypothetical complaint, rather than from someone that feels at risk by receiving a notice. It is best not to overreact, and it is worth noting that we have project and central notices that are not censored against LGBT related information and appear on everyone's page. For example on Wikimedia Commons right now there is a global notice for Wiki Loves Pride; nobody has complained about seeing it.
Lastly this is an interesting topic in its own right. It would be great for Wiki Loves Pride if we could publish an anonymous interview with an active Wikimedian contributing to LGBT topics, who lives in a country where being a homosexual is a crime or they are subject to harassment from the authorities, and they could give their thoughts on why Wikimedia projects are important for their community and their future. I would be happy to help with conducting such an interview, it being straight-forward to do it with a few emails or via instant messaging, we would just need to decide where to publish it. --Fæ (talk) 07:57, 8 June 2014 (UTC)
Thanks for chiming in, Fae. I have posted a lot of talk page invitations recently, and this was the only complaint that I received. Having had more time to think about it, I am fine with the fact that I distributed invitations, and I am also okay if someone has a valid reason to remove one. But, like you mentioned, the concern is hypothetical, and possibly a minority opinion given no other complaints. With regard to the anonymous interview, I think it's a good idea. If you or someone else wishes to take the lead, I am quite busy with other tasks lately. --Another Believer (talk) 15:04, 8 June 2014 (UTC)

As a person who lives in one of the most dangerous countries to be gay I show my support and offer my help because I see the concerns irrational but in the long term we need to work on privacy options. there were similar concerns during Wikimania 2013 and this is the outcome which I highly recommend you to read the privacy part again. By the way: It would be better if you included option of remote participating in the invitation in order to avoid any misunderstanding. Best Amir (talk) 04:43, 9 June 2014 (UTC)

I suggest we use Varnent's notes as the basis of a WM-LGBT specific policy with regard to managing privacy. It can be taken as an action for the next WM-LGBT group meeting (which may well be the first official one). --Fæ (talk) 08:33, 9 June 2014 (UTC)

India Access to Knowledge

See India Access To Knowledge/Events/Wiki Loves Pride 2014. My understanding is that events are being planned in Bangalore and Delhi. @Nitika.t: Would you or someone associated with this project like to provide an overview, about these events and/or the A2K program in general? --Another Believer (talk) 17:39, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

Also, as an FYI, I noted the creation of the page at the Wiki Loves Pride results page and the Wiki Loves Pride template. If other project pages are created for specific events or years, let me know and I can adjust accordingly! --Another Believer (talk) 18:08, 16 June 2014 (UTC)

LGBT taskforce on Wikidata

Logo, Wikidata LGBT task force

Hello, I just made this d:Wikidata:LGBT task force Amir (talk) 09:34, 17 June 2014 (UTC)

This is fantastic! Thank you for getting the ball rolling on this, Amir. Glad to see another LGBT interwiki project come to fruition. I noted the creation of this group and the report at the Wiki Loves Pride results page both within the Project Growth section at the top and the Wikidata section at the bottom. Let me know if any changes should be made. I am not terribly familiar with Wikidata, but I signed on as a supporter of the group. I also wrote on the talk page that perhaps a logo for the group would be fun--maybe a rainbow-inspired version of the regular Wikidata logo? --Another Believer (talk) 15:10, 17 June 2014 (UTC)

LGBT interwiki portal?

Does anyone have an interest in creating an LGBT interwiki portal, similar to the "Content projects" portal on the Main Page, to be used at LGBT-relaed WikiProjects? This could be one way to connect the projects and foster interwiki collaboration. There are projects at Wikipedia (multiple languages), Commons, Wikidata, Wikivoyage, etc., but they are only connected at Wikimedia LGBT/Interwiki. A concise, visually-appealing portal might be more effective and could advertise projects at places like en:Wikipedia:Wiki Loves Pride. --Another Believer (talk) 15:54, 17 June 2014 (UTC)

In fact the page is there. Look at "Other related Wikiproject" links (the subbpage is still named "/Interwiki" but this is less explcit for newcomers) verdy_p (talk) 13:48, 18 June 2014 (UTC)
Perhaps "portal" is not the right word, but what I am referring to is a banner or rectangular visual that can be displayed with logos and links to projects, not a page with detailed information. --Another Believer (talk) 15:29, 18 June 2014 (UTC)

Wikimania 2014 - Wikimedia LGBT

I have submitted a presentation called Wikimedia LGBT: Past, Present and Future? for Wikimania 2014. My hope is to provide an overview of the history, current status and planned activities for this group, including the results of this year's Wiki Loves Pride campaign, which will have been completed by the time the conference is held. Please let me know if you have any questions or concerns, or please share any proposals you have submitted for the conference. (Oh, and I am not too proud to ask that, if you are interested in this presentation, do feel free to add your name to the presentation page. Thanks!) --Another Believer (talk) 03:23, 12 March 2014 (UTC)

  • Click here for a booklet template I submitted for Wikimania 2014. These can be used to distribute to potential volunteers and people who are interested in supporting Wikimedia LGBT. Do feel free to make changes or let me know your thoughts here. Thanks! --Another Believer (talk) 16:12, 28 March 2014 (UTC)

Here is what the Wikimedia LGBT leaflets will look like (for Wikimania 2014). --Another Believer (talk) 21:58, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

Thanks to those involved in creating this design. It will certainly be nice to give folks something physical to prompt them to join the list or to realize that this space is on meta. If we don't have a time-slot in the Wikimania programme for a formal LGBT meeting, it might be a good idea to ask for one to be set aside.
As a local, I have volunteered to help with Wikimania (I'm involved in a few GLAM things as well) and it would be good to get one LGBT social event in the diary and add that as a note to flyers (even if hand-written on at the last minute). The easiest solution is probably to get everyone interested to the now famously gay Old Compton Street, which in a relatively small space packs a wide selection of busy gay bars, shops (Clone Zone stays open until 9pm), restaurants, takeaways and quieter cafés (several open until 3am). Perhaps Friday evening (8 Aug) would be a good day to pick, but I'll check with the organizers to see if they had some ideas in mind. --Fæ (talk) 22:35, 3 July 2014 (UTC)
Not sure this is the social event you are referring to or not, but don't forget about the LGBT Meetup. I don't know who scheduled it, but currently it will take place on Sat., August 9. --Another Believer (talk) 22:38, 3 July 2014 (UTC)
Blimey, I had forgotten I'd signed up, but it was eight months ago! Thanks for the link, we should probably promote that page a bit more. For some reason I just find the Wikimania site non-intuitive. --Fæ (talk) 23:05, 3 July 2014 (UTC)
The meetup appears on the program/schedule and the Meetups page. If I can think of other ways to promote it, I will. I imagine this will take place at the Barbican just after the last scheduled sessions. I can see this going one of two ways: a social function without much of an agenda, or more of a Wikimedia LGBT meetup with sort of a "state of the user group" report, brainstorming, etc. I was kind of waiting to see what people were in the mood for. I also figured there would be other opportunities for socializing, such as official Wikimania receptions, etc. --Another Believer (talk) 23:58, 3 July 2014 (UTC)

Update: Wiki Loves Pride

Wiki Loves Pride 2014 Mid-Campaign Report

Wiki Loves Pride is a global campaign to create and improve en:LGBT-related content at Wikipedia and its sister projects during the month of June, culminating with a multinational edit-a-thon on and around June 21. We are only half-way through the month, but already we have much to celebrate. Meetups and organized projects are being organized in seven cities across North America, including Atlanta, Houston, Philadelphia, Portland, New York City and Washington, D.C., with ongoing photography campaigns taking place in Portland and Vancouver. Several pictures have been uploaded to Wikimedia Commons' Wiki Loves Pride photo challenge and nearly 50 images have been uploaded to the Commons category "Korea Queer Culture Festival".

View the Results page for a list of LGBT-related content created or improved so far this month, including articles (45 already!) and drafts, categories and templates, and "Did you know" hooks for the Main Page, among other content. LGBT content that needs to be created or expanded may be added here.

Call to action! Please consider starting a new article and adding it to the Results page. Even just a stub! Or, snap a few pictures at your local Pride celebration, or of nearby LGBT establishments. All constructive edits help Wikipedia's mission of providing access to the sum of all human knowledge.

If you have any questions, please leave a message here. --Another Believer (talk) 01:59, 14 June 2014 (UTC)

A couple events are being held today as part of Wiki Loves Pride. If you have a few minutes today, please join us by creating or improving an LGBT-related article and sharing your results on the appropriate page. (I am encouraging the construction of "LGBT culture in X" [city of choice] articles, in particular.) Every constructive edit helps! --Another Believer (talk) 17:25, 21 June 2014 (UTC)

With June coming to an end, you are invited to browse newly-created and improved LGBT-related content from around the world, including Atlanta, Houston, Philadelphia, Portland (Ore.), NYC, Seattle, Seoul, South Africa, Vienna, Warsaw and Washington, D.C. It's not too late to add to this list, if you feel so inclined. Thanks for your participation and support! --Another Believer (talk) 20:06, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

--Another Believer (talk) 16:47, 9 July 2014 (UTC)

Blog post re: Wiki Loves Pride

Dorothy and I have been asked to write a WMF blog post re: Wiki Loves Pride. You can read our current draft here. Feel free to share thoughts on the talk page. Thank you! We see this as a great way to promote both the campaign and Wikimedia LGBT. --Another Believer (talk) 15:04, 12 July 2014 (UTC)

The post is now up here! Link. OR drohowa (talk) 20:33, 23 July 2014 (UTC)
Wikipedia posted the LGBT blog post to Facebook. One person reduced it down to "This is gay". *rolls eyes* Uh, yes, that would be the point! :) --Another Believer (talk)
Maybe we can get "Wikipedia is gay" teeshirts for the next Wikipride, too edgy? ;-) --Fæ (talk) 12:46, 24 July 2014 (UTC)
Hah! That would be mighty hypocritical of me to wear, since I still correct people who say "that's so gay" or similar (... assuming they are not referring to something that is literally gay...!) --Another Believer (talk) 14:17, 24 July 2014 (UTC)
:-D I think we could make a case for "Wikipedia goes gay", though I suspect that once we get around to the inevitable "merchandizing" we'll probably stay language neutral by using the logo and little else. --Fæ (talk) 14:26, 24 July 2014 (UTC)

Help keep a bit of LGBT history free

Re: c:Commons:Deletion_requests/AIDS_education_posters_from_the_Wellcome

Hi, I have had to create a deletion request on Commons for a number of AIDS education posters from the 1990s. If you have some time during Wikimania, take a look and leave a note in the deletion discussion if you can write to the original publishers to see if we can get a release on OTRS. Unfortunately, though the Wellcome released these, they now doubt that their change over to a full free release can be backed up with releases from the original creators—if we get a release on record, then I would be happy to upload the very high resolution scanned version from Wellcome. This should be of particular interest for anyone with personal contacts in ACT UP. Thanks --Fæ (talk) 17:26, 5 August 2014 (UTC)

Lesbian, Bisexual, Gay and Transgender Heritage Initiative - National Park Service

--Another Believer (talk) 15:04, 10 July 2014 (UTC)

I know the folks behind this if anyone is interested in more info. --Varnent (talk)(COI) 18:52, 10 August 2014 (UTC)

General questions by Affiliations Committee to the interested affiliate

Hello,

We've received a request from one of the proposed board members (Dorothy Howard) to get affiliated as a User Group. Here is set of general questions usually we ask to interested affiliate to help us to understand things better (and also for the record).

01. What is the proposed name of the user group? Please do note "Wikimedia X" is reserved for Chapters, so please gain consensus about some other name, preferably a name which has "User Group" in it.

  • LGBT Community User Group
  • LGBT User Group
  • LGBT Wikimedians User Group
  • User Group LGBT
  • Wiki Group LGBT
  • Wiki Project LGBT
  • Pride User Group
  • RAINBOW User Group
I invite others to suggest names and/or state their preference.
One concern I have is that a name like "LGBT Wikimedians User Group" might imply that supporters are, or should, identify as LGBT, when this is not the case. Participants and supporters of this group are not required to identify as LGBT. The purpose of this group is to promote the development of LGBT-related content. I have spoken with several non-Wikimedians about these various group names, and they have expressed that "Wiki Project LGBT" most accurately represents the group's focus and implies LGBT self-identification the least. For this reason, my vote is for Wiki Project LGBT, but I ask others to also share their thoughts. --Another Believer (talk) 15:41, 11 July 2014 (UTC)
  • This reminds me of long discussions about naming the Chapters Association and the eventual advice we had from WMF legal. This group is inclusive, though it is natural to presume that anyone active in the group has a commitment to both improve the experience of LGBT Wikimedians contributing to our projects, and the cause of better open knowledge about LGBT topics; beyond this there is no expectation for anyone's self identification. If anyone has reason to fear being thought to be LGBT, then publicly joining the Group would make little sense, though from the start we have remained cautious to offer non-public and anonymous participation.
To be a user group, then one of the names with User Group in it makes sense to me. "Wiki Project LGBT" looks like the name for a WikiProject which is a different sort of thing. From the legal point of view, if the common terminology is WM-LGBT (which is the abbreviation I've been using for the last two years), there is no harm in using this in addition to UG-LGBT, common usage is a different issue to the official name.
There may be some mileage in keeping the international context in mind. Our recognizable special logo with LGBT imagery, may actually be more important to many people at conferences and events than specific words, or the Wikimedia "brand". --Fæ (talk) 18:15, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

02. Who are the people behind this application?

  • Group development and the goal of user group status have been discussed for some time. The tipping point for submitting a user group application occurred at the inaugural WikiConference USA, held in New York City during 30 May - 1 June 2014. An LGBT Meetup was held on June 1, where a group of several individuals supported the concept of a Wikimedia user group which promotes the development of LGBT content, among other goals. We posted a note on this page (see "Sign on to be a Founding Member of a WikiLGBT Usergroup") in order to provide people not attending the conference an opportunity to support the application. Individuals who have signed on include Dorothy Howard (User:OR drohowa), User:RachelWex, User:Fæ, User:Ladsgroup, User:Mozucat, User:Rich Farmbrough, User:CT Cooper and myself. Nearly fifty users have indicated their support for the group which has been referred to as Wikimedia LGBT up to this point, but the aforementioned list of names represents those who specifically support the user group application. --Another Believer (talk) 15:16, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

03. Which geographical area and context you cover (or plan to cover) with your entity?

04. How many people do you have behind this application?

05. Do you have any prominent Wikimedians behind this application, if so name a few.

  • I invite others to provide descriptions of their activity, but here is a start:
  • Dorothy Howard (User:OR drohowa): Wikipedian in Residence at the Metropolitan New York Library Council (METRO) since August 2013; organizes in-person meetups and co-organizer of Wiki Loves Pride 2014; 5,000+ edits at Wikipedia
  • Rachel Wexelbaum (User:RachelWex): librarian and professor, works at St Cloud State University
  • User:Fæ: millions of edits at Commons (bot operator, mass uploader, image reviewers, OTRS); 4,000+ edits at cy.wikipedia; 77,000+ edits at en.wikipedia; 1,000+ edits at Meta-Wiki; former Wikimedia UK board member and first Chair of the Wikimedia Chapters Association; co-founder of Wikimedia LGBT
  • User:Ladsgroup: nearly 50,000 contributions to more than 500 projects (45,000+ at Persian Wikipedia, 3,000+ edits at Wikidata, ~800 at English Wikipedia, 250+ at Meta-Wiki, etc.); 8 years of activity, bot operator (more than 15M edits) and mw:pywikibot developer
  • User:Mozucat: ~500 Wikipedia edits, librarian at City University of New York, leading campus ambassador helping staff and classes throughout the CUNY system, Wikimedia NYC board member, 5 years of activity and coordination of NYC training workshops
  • User:Rich Farmbrough: more than 1 million edits to 150+ projects, but mostly English Wikipedia
  • Christopher T Cooper (User:CT Cooper): 33,000+ edits at Wikipedia, also active at Commons and Meta-Wiki; Wikimedia UK member since 2009 and London meetup attendee since 2010; served on the Scholarship Committee from December 2012 to present and on the Grants Committee from December 2013 to present
  • User:Another Believer: 7-year contributor (67,000+ edits at Wikipedia; 40,000+ edits at Commons; etc.), follower of many Wikimedia initiatives including GLAM-Wiki and the Wikipedia Education Program; organizes in-person meetups and co-organizer of Wiki Loves Pride 2014

--Another Believer (talk) 16:20, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

06. Please give a short summary of your time path from the founding up to now.

  • Prior to 2011, gatherings for LGBT Wikimedians and friends were hosted at Wikimania conferences. An "LGBT and Friends Outing" was held at Wikimania in Haifa, Israel (2011), and later that year, Wikimedians worked with the Tom of Finland Foundation Library in Los Angeles to host an event called "Queering Wikipedia Editathon" as part of Wiki Loves Libraries. In 2012, the LGBT Outreach Project was created at Outreach Wiki, along with an associated IRC channel and mailing list. That same year, the 3rd Annual LGBT Meetup was held at Wikimania in Washington, D.C., the group migrated from Outreach Wiki to Meta-Wiki, and a couple of other meetings were held on IRC. At the 4th Annual LGBT Meetup at Wikimania in Hong Kong, discussion took place regarding user group status, privacy concerns and a Wikimedia global harassment policy, and representation at the Wikimedia Diversity Conference, among other topics and housekeeping tasks. In November 2013, there was LGBT representation at the Diversity Conference. 2014 saw the first Wiki Loves Pride campaign, co-oganized by Dorothy Howard and myself. I presented "Wikimedia LGBT: Past, Present and Future?" at WikiConference USA and also hosted an LGBT Meetup, where a group of individuals decided to submit an application for user group status. --Another Believer (talk) 16:38, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

07. Have there been any activities/meetings etc of this group of people? If yes, please give a short summary of your activities.

  • As my point of view, Wikimedia LGBT/Wikimania is the list of LGBT-related events that supporters and creators of Wikimedia LGBT particpated, you can see even report and outcome of these meetings. also I think Wiki Loves Pride off-line events needs to be considered into account. Amir (talk) 17:10, 11 July 2014 (UTC)
  • As Amir pointed out, Wikimedia LGBT/Wikimania provides a list of past Wikimania meetups. There have also been a few LGBT meetings on IRC, though I don't believe since 2012. Organizing meetings online can be challenging, given the group's global, multi-lingual scope. In-person meetups are likely to happen at the regional level and/or at movement-wide events such as Wikimania. We will see how meetings are organized moving forward, but I think participants are committed to trying various methods and seeing what works best. To date, most organizing and discussion has taken place via the Meta-Wiki talk page and mailing list. An LGBT Meetup was held at WikiConference USA, and another is planned for the upcoming Wikimania in London.
2014 saw the first Wiki Loves Pride campaign, which gained traction most at English Wikipedia. The Results page provides an overview of the campaign's outcomes. Wikimedia UK, currently focused on organizing Wikimania, has expressed interest in hosting an LGBT-related event later this year, and additional Wiki Loves Pride events are currently being planned in India (see India Access To Knowledge/Events/Wiki Loves Pride 2014). Our hope is that the campaign evolves each year, taking different forms and inspiring various projects in different parts of the world. Perhaps "Wiki Loves Pride" is an annual campaign in the United States each June (in conjunction with Pride Month), but a separate project takes place in the United Kingdom in February in conjunction with LGBT History Month. Project supporters can self-organize as they see fit. It should also be noted that the inaugural Wiki Loves Pride campaign inspired the creation of the LGBT task force at Wikidata. We want to see more off-shoot projects like this!

--Another Believer (talk) 17:57, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

08. Do you keep any monthly/half-yearly/yearly reports of you activities? If yes, please provide links.

  • To date, there has not been much need for regular reporting. Or, reporting has been done at the project level, such as the Results page for the Wiki Loves Pride 2014 campaign. It would be nice to have a regular report or newsletter about ongoing LGBT-related Wikimedia activities and projects. I believe having a group like Wikimedia LGBT to monitor and group various LGBT initiatives will increase the chance of this happening. The group will serve as a hub, connecting LGBT WikiProjects and providing channels for communications and reporting. --Another Believer (talk) 18:05, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

09. What kind of activities are planned for the future in the group?

  • Other possible future projects?
    • collaborations with the GLAM and Education programs
    • activities specific to Wikimedia projects such as Wikibooks, Wikinews, Wikisource or Wikivoyage
    • working with Wiki Project Med on health and medical content
    • collaborating with cultural institutions (particularly LGBT organizations) to enhance Wikimedia projects and perhaps inspire content donations
We believe there are many potential intersections between the field of LGBT studies and Wikimedia projects. --Another Believer (talk) 18:09, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

10. Do you have an overview of how many Wikimedians would like to join the User Group when founded?

11. Is you entity already legally registered?

12. Do you have a bylaws for you entity? If yes, have the bylaws been reviewed by a lawyer/specialist?

13. Please, summarize your focus in a few lines.

  • The group's mission is to promote the development of LGBT content on Wikimedia projects, in all languages, to encourage LGBT organizations to use Wikimedia projects and to adopt the values of free future and open access, and to build greater community among LGBT Wikimedians and allies. Other goals include coordinating cross-wiki efforts among various LGBT WikiProject, participating in discussions related to non-discrimination policies, and encouraging safe environments for LGBT contributors. --Another Believer (talk) 16:38, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for your interest and please let us know if you have any more questions.

Sincerely,
Tanvir Rahman
— T. 08:06, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

Discussion

About the name of the user group, I strongly oppose the third name "LGBT Wikimedians user group" and I'm a little bit oppose the first one, becuase I think these names close doors to allies, you don't need to be a Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, or Transgender to join the user group. Amir (talk) 17:10, 11 July 2014 (UTC)

Thanks, Amir. Do you have a preference for LGBT User Group, User Group LGBT, or Wiki Project LGBT? -Another Believer (talk) 17:35, 11 July 2014 (UTC)
@Fæ: In your above comment, are you suggesting a preference for WM-LGBT? Or, do you prefer one of the other user group names other than Wiki Project LGBT? I am sure you know that the name Wiki Project LGBT is consistent with Wiki Project Med. You raise good points above, but I am curious about your specific recommendation. --Another Believer (talk) 18:25, 11 July 2014 (UTC)
I prefer the second one, the first one and the third one, respectively Amir (talk) 18:30, 11 July 2014 (UTC)
So, of all five options, User Group LGBT is your preference, followed by LGBT User Group then Wiki Project LGBT? Just making sure I understand. --Another Believer (talk) 18:35, 11 July 2014 (UTC)
Yes :) Amir (talk) 20:18, 11 July 2014 (UTC)
I was just saying that I commonly use WM-LGBT, it's not a name I'm proposing. I am content with "User Group LGBT" if "Wikimedia LGBT" is not going to be allowed as an "official" name. In practice these are "Wikimedia User Groups" anyway, meh, tomato, tomato, to quote Ginger Rogers... --Fæ (talk) 08:57, 12 July 2014 (UTC)
Thanks. Hopefully others will chime in on this discussion, as so far we have three people preferring three different names. :) Amir and I have both expressed opposition re: "LGBT Community User Group" and "LGBT Wikimedians User Group"--shall we strike these from the list of options? --Another Believer (talk) 15:13, 12 July 2014 (UTC)
I'd presume this should take a week at minimum (i.e. a small RFC), so best leave as many options as possible. Maybe someone will pop up with a clever name we have not thought of, something off the wall, like the "Rainbow" or "Pride" User Group. Fancy being a PUG? :-) --Fæ (talk) 15:17, 12 July 2014 (UTC)
Sounds good! --Another Believer (talk) 15:23, 12 July 2014 (UTC)
  • Here's my take purely on name: we want the word "wiki" to indicate scope, if the focus is on content it should have LGBT at the end. So of those suggested Wiki Project LGBT is my preferred. However it is confusable with WikiProject LGBT on en:WP. And content is not the sole focus, AIUI. So perhaps Wiki Group LGBT.
Rich Farmbrough 01:08 13 July 2014 (GMT).
Maybe I'm out of my element, but what if we called it "Usergroup Diversity" to side step this whole problem of inclusion/exclusion that comes with using the loaded acronym "LGBT," which seems to be always up for debate. Otherwise, what about "Wikimedia Pride." (?) or "Usergroup Pride." (?)OR drohowa (talk) 20:40, 23 July 2014 (UTC)

Thank you for producing this report. I think the only point of contention currently is the name. It's a shame we can't use "Wikimedia LGBT"; though I guess if in the distant future we became a thematic organization, that would change. As it stands I believe any name should i) keep the door open for allies, ii) have LGBT or similar in the name; anything else leaves too much potential for confusion, and iii) have wiki or similar in the name, for obvious reasons. I'm not sure about "Wiki Project LGBT". Yeah, it's consistent with Wiki Project Med but, on its own, it's too easy to confuse with WikiProject LGBT Studies. If "Wiki Project" is going to be in the name, so should "User Group" in my opinion. My current preference is for Wiki User Group LGBT (abbreviation: WUG-LGBT?); it's not very exciting, but it's clear and ticks all the boxes for me.

My full preferences are as follows: 1) Wiki User Group LGBT, 2) Wiki Group LGBT, 3) Wiki Project LGBT User Group, 4) Wiki Project LGBT, 5) User Group LGBT, 6) LGBT User Group, 7) Pride User Group. Feel free to only list the first three, if that makes things easier. CT Cooper · talk 01:07, 15 July 2014 (UTC)

Preferences

  • Amir: 1.) User Group LGBT, 2.) LGBT User Group, 3.) Wiki Project LGBT
  • Another Believer: 1.) Wiki Project LGBT, 2.) User Group LGBT, 3.) Wiki Group LGBT
  • Fæ: 1.) User Group LGBT 2.) Pride User Group
  • Rich Farmbrough: 1.) Wiki Project LGBT, 2.) Wiki Group LGBT
  • CT Cooper: 1.) Wiki User Group LGBT, 2.) Wiki Group LGBT, 3.) Wiki Project LGBT User Group, 4.) Wiki Project LGBT, 5.) User Group LGBT, 6.) LGBT User Group, 7.) Pride User Group
  • Dorothy 1.) User Group Pride 2. Pride User Group. 3. User Group LGBT

--Another Believer (talk) 02:24, 15 July 2014 (UTC)

Will do. I think we can narrow the list down to User Group LGBT, Wiki User Group LGBT, Wiki Group LGBT, or Wiki Project LGBT (listed alphabetically) based on the above preferences. Does that seem fair and accurate, co-founders? A couple of these are similar--Wiki User Group LGBT is actually a combination of two others. I don't want to rush this, but I think sufficient time has been allowed for people to voice their ideas and suggestions. Is a simple vote of these 4 options the best way to determine our name? --Another Believer (talk) 15:27, 21 July 2014 (UTC)

Good idea Another Believer, I cast my vote for "Wiki User Group LGBT" I wait for others to vote Amir (talk) 07:58, 23 July 2014 (UTC)
I'm a bit late to the naming discussion - my apologies - but I have a preference for "User Group Pride" and "Pride User Group", after Fae, as these can avoid the inclusion/exclusion issues of the acronym "LGBT" and make it even more inclusive. OR drohowa (talk) 20:45, 23 July 2014 (UTC)
To me, User Group Pride reads as though one takes pride in being part of a user group. Also, as evidenced by the Wiki Loves Pride talk page, some people are concerned that "pride" in general does not have a universal LGBT connotation. In other words, "LGBT" is a defined community, as evidenced by the Wikipedia article. The same cannot be said for the article for Pride. At minimum, it would need to be the LGBT Pride User Group, but I can see the accusations of bias and agenda-wiedling from a mile away... --Another Believer (talk) 21:08, 23 July 2014 (UTC)
Yeah I think we need to narrow down our option a bit to reach a consensus. I'm also going for "Wiki User Group LGBT", per Amir and my early first preference vote. CT Cooper · talk 23:15, 25 July 2014 (UTC)
Does it seem fair to narrow this down to User Group LGBT and Wiki User Group LGBT? I am proposing this based on our collective preferences above. These seem to be the most common preferences. We could take a poll between the two options, unless someone has a better suggestion. --Another Believer (talk)
I would personally prefer that Wikimedia be kept in the name, just my two cents. I agree that Pride is too broad, so despite the concerns, suggest LGBT. If for whatever reason, Wikimedia isn't to be included in the name, then I think it should absolutely include the word wiki. Project makes me think more of the WikiProjects than user groups, so I am not a fan of that wording. So while I think "Wikimedia User Group LGBT" or "Wikimedia LGBT User Group" would be better, of the options presented, I would prefer "Wiki User Group LGBT". --Varnent (talk)(COI) 06:33, 28 July 2014 (UTC)

... "Wiki User Group LGBT" seems to be emerging as the preferred name here, per @Ladsgroup:, @CT Cooper:, @Varnent: and myself. @Fæ:'s first preference is for "User Group LGBT" (as is @OR drohowa:'s third preference) and @Rich Farmbrough:'s second preference was "Wiki Group LGBT"... both of these are very close to "Wiki User Group LGBT". Might I suggest we go ahead and adopt this as our name? I don't want to come across as heavy handed, but I think this is the best name based on everyone's preferences and no one else has suggested an alternative method for deciding a final name (such as a direct vote, etc.). Please indicate your support or opposition to adopting "Wiki User Group LGBT" as our name. --Another Believer (talk) 16:15, 30 July 2014 (UTC)

I support "Wiki User Group LGBT" but I also feel its a little long so I would support the use of the nickname/shortened name of just, "User Group LGBT" for more common usage. OR drohowa (talk) 16:48, 30 July 2014 (UTC)
I support "Wiki User Group LGBT" as our official name. CT Cooper · talk 03:23, 6 August 2014 (UTC)

It has just been brought to my attention that we are allowed to have the name Wikimedia LGBT User Group (per Tanvir). This would be my preference over Wiki User Group LGBT. Do others agree? --Another Believer (talk) 16:53, 9 August 2014 (UTC)

During last night's LGBT Meetup, we discussed the group's name. There was a very clear and strong preference for Wikimedia LGBT+ User Group, with the plus sign being added to include other sexual and gender minorities who do not specifically identify as L, G, B, or T. I strongly support this addition, though we should acknowledge there may be times when a plus sign cannot be included for technical reasons, which would still read as Wikimedia LGBT User Group. We took a vote and this was the decision, though I still want to give online group participants (especially user group co-founders) a chance to also state their support or concerns before we email AffCom. Please indicate your support or concern for the name Wikimedia LGBT+ User Group. --Another Believer (talk) 08:31, 10 August 2014 (UTC)
As per the meetup, I support the addition of the plus sign to the name to address the valid concerns raised for those individuals that don't feel they fall under the LGBT banner. It's only a minor change and don't see any major downsides to it. So to be clear, I believe the name should be Wikimedia LGBT+ User Group (Wikimedia LGBT+ in branding), or if it turns out that that name isn't avaliable after all, then Wiki User Group LGBT+ is my second choice per the earlier discussion. CT Cooper · talk 02:41, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
I think the show of hands at the meet-up was sufficient, I didn't count the numbers, but I think at least 15 people supported it, with a magnitude fewer for any other variation. In terms of process, I think that as the number of Wikimedians supporting the name is much greater than the numbers that have taken part so far in discussion about this in this thread on meta, it would be fair to consider this online discussion as satisfactorily complete; though others are welcome to discuss issues and options, especially as the title will need to be supported with an explanation of what we mean by Wikimedia and "LGBT+". Even in the UK I sometimes get asked "what does LGBT mean?".
P.S. it is great news that Affcom are happy for use to use "Wikimedia" in the official name, this makes it much easier for the general public to understand what we are about. --Fæ (talk) 04:22, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
OK. I will email AffCom and submit our name request. --Another Believer (talk) 07:21, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
Unless anyone objects very soon, I have no objection to immediate submission. CT Cooper · talk 07:53, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
Done. I sent an email to Tanvir. --Another Believer (talk) 20:25, 11 August 2014 (UTC)

LGBT Meetup at Wikimania 2014

With Wikimania 2014 just around the corner, we might discuss any goals for the LGBT Meetup, currently scheduled for the evening of Saturday, August 9. Just a handful of people have signed up thus far, but I am not sure how many people are visiting the wiki now. Do we want this to be a very casual meet and greet, or do we want to have an agenda to discuss the state of Wikimedia LGBT or the state of LGBT projects within the Wikimedia movement in general? I am okay with either. If anyone wants to meet to discuss WMLGBT outside of the LGBT Meetup, just let me know. --Another Believer (talk) 14:32, 24 July 2014 (UTC)

I'm looking forward to it. I don't have a strong opinion on the format – how was it done in the past? CT Cooper · talk 23:24, 25 July 2014 (UTC)
In 2012, we had about 35 people in the room and mainly decided we needed a group. It was an informal discussion for about an hour, then going on to a social evening. This year it would be useful to get some notes recorded as we need to lay down evidence that the User Group has meetings to have resolutions and documented actions. In effect we do this virtually, but the physical meeting has value too. --Fæ (talk) 04:20, 26 July 2014 (UTC)
Sadly I will not be at Wikimania this year, so can not help organize this year's gathering. However, I sincerely hope one does happen again this year. --Varnent (talk)(COI) 06:34, 28 July 2014 (UTC)
I think it could be fun to find a cultural institution with an LGBT exhibition, or a space/bar/coffeeshop with an LGBT history to hold the Wikimedia LGBT meetup. I know so little about Britain's LGBT history, come to think of it, but I'm sure it is rich and interesting. Anyone know of some interesting LGBT spaces in London? Perhaps User:CT Cooper can direct us a bit more if I am correct in saying you currently live in London? --OR drohowa (talk) 17:01, 30 July 2014 (UTC)
It's a nice idea, time is limited though. Rich Farmbrough 17:45 3 August 2014 (GMT).
As I've said at User talk:CT Cooper, I don't know London's LGBT locations that well. I contacted a friend of mine, but he only knew bars well. He said the Retro Bar was the most civilized gay bar in London, though it's not that close to the Barbican unfortunately. CT Cooper · talk 03:18, 6 August 2014 (UTC)
I've always been around London and have lived fairly centrally for the last 15 years. I would strongly recommend we make the effort to get to Old Compton Street as there are very few choices around the Barbican (the gayest places in walking distance being for the more adventurous, such as impressively extensive Expectations if you want to buy something "for a friend" or really want to splash out on that tight leather/rubber singlet in your colour (the staff are very helpful), or feel like spending the night hanging out in Chariots Shoreditch, the UK's largest gay sauna).
In Soho there are a number of very well known old gay pubs, such as The Admiral Duncan (read the Wikipedia article) or Comptons of Soho, as well as the more trendy young crowds in the Rupert Street Bar and the G-A-Y bar (3 stories high)—this could become a mini gay pub crawl. These days, I think all have free wifi. I suggest visitors take a look at this TimeOut guide. As well as bars and pubs there is a wide variety of late opening cafés (Bar Italia is open 24 hours), restaurants (Balans, Espana), and some of the gay shops stay open late (Prowler open until 10pm). Around the corner on Charing Cross Road is Manbar (charges for entry after 10.30 and runs as a club to 3am) and if you are near Trafalgar Square it is worth dropping in to Halfway to Heaven for a half, cheaper than most Soho bars.
P.S. In terms of cultural institutions, the Museum of London in the Barbican has an eclectic collection (free) which does include a bit of gay London, but not a lot, the British Museum (free) has the incredible Warren Cup (Addendum: should have returned frem the Isle of Wight by now, worth double-checking) and you may want to get a copy of Richard Parkinson's "A Little Gay History" from the BM bookshop to make your own tour of other LGBT artefacts in the museum (COI: Richard is an old friend of mine). If you really want to get to grips with gay archives, then the LSE in Holborn is home to the main part of the Hall–Carpenter Archives and the Hogwarts-style Bishopsgate Library near Liverpool Street is home to the book collection of the HCA archives, both would need a phone-call first to make sure you can have access. --Fæ (talk) 04:26, 6 August 2014 (UTC)
Thank you for taking the time to give all this information. Yeah, I think if we want to meet in an LGBT themed venue, then going to Soho is the way to go. We just need to agree a time and place to meet at the end of the day and then we can be away. We are booked into Frobisher 6 from 18:30 onwards on Saturday. If we want to have a "formal session" beforehand, we could start there. CT Cooper · talk 00:26, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
We should start in the conference space and go from there for those who wish. Let's do that 6:30 meetup in the designated room. Blue Rasberry (talk) 08:20, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
I agree. Let's meet at 6:30 at the Barbican to discuss LGBT work within the Wikimedia movement. Then, whether we travel together or just plan to meet again at a specific time and place (it sounds like Soho is best), we can have a more casual meet and greet. That way, people can attend one or the other, or both! --Another Believer (talk) 08:24, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
Soho will be a trek from the Barbican, which might prevent some people from going. It will also be packed on a Saturday night. I am not opposed, but would attendees prefer somewhere within walking distance from Barbican? It doesn't have to be a gay bar... but again, either works for me. --Another Believer (talk) 08:34, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
There are a fair few venues that would let us book some space gratis, even on a Saturday night. Also, so long as it's a LGBT+ friendly space, I don't have a problem with it being a space that isn't explicitly an LGBT+ specific venue. Retro Bar, off Strand, would probably be my favoured venue, but mainly because it's familiar to me and convenient (and not full of irritating scene queens and one of the few LGBT+ spaces in London that's genuinely non-gendered). Given I've not travelled thousands of miles and I'm not actually attending the conference itself, though, I think my personal preference should not be terribly relevant ;o)
I have no problem with travelling up to the Barbican if that's more convenient for everyone else; similarly I don't mind missing a preliminary Barbican-based thing but joining you all in Soho (or wherever). To my mind, the priorities should be somewhere that's (a) convenient, particularly for non-Londoners, (b) not going to be unpleasantly full and (c) not going to be extortionately expensive. If we're starting at Barbican, though, schlepping to Soho does seem like quite the trek; it would probably make more sense to stay in or near the Square Mile.
If there's a specific set of proposals to be put to vote, then please leave a message on my talk page on en.wp, as that will email me to ensure I participate :o) — OwenBlacker (Talk) 09:46, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
It looks like starting at the Barbican is the way to go. The Retro Bar seems like a popular choice and would meet our needs, perhaps we should make our way there after we've finished our discussion at the Barbican. CT Cooper · talk 13:41, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
We could move twds Retro, but if that's the plan we should book one of the upstairs booths and it's worth bearing in mind that it's a fair trek (GMaps says it's a 35-minute walk)… — OwenBlacker (Talk) 14:01, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
A 35 minute walk doesn't bother me too much, though I know others might not feel the same way. I guess, using the tube is an alternative option. CT Cooper · talk 23:19, 7 August 2014 (UTC)
Keep in mind that many will want to go back to their hotel first, leave their stuff or get changed, then meet up at a venue. Personally I would find this a bit too far to walk after a long day. To get to the Retro Bar by tube/subway, you can get the Circle line from the Barbican or Moorgate and then it's 10 stops to Embankment (leaving, walk up to the Strand then heading East along the Strand a short way, or go via John Adam Street) TfL planner shows 18-20 mins. If you want to go on to another venue, then the gay Soho area is not actually that far away, about a 5 minute walk from the Retro Bar, going up Charing Cross Road, or if you want to check it out anyway, from the Barbican Station you would go more directly taking any line to Liverpool Street, the Central line to Tottenham Court Road Station, then walk via Soho Square to the gay area, TfL planner shows 13-16 mins). I've never tried the Retro Bar, but then I prefer gay bars. With regard to crowds, Saturday night should be busy, but an advantage of Old Compton Street is that folks can chill out in a choice of cafes which in the gay area are gay spaces too . --Fæ (talk) 04:50, 8 August 2014 (UTC)
@Fæ: Fwiw, Retro is also a gay space, just not gender-segregated and not exclusively gay. (And I mean "gay" in the broadest, LGBT+ sense.) Your point about the variety of spaces around Old Compton St is definitely valid, though — OwenBlacker (Talk) 14:28, 8 August 2014 (UTC)
Retro Bar

Have we come to a decision? It would be good to finalize ASAP so we can start inviting people throughout the day. --Another Believer (talk) 10:22, 9 August 2014 (UTC)

I would suggest either Retro Bar or (if we want to go into Soho) The Yard. Neither are particularly OTT, although both may be rather busy. Retro is lovely, but Soho has the advantage that the 76/N76 bus exists to get people back towards The City/Old Street area. —Tom Morris (talk) 11:27, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
I vote for Retro, especially if this is the more appropriate location for a potentially diverse group of "strangers" to meet and greet. People are of course welcome to break away, but we should have a set time and place to share with people throughout the day. Shall we say between 8:30 and 9? --Another Believer (talk) 11:49, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
8:30 might be a bit late. 8pm instead? —Tom Morris (talk) 12:25, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
Sure! We should keep the LGBT meetup short then, yes? Maybe from 6:30-7:15? That would only give 45 minutes for people to get ready and make their way to the venue. --Another Believer (talk) 12:41, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
If people are a little late, it shouldn't matter too much, now that we've agreed on a venue. I'll try and be at the Retro Bar for 20:00 and no later than 20:30. I look forward to seeing you all. CT Cooper · talk 12:51, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
It's settled then. Retro Bar at 8pm. I will update the LGBT Meetup page at the Wikimania wiki. --Another Believer (talk) 12:57, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
Hi! I'll be at the 6:30 meetup. Not sure yet about going out as I'm down with some sort of sickness, but I'll see you all soon. OR drohowa (talk) 14:00, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
For all who arrived to this discussion late, we are going to be meeting at Frobisher 6 at 6:30 today (Sat) and others will go to Retro Bar (on the Strand) after! OR drohowa (talk) 16:45, 9 August 2014 (UTC)
I'd just like to thank everyone for a nice meetup! I have a good feeling about the goals we discussed and it was great seeing people in person.--Tommikovala (talk) 10:25, 10 August 2014 (UTC)
Ditto! I had a great time and look forward to seeing how the group evolves moving forward. --Another Believer (talk) 10:57, 10 August 2014 (UTC)
Yeah, it was great seeing everyone in person and I'm pleased it was so welcoming for everyone. It was slightly embarrassing when you all applauded me for coming out this year, but it was also very sweet, so thank you. CT Cooper · talk 19:56, 10 August 2014 (UTC)
Some things are worth celebrating! :) --Another Believer (talk) 20:01, 10 August 2014 (UTC)
Definitely worth celebrating, always a brave step to take in our hetero-normative society (hugs). --Fæ (talk) 04:34, 11 August 2014 (UTC)

The Wikimania mini-gay bar crawl was a lot of fun, and during the various conversations it was fascinating to compare the realities of LGBT+ life in different countries. I had no idea that Grindr was "ruder" in the US than the UK, the Americans were amazed you are allowed to walk along Old Compton Street openly carrying a pint of beer, and it was interesting to compare notes on the experience of being in same-sex marriages and civil partnerships as governments have implemented them so differently. There was confusion about some historic references (sigh, I'm old), so here's a few out of interest:

I would love to see some LGBT History related events in the coming year, which seems a natural addition to the Wiki Loves Pride campaign. --Fæ (talk) 05:34, 11 August 2014 (UTC)

... carrying drinks down the street, and the visible urinals...! It seems transparency is highly valued in London. :p --Another Believer (talk) 07:28, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
Well I wasn't familiar with the open urinals either – they love them in the Netherlands but they're a relatively new thing here. And oh yeah, I thought the Friend of Dorothy thing was just a friendly reference to the 1939 film. Well you learn something new everyday. CT Cooper · talk 07:51, 11 August 2014 (UTC)
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