User talk:Geoffbrigham

Welcome to Meta!

Hello Geoffbrigham, and welcome to the Wikimedia Meta-Wiki! This website is for coordinating and discussing all Wikimedia projects. You may find it useful to read our policy page. If you are interested in doing translations, visit Meta:Babylon. You can also leave a note on Meta:Babel or Wikimedia Forum (please read the instructions at the top of the page before posting there). Happy editing!

-- 18:03, 31 March 2011 (UTC)

A Community health barnstar for you!

	Community health
	I appreciate the work you are putting into re-writing the TOS. The end product will be much better because of your patience in answering questions and explaining your thinking here on meta. You have shown yourself to be a true wikimedian at heart, and someone who has the best interest of the community in mind. --FloNight 22:25, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

Legal Counsel Opinion

Please read. I would like an official opinion of our legal counsel over such matters. I find it a little unsettling that people are trying to use "de minimis" as a way to rationalize keeping of an image when the copyrighted part of the object, i.e. the picture, is the focus of the image and plays a large role. I am especially bothered by this when this important paper that is linked in our de minimis policy at Commons says that de minimis is not being recognized as it once was by our courts and only applies on matters when the average person cannot identify the material.

I would also like the opinion regarding matters when there is a "useful object" that has a sticker on it or other identifying markers that contain potentially copyrighted information, especially when the stickers have company logos and trademarks that are beyond simple text. Ottava Rima (talk) 22:57, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

TOU

Hiya

Please send us a reminder when you are done updating the TOU so that we can further comment. Cheers. Anthere 09:29, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

Thanks

Thank you for the compliments. If I ever thought you were too far off base, you would have already heard from me.

I'm happy to be able to make suggestions, and even happier when I know that I can rely on you using your best judgment in freely accepting or rejecting them. If I thought you were simply a scribe who was taking orders from amateurs, rather than a well-informed, thoughtful professional who isn't afraid to reject suggestions, then I'd feel much more constrained and much more worried. Under the present circumstances, I can make a suggestion in full confidence that good ideas will be considered and bad ideas will be ignored. It's very pleasant, very functional, and very freeing.

I think you're doing a great job with this discussion. Thanks. WhatamIdoing 19:07, 27 October 2011 (UTC)

thx

Thanks for your work @Term of use. :) Seb az86556 09:39, 30 October 2011 (UTC)

Hmm

[1] I think this is unfair. The WMF needs the right to ban per OFFICE violations and other serious matters that cannot be dealt with by the community because of both privacy and legal concerns. Ottava Rima (talk) 03:31, 11 November 2011 (UTC)

Quoted from English Wikipedia

Dear Mr. Bingham:

I wrote this on English Wikipedia, which seems not to have been actively monitored. I remain interested in your opinion.

Sincerely, Kiefer.Wolfowitz 13:50, 11 December 2011 (UTC)

Children as administrators

Dear Mr. Brigham:

At a recent RfC on allowing non-administrators to view deleted pages, you stated that the proposal would probably create legal problems in the short run (and Congressional acts as a possible longer-run consequence).

“	I've been asked to step in and give the Foundation's legal view on this question. My view as the Foundation's general counsel is essentially the same as that outlined by Swatjester [below]. Allowing non-administrator users to have access to deleted pages would vastly increase the frequency and volume of legal complaints. (It could have even worse consequences than that in the long term, up to and including corrective legislation by Congress, which would be a disaster.) It is difficult to overstate how much legal and practical difficulty this would cause the Foundation. To be frank, community adoption of such a disastrous policy would create an actual emergency that would likely require Board intervention. I normally favor and support community-driven initiatives, so please believe me when I say I am not raising this set of concerns lightly. The current system is not broken -- so the best advice is 'don't fix it.' MikeGodwin (talk) 13:47, 1 October 2008 (UTC)	”
—13:47, 1 October 2008 (UTC) Mike Godwin, legal counsel for the Wikimedia Foundation

“	I have been asked a couple of times whether, as WMF's present general counsel, I share Mike's view as expressed above. I can confirm that I fully agree with Mike's assessment. Geoffbrigham (talk) 02:18, 27 August 2011 (UTC)	”
—02:18, 27 August 2011 (UTC) Geoff Brigham, general counsel for the Wikimedia Foundation

Your response provokes me to ask two questions:

1. Is there any legal concern with allowing children (minors) to become administrators, which allows them to view deleted content?
2. Should not Wikipedia require that all administrators affirm being 18 years old?

Thank you for your attention. (I would understand if you would prefer not to state anything at the present time or here.)

Sincerely,  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 11:16, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

Yepp, lemme chime in and say I'd like to have this answered as well. thanks. Seb az86556 00:19, 12 December 2011 (UTC)

I should have cross-posted my answer here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Geoffbrigham#Children_as_administrators Cheers. Geoffbrigham (talk) 12:14, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

Public campaign finance

Hi Geoff, thanks for asking Mike about ways to avoid constitutional amendments last night. If you feel like fighting corruption in Washington, please see w:Wikipedia:SOPA initiative/Ideas#Suggestions and w:Wikipedia:Reference desk/Humanities#Best way to get lobbying money out of Congress?. I sent Mike email as he requested. Tashir 19:31, 19 January 2012 (UTC)

'Safeguarding'

It would be much appreciated if the issue of 'safeguarding' (in relation to children and other vulnerable groups) was raised by yourself for community debate during an appropriate 'office hours' session.

This is being raised with you, as you appear to be the most appropriate WMF representative to initiate a debate on how compatible various projects policy (and unwritten custom) are with various jurisdictions approach to 'safeguarding'.

It is appreciated your primary experience would be with the US situation, but a debate would need need to take into account the differing approaches of other jurisdictions, such as the UK.

Sfan00 IMG 20:23, 3 February 2012 (UTC)

Maybe Google and every other search engine should safeguard kids before nonprofits are expected to? But why do you even care? [2] James Salsman 05:35, 11 February 2012 (UTC)

Your recent edits...

See Special:Contributions/Geoffbrigham...aren't you supposed to be on holiday? :-) Mike Peel (talk) 18:57, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

I hate to say it but I'm addicted to you guys. 12-step program is clearly needed.  :) Geoffbrigham (talk) 20:05, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

Step 1, go somewhere without internet access (I recommend somewhere very remote and hilly like Scotland). Step 2, wait for internet withdrawal symptoms to fade away (this may be the tricky part, and may take a while). Step 3, relax and enjoy yourself. For Steps 4-12, see step 3. Mike Peel (talk) 20:09, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

Italian website blocked for one defamatory phrase by all 226 Italian ISP’s

Hello Geoff, I think this might interest you: Wikimedia_Forum/Italian_Wikipedia#February 2012: Italian website http://vajont.info/ blocked for one defamatory phrase by all 226 Italian ISP’s. I saw german press coverage alluding to the Italian Wikipedia strike. Best wishes --Atlasowa (talk) 11:09, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

Hi Atlasowa. Yes ... this is concerning. I have asked one of our legal interns to post on our censorship wiki page. I appreciate these updates. Geoffbrigham (talk) 12:19, 29 February 2012 (UTC)

Updated the court decision of March on Legal and Community Advocacy/Censorship#Italy. Best wishes --Atlasowa (talk) 15:37, 15 April 2012 (UTC)

Commons, Meta, and child protection

commons:Commons:Child_protection, commons:Commons_talk:Child_protection, Talk:Pedophilia#Update – Can you please provide some advice on Commons and here on Meta? --Michaeldsuarez (talk) 00:13, 10 March 2012 (UTC)

I will take a look at this and post on the page. Thanks, Michaeldsuarez. Geoffbrigham (talk) 13:19, 10 March 2012 (UTC)

Hi Michaeldsuarez - In light of the extensive discussion underway, it is a bit unclear to me what questions you would like me to provide thoughts on. (I of course can only represent legally the Wikimedia Foundation, not the community, on these matters, but will be happy to provide some ideas for purposes of the discussion.) The Wikimedia Foundation does take child protection seriously. We believe that the community should make responsible decisions for the good of the projects and their users. The updated terms of use (Sec. 4) set out specific prohibitions on certain behavior, but the community is free to provide for more protective measures, as English Wikipedia did on the matter. Geoffbrigham (talk) 08:28, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

To make that link work, you have to first tell it to look for the page on the English Wikipedia, thusly: en:Wikipedia:Child protection. WhatamIdoing (talk) 12:18, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

Thanks, WhatamIdoing. Made the change. Geoffbrigham (talk) 18:19, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

While we're on the subject, sometimes you have to add a colon at the start, like this: [[:Category:Whatever]] (or [[:commons:File:Whatever]]) to make the link show up. If you type a link in your comment and it's invisible when you preview the page, try adding a colon at the start. The colon seems to signal "make this be a clickable link". The different wikis seem to be configured slightly differently, and some of them require this more often than others. WhatamIdoing (talk) 11:43, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

terms of use -- copyrights

Hi Geoffbrigham, with respect to the new terms of use, I'm seeking your advice on a translation issue in section 7, http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Terms_of_use#7._Licensing_of_Content. It says there, for instance, "Text to which you hold the copyright" -- however, there won't be a good literal translation of that in at least many European jurisdictions. For instance, in the French translation, it is translated "Texte dont vous détenez les droits d’auteur" -- which is the literal translation but doesn't capture the full meaning of "copyright," since the French "droits d’auteur" conception is bound to the author, and cannot be transfered to, say, a company, giving a somewhat inaccurate impression of the underlying statement in the Terms of Use. The same problem occurs in German with the local term "Urheberrecht". Hence, I've kept the English term "Copyright" in the German translation for now, but I don't think that is particularly helpful. How should we deal with this? I see several options: 1) use the local term for "Copyright" (literal translation); 2) use the local term for "Copyright", but add the original term in brackets, i.e. Text, an dem Sie Urheberrechte ("Copyrights") halten; 3) do not translate "Copyright" at all to reflect the different underlying conception, 4) translate "copyright owner" as something like "owner of respective/required rights", "owner of copyrights or sufficent rights of use".
Any thoughts? Thanks in advance, —Pill (talk) 11:46, 12 March 2012 (UTC)

Pill, thank you for your invaluable work on this. We so much appreciate it. With respect to your question, I would choose Option 2 (especially since the English version is controlling). Thanks much for your thoughful question and setting out these options to make it easy for me. :) Cheers. Geoffbrigham (talk) 03:54, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

Thank you very much for your quick reply. Cheers, —Pill (talk) 15:29, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

Wanted

to point u there: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Pedophilia#Is_there--Angel54 5 (talk) 21:05, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

DMCA notice to dropbox for a Wikipedia document

Hello Geoff! FYI, yesterday a german journalist (Mario Sixtus of the Elektrischer Reporter show on german state TV ZDF) twittered that this document on dropbox.com was blocked by a DMCA takedown notice from the german PR crisis manager Wolfgang Stock. The document in question is a copy of this: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:IQWIGundCo.pdf and I don't see any legitimate copyright claim, but a lot of embarassing facts. It is a documentation of the paid-editing and astroturfing activities of Wolfgang Stock and wiki-watch regarding Wikipedia. This scandal (short english summary) got quite some news media coverage in 2011 by Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung, Der Spiegel and others (see also a video by Spiegel online). Der Spiegel even included the dropbox-link in its article on wiki-watch. Mario Sixtus has filed a Counter Notification. We 'll see what happens next. Best wishes --Atlasowa (talk) 17:48, 27 April 2012 (UTC)

Thanks Atlasowa. I will ask someone to look at this.

Michelle just gave me a briefing. This is between third parties so there is little that we can do, but I agree that it is worth watching. Thanks for the heads up. Geoffbrigham (talk) 16:02, 30 April 2012 (UTC)

The dropbox-link is back and working. For some background info see this german blogpost (no details). Best wishes --Atlasowa (talk) 09:15, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

The link is dead since a couple of days (404).--Atlasowa (talk) 16:54, 11 June 2012 (UTC)

Resurrection of Italian "Blog Killer Law"

Italian Wikipedia is discussing Open Letter/ Banner. See links on Legal_and_Community_Advocacy/Censorship#Italy. --Atlasowa (talk) 11:10, 28 April 2012 (UTC)

Thanks again for letting me know. This is quite interesting. Geoffbrigham (talk) 16:04, 30 April 2012 (UTC)

For the record, there is now a sitenotice on Italian Wikipedia. See this post in french (La wikipédia italienne de nouveau menacée?, lundi 11 juin 2012) and article in german (de:Wikipedia:Kurier#Sitenotice in der italienischen Wikipedia). --Atlasowa (talk) 16:44, 11 June 2012 (UTC)

FYI

Hello. There's a legal question for the Foundation at the Wikimedia Forum here. I thought letting you know was appropiate. Regards. —Marco Aurelio (audiencia) 13:44, 11 May 2012 (UTC)

Thank you Marco. I believe Philippe and Kelly addressed it. I appreciate your letting me know. Geoffbrigham (talk) 13:42, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Kudos

You probably don't follow Jimmy Wales' talk page on en.wp, so I thought I'd pass along his compliment: he thinks the Foundation's handling of the Terms of Use discussion was "superlative". Congratulations to you and your team for earning such high praise. WhatamIdoing (talk) 16:45, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

Thank you WhatamIdoing. Our team deserves some credit, but most really goes to the community, especially thoughtful contributors like yourself. You folks really made it a better - less legalistic - document. Geoffbrigham (talk) 16:57, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

Note he's basically slapping down Esetzer in that comment, so there's a certain nuance which should be kept in mind. Anyway, I'll put in my compliments as to your politeness and professionalism in the process. I'm not sure about certain aspects of the evolution of various provisions, but either way, it was all well-played on many levels. -- Seth Finkelstein (talk) 07:40, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

You're welcome!

No problem at all, I mean who doesn't want to say that Philippe's wrong once in a while? ;-) The Helpful One 15:11, 27 May 2012 (UTC)

GAC and political activities

Hi Geoff. You recently added: "Note from Gbrigham (GC): We need an exception for grants for political activities, which must be obtained from the GAC (per previous discussion)." to Funds Dissemination Committee/Draft FDC Proposal for the Board. Could you turn "per previous discussion" into a hyperlink to the appropriate discussion, please? (I can't easily spot it, and I'm sure others would also find a link useful). Thanks. Mike Peel (talk)

Hi Mike, I will ask Bridgespan to link the previous discussion. Thanks. Geoffbrigham (talk) 22:29, 17 June 2012 (UTC)

Question

Hello Geoff. I wish to update b:es:Wikilibros:Limitación general de responsabilidad which is the general disclaimer page for es.wikibooks.org. Can you offer us some advice on what really needs to be there, which matters needs special enphasis, etc? We want a good disclaimer and I thought about asking you so that you could offer us your views and the Foundation ones if possible. Regards. -- MarcoAurelio (talk) 13:12, 25 September 2012 (UTC)

Hi MarcoAurelio - We can't offer legal advice, but I would be happy to put together some suggestions. I will assign to an intern to look at first. Hopefully I can get back to you in about 10 days? Geoffbrigham (talk) 13:38, 25 September 2012 (UTC)

Hello Geoff. I'm aware WMF can not offer legal advice as it'll fall probably into the unethical clause, however we only ask for some suggestions. I'm happy with your proposed solution. Ten days looks OK. Thanks for responding. Best regards, -- MarcoAurelio (talk) 13:43, 25 September 2012 (UTC)

Hi MarcoAurelio - We haven't forgotten about this at WMF. Please give us a couple more days to look into it. Thanks! Rkwon (WMF) (talk) 18:39, 1 October 2012 (UTC)

Sure and thank you very much for the time you're spending in this issue. I really appreciate it. Regards. -- MarcoAurelio (talk) 19:34, 1 October 2012 (UTC)

Hi MarcoAurelio,

Thank you for your note. I apologize it took a few more days than I anticipated to get back to you. As you requested, I took a look at your current disclaimer (at http://es.wikibooks.org/wiki/Wikilibros:Limitaci%C3%B3n_general_de_responsabilidad) to see if we had any suggestions for improvement. As you know, we cannot provide you with legal advice (see https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Template:LCA_disclaimer), but we can provide a few suggestions that might make sense for you to think about. Please note that we are viewing your disclaimer through the lens of an online translation tool, which may be inaccurate or fail to convey nuances in wording.

I’ve run these suggestions by Geoff, but please note that they are preliminary thoughts. Here are a couple of things you might want to consider:

1. You mention the GNU license but not the Creative Commons licenses, which is our common open licensing scheme (http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Terms_of_Use at §7). You may want to incorporate Creative Commons into your “Limited License” section. You may also want to expand the "Limited License" section by including a reminder that works may have different licensing requirements, and that users should reuse/copy/etc. accordingly.

2. We suggest that you link to the Wikimedia Foundation Terms of Use (at http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Terms_of_Use) in the disclaimer. The Foundation’s Terms of Use will most efficiently help fill any gaps in your current disclaimer.

For instance:

• The Terms of Use emphasize that the content on WMF projects does not constitute professional advice (such as legal, medical, or financial advice), and encourage users to seek the help of a licensed or qualified professional if they require specific advice. (§3. “Content We Host”).

• The Terms of Use also cover all proprietary rights (including copyrights, trademarks, patents, and personality rights) and help expand the scope of your existing Rights section. (§4. “Refraining From Certain Activities).

• The Terms of Use remind the user to refrain from activities such as intentionally or knowingly posting content that constitutes libel or defamation. (§4. “Refraining From Certain Activities).

• In most cases, users must agree to submit any text to which they hold the copyright under a Creative Commons or GNU License. (§7. “Licensing of Content”).

Again, thank you for your efforts! Rkwon (WMF) (talk) 23:44, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

2 things you may already know (or may not)

Hello Geoff,

• There is a german court decision about illegal marketing ("Schleichwerbung") on german Wikipedia. The decision is of May 2012, full text is now published (here). It is discussed on de-wiki (i.e. how to include this in WP:COI) [3], [4] and may also have implications beyond Germany: The decision is based on a law which is based on the EU en:Unfair Commercial Practices Directive. Actually I think it's good news: welcome to the "bright line" on paid editing!
• On the tagalog Wikipedia (Philippines) is a sitenotice with the words "blackout" and en:Cybercrime Prevention Act of 2012 (since 5 Oktubre 2012‎).

Just so you know. Best --Atlasowa (talk) 15:49, 7 November 2012 (UTC)

Many thanks for these updates. Quite valuable. Geoffbrigham (talk) 23:17, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

I wanted to give you a Barnstar!

FDC special barnstar

This is to recognize your great support in making the first round of the FDC a success!

Thanks!

Jan-Bart (talk) 21:26, 15 November 2012 (UTC)

Wow! This is great. Thank you so much. Credit goes to entire LCA team. Geoffbrigham (talk) 22:20, 15 November 2012 (UTC)

Bylaws

Quick heads-up: This discussion has identified a potential problem with the WMF's bylaws. The bylaws specify that an action requires a majority of those present (not a majority of those present and voting) at a meeting to vote in favor of it. If a majority of trustees present at a meeting recuse themselves (e.g., due to conflict of interest), then it is impossible to pass a resolution, even if 100% of the votes are in favor. WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:23, 6 December 2012 (UTC)

Cross-posting Stephen's response:

Hello WhatamIdoing, thank you for the detailed reading of the bylaws! The language referenced in the bylaws Section 4(c) is written in accordance with the law of Florida. Under Florida section 617.0824, "an affirmative vote of a majority of directors present" is required. This means that under Florida law, an abstention or recusal counts as a negative vote when determining the majority required for the passage of an action. This is confirmed in commentary on section 607.0824 in the annotated Florida Business Corporation Act.

Technically, the situation that you describe could arise. However, in the event that there is a conflict of interest with a board member or multiple board members, the provisions and processes of section 617.0832 will govern the voting and majority requirements. This section of Florida law specifically addresses this circumstance, and so it does not need to be referenced in the by-laws. Regardless, there may be a remote possibility that a majority could never be obtained in the event of a large number of conflicted directors. In which case, a resolution could not be passed, and probably should not be passed. Stephen LaPorte (WMF) (talk) 15:43, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

Global ban policy

Geoff, I notice that the Terms of Use document links to the Global ban policy. However, to the best of my knowledge, a global ban policy has not been ratified by the community or the Board. A disclaimer at the top of the Global Ban page says in part, "The following is a proposed Wikimedia project, policy, guideline, or process.... References or links to this page should not describe it as "policy"." Therefore I believe that the link on the ToU page is misleading; I believe that the Global Ban policy was not approved as a part of the ToU approval process.

I believe that the proposed Global Requests Committee would be a better way for imposing global bans and I hope that the Board can consider this alternative to the current Global ban proposal. --Pine^✉ 02:56, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

Please also see the variations on the proposal that have been discussed at Talk:Global requests committee. --Pine^✉ 02:57, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

Hi Pine. Thanks for pointing this out. You are right that the current community-based proposal has not yet been ratified, but it is built upon the established RFC process. As soon as consensus is reached regarding the guidelines for handling global bans, we can update the Terms of Use accordingly. IPoirier (WMF) (talk)

Hi, my point is that until an RFC or some similar ratification process is concluded, I think it would be best if, instead of linking to an un-ratified policy, the ToU either had no link or explicitly stated that the policy currently doesn't exist in any finalized form. --Pine^✉ 22:28, 9 January 2013 (UTC)

Your point is well taken, and the legal department has considered these options carefully. Ultimately, we decided that it would be more transparent and informative to link to the unratified policy. The risk of confusion is mitigated by the disclaimer at the top of Global Ban page, which clarifies that the policy has not yet been made official. IPoirier (WMF) (talk)

OK I suppose, although this definitely isn't my preferred state of affairs. I will try to find someone who's willing to close the RFC for the current policy proposal. In the meantime I suggest that you carefully consider what you will recommend if the closer determines that the RFC has not achieved consensus and therefore fails. --Pine^✉ 20:30, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

Data Retention Policy

Is the Data Retention Policy found at [5] compatible with the extensive data retained and analyzed for the CheckUser process? I get the impression that the amount of IP and timestamp data retained is maximized, not minimized. --Pine^✉ 03:01, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

Pine, thank you for your question. The current data retention policy is meant to provide the flexibility needed to keep the Wikimedia Projects running smoothly while protecting user privacy as much as possible. The data retained and analyzed by CheckUsers is used to protect the Projects from vandalism, abuse, or other types of disruption, which in turn aids in the maintenance of the Wikimedia Foundation's services as allowed by the data retention policy. Michelle Paulson (WMF) (talk)

Hmm. Could you provide examples of data that you intentionally discard? It seems to me that almost anything could be claimed to be relevant to sockpuppet investigations. On a separate subject, may I request and suggest that you sign in to your account instead of using an IP to edit? I am aware of at least one case where an IP seems to have impersonated another user. --Pine^✉ 19:28, 2 January 2013 (UTC)

Yes, my apologies...I didn't realize that I wasn't logged in last time. Unfortunately, I am not in charge of implementing data retention and destruction so I cannot give you too many specifics, but it is my understanding that, for example, IP addresses associated with sign-in edits are generally discarded after 90 days absent a reason to retain that particular info (like a sockpuppet investigation or litigation hold).Michelle Paulson (WMF) (talk)

I've heard that the actual number of days isn't supposed to be broadcast precisely so that disruptive socks won't show up every n+1 days. Perhaps your comment should be refactored and your conversation carried on in private. WhatamIdoing (talk) 17:17, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

My understanding, including from Michelle's answer, is that the data are retained indefinitely. --Pine^✉ 18:56, 3 January 2013 (UTC) I didn't catch Michelle's second edit. --Pine^✉ 18:55, 4 January 2013 (UTC)

The background for my question is this fishing expedition: EN:Wikipedia:VPM#SmackBot.27s_details_subpoenaed. If the Foundation deletes the data after a certain period of time then this will reduce the number of accounts that may become privacy casualties in situations like this. Additionally, deleting the data after a certain period of time will have some limiting effect in case of a data breach. --Pine^✉ 19:09, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

I have sent e-mail to Pine. WhatamIdoing (talk) 17:44, 4 January 2013 (UTC)

Wikimedia–WebCite collaboration options

WebCite – Some users for proposing for Wikimedia to take ownership of WebCite (webcitation.org), and some are proposing some sort of collaboration with WebCite (Silver seren's proposal, FT2's proposal). WebCite's initiator Mr. Eysenbach says,

Personally, I would think that leaving it a stand-alone entity with funding and strong ties to the WMF would be the better solution for all parties involved (not least, legal exposure), but this is for WMF to decide, and as WebCite initiator my primary goal is to see WebCite flourish and survive, which it may be best achieved the umbrella of the WMF.

I'm not a lawyer, so I'm wondering about what sort of options for collaboration are possible. What options for collaboration are available? Is "a stand-alone entity with funding and strong ties to the WMF" possible? --Michaeldsuarez (talk) 13:06, 13 February 2013 (UTC)

Michaeldsuarez - My sincere apologies for the delay here. I don't remember receiving notification of your comment, and just noticed it on my Meta page. Is the community making a formal proposal to WMF on this? In the end, I believe it is probably a Board decision but there would need to be a strong showing of support by the community as a first step. We would need more information before discussing the type of collaboration. In theory, if I'm not mistaken, there may be ways of showing support, such as restricted grants - but all that would need to be approved by our grants team, if such grants are possible. What other ideas of collaboration did you have in mind? Geoffbrigham (talk) 06:23, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

chapter agreement archives

Dear Geoff,

A number of links to the versions of agreements signed b/t the WMF and chapters at the Chapter Agreements point to pages on the Internal wiki. Can those be shared publicly here on Meta? I'm happy to do the migration if so.

Regards, –SJ talk  00:22, 8 March 2013 (UTC)

 :) As soon as I posted on wikimedia-l, I thought I should double-check here, and, sure enough, I missed this one. There are a couple of considerations here. For example, chapters would need to give their consent before posting. With respect to the chapter agreements that are publicly posted on the chapter sites, there is not an issue. Geoffbrigham (talk) 06:04, 13 May 2013 (UTC)