User talk:GerardM

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Contents 1 Hi Gerard 2 block 3 Betawiki announcements 4 wikipedia bakhtiari 5 Asking for advice 6 Language subcommittee/Status/wv/ar 7 Re: What is the point 8 Archief? 9 Mirandese 10 Namespaces at os.wiki 11 Mirandese Wikipedia 12 Requests for.../... Limburgish 13 Requests for new languages/Wikiversity Turkish 2 14 Hello! 15 Incubator or not for ckb Wikipedia 16 AGAL Galician 17 Requests for new languages/Wikipedia Mongol 18 Request for approval for Mirandese Wikipedia 19 Mari Wikipedia in Incubator 20 Help! 21 Ka-wikisource 22 Acehnese Wikipedia 23 Signpost interview request 24 length of my candidate statement 25 Your candidacy statement 26 I thought this included your duties 27 Update 28 Www.wikipedia.org template 29 Questionable edit at Public_speakers 30 Edited a template 31 Localization of the Zazaki language 32 Localization of North Frisian 33 Mail 34 Fiji Hindi Wiktionary Test Site 35 Unlock of Kirmanjki Wiktionary project 36 Closure of Incubator? 37 Zazaki Wiktionary Project 38 Veurblad nds-nl 39 Proposal: The general rules of language use in Wikimedia 40 validation criteria of a project in incubation 41 Recent coments 42 Public speakers

[edit] Hi Gerard

Can you take look at this [1]. Thanks. --Seha 16:13, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

[edit] block

Hello GerardM, just wanted to let You know, that the IP You blocked for one month is highly dynamic [2]. :(

Best regards, --birdy geimfyglið _(:> )=| 17:18, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Betawiki announcements

Please, add the notices about betawiki on ca.wiki at ca:Viquipèdia:La taverna/Arxius/Novetats/Recent as it is indicated in the internal distribution list. --Vriullop 13:06, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

Nobody informed our comity that this list existed. Thanks, GerardM 16:28, 10 January 2009 (UTC)

[edit] wikipedia bakhtiari

Hello GerardM Please; show the way to Approval process. I Also support this action and that it is a need in Bakhtiari society. It is only you who could help me. OS. Unless you help me;it deleted.Thanks [[3]]--Behdarvandyani 17:07, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Asking for advice

Hi Gerard

Would you mind Having a look at this ,and give me you openion ; what is written there is important but is shipmaster a representative of the subcommitee. I am happy to answer but I am not sure what the question is . Many thanks.--Ghaly 20:16, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Language subcommittee/Status/wv/ar

Hi, Gerard. Please review Language subcommittee/Status/wv/ar. --Meno25 14:16, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Re: What is the point

Sorry. Thanks. Mikhailov Kusserow (talk) 04:20, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Archief?

Ik wil je niet vervelend doen of je iets verplichten, maar je overlegpagina begint wel erg groot en onlaadbaar te worden :( --OosWesThoesBes 10:38, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

<grijns> nu moet je zoeken in een nog steeds wel erg groot archief :) </grijns> GerardM 11:54, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

Gelukkig dan dat ik daar niet hoef te komen :) --OosWesThoesBes 13:31, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Mirandese

Hi, Gerard. Currently, there are 2 requests for wikis in Mirandese: a Wikipedia and a Wiktionary. I noticed that the requirements for the Wiktionary already contain full localization as if it were a second project. From my perception, it seems that the Wiktionary is more demanded right now, while the Wikipedia is kind of "abandoned". As these two are still requests, wouldn't it be more correct to require just the Most Used messages for the first approved project (which may be the Wiktionary)? I think the Wiktionary proposer thinks Most Used suffices, which would make sense if the Wiktionary gets approved before the Wikipedia. Cheers, Malafaya 11:57, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

When the "most used messages" have bee localised, it is fine when a request is made to have Wiktionary first. At that time full localisation will be required before a Wikipedia may be started. It is not really an issue, just get it done. Thanks, GerardM 12:40, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

That's what I thought. Thanks, Malafaya 13:34, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Could you please update Requests for new languages/Wiktionary Mirandese to eligible? :) Malafaya 13:40, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Namespaces at os.wiki

Saluton, Gerard. Please, help us fix the namespaces issue at os.wiki: it seems that we use Википеди: there, which is not the namespace for Wikipedia:. Could you please check that? That will make the article count fall, I presume, but the thing must be done. And I do not know how to do it the right way; hopefully you can help. Thank you in advance, Amikeco 03:18, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

Hoi, these issues are dealt with at translatewiki.net. The name of namespaces is however something that is true for Ossetian. When it is only true for Wikipedia, it becomes a different story. GerardM 11:43, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

The namespace Wikipedia: — how could we change it to the de facto used (but supposedly counted as main space articles) Википеди: — that is the question. — Amikeco 12:27, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

This too is best asked at Translatewiki.net ... Thanks, GerardM 13:53, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

The change of project namespace name (Wikipedia, Wiktionary, etc.) should be requested at bugzilla:. Other namespaces names can be translated at translatewiki.net. Malafaya 16:26, 3 March 2009 (UTC)

Now it's fixed. Thank you all. Amikeco 11:11, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

Would you please help us again? We have this problem: bots are doing their best to fix double redirects, but they are wrong using the Ossetic translation from betawiki („рарвыст“ for „redirect“). How could we push the translation from betawiki into use? Amikeco 00:53, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

The best place to ask is at Support at translatewiki.net. Thanks, GerardM 04:21, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Mirandese Wikipedia

Hi GerardM. I wanted to know if this page could be updated status of the Mirandese. I'm not sure but Mirandese Wikipedia could already be aproved? Could that process start? Thank you --Cecílio 08:39, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

Hoi, either the Mirandese Wikipedia or the Mirandese Wiktionary may start with only the most used messages localised. We have had a request to give preference to Wiktionary. This request is admissable. There are other criteria for starting a new project then just the localisation.

It is to be preferred when the Mirandese community agrees on what gets preference. When there is no agreement, the project that is the most vibrant will go first. Thanks, GerardM 09:34, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the quick reply. Mirandese Wikipedia should go first(i talked with the user that said that Wiktionary is the first project and explained the situation). Mirandese Wikipedia it's older and has more contents and active users. I just requested the Wiktionary because i think that the Wikipedia can be approved. Most used messages are already done. You can see here Untranslated Most used Messages. So could be started the approve process for Mirandese Wikipedia? Once again thank you - Cecílio 09:49, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

When there is a consensus, that is great. I am sure that we will know that there is consensus when we assess the Mirandese projects. In the end, it is the people that do that have the biggest say in this. Thanks, GerardM 11:04, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Requests for.../... Limburgish

Hallo GerardM,

Wij hebben besloten om de Wikinuujs voorrang te geven tegen de Wikibeuk. Ik zeg het je hierbij zodat je het begrijpt en het kunt weten. Mogen we ooit door de dingetje (en: interface) klaarkomen dan weet je dat je je moet richten op de aktiviteit van wn/li. Beetje wazig allemaal, maar je bent slim genoeg om het te begrijpen :) --OosWesThoesBes 15:44, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Requests for new languages/Wikiversity Turkish 2

Hello, Translations of All MediaWiki messages and all extensions used by wikimedia are completed. Could you please update?Srhat 16:11, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Hello!

Could you please take a look at my request about Mari Wikipedia, and post an answer on it? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Сай (talk • contribs) diff, --Mardetanha ^talk 16:25, 14 April 2009 (UTC).

[edit] Incubator or not for ckb Wikipedia

In the process for approval of a Kurdish (Soranî) WP (code:ckb) we are at the incubator stage. However, there are more than 500 Sorani pages in the Kurdish Wikipedia (ku) already which would be moved to the new WP and deleted in ku. Is it therefore really necessary to move them all manually to the incubator? --Erdal Ronahi 08:20, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

[edit] AGAL Galician

You have said here that "We do not accept requests for particular orthographies GerardM 16:04, 10 May 2008 (UTC)". So, if we want to write in that orhography, can we do it in the Galician Wikipedia? In Galician Wikipedia should be accepted the AGAL orthography ? Thanks. --Norrin strange 09:34, 16 April 2009 (UTC)

Hoi, it is for you to convince the Galician Wikipedia that they accept the orthography you support. You have to appreciate that competing orthographies that fight each other are in many way not the best way to promote your language. GerardM 10:10, 16 April 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Requests for new languages/Wikipedia Mongol

All the worries have been settled out. Why still no progress of this project? --虞海 (Yú Hǎi) 12:36, 21 April 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Request for approval for Mirandese Wikipedia

Hi there. I want to ask you to approve the Mirandese Wikipedia. You already meet the criteria for Approval. Thank you. --Cecílio 05:54, 30 April 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Mari Wikipedia in Incubator

Please, take a look at Talk:Language_committee#Requests for approval Meadow Mari Wikipedia. Nobody has answered yet on my last post week ago. --Сай 09:00, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

Hi there! I am glad to inform you, Language committee, that now Mari Wikipedia Incubator commutity has three active not-grayed out editors for last three monthes (look at statistics). So, the last requirement is meet now.

Also I want to add, that there will be a big conference in July, 10. There would be around 150 young mari. I will take part in this conference and intend to talk about Mari Wikipedia to involve more people to contribute. There are more chances that new participants will contribute to Wikipedia than to Incubator. So, I am asking you to consider approval of Mari Wikipedia before the start of conference(before July, 10). As for me, I have some technical skills. I can help you, for example in creating subdomain mhr.wikipedia.org or in moving pages, etc. And of cource, if you think that mari wikipedia don't have something for final approval, please, write it here immediatly, so we can fix and solve all the problems before July 10.

Please, post your answer here --Сай 05:56, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Help!

Requests for new languages/Wikinews Korean

How to open?

How to translate?

Open it quickly, please~ :) -- WonRyong 23:42, 2 June 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Ka-wikisource

--George Mel 13:55, 18 June 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Acehnese Wikipedia

Hi Gerard, may we know how is the status for Acehnese Wikipedia now? Thanks. Si Gam Acèh 17:02, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

Hello Gerard, we want to make Acehnese Wikipedia could be edited only by registered user. Can you help us please? Thanks. Si Gam Acèh 04:05, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

How about making Acehnese Wikipedia could be edited only by registered user? Si Gam Acèh 03:18, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

Do you know why our logo request is not fulfilled until now? Please see: this and this. Thanks. Si Gam Acèh 04:51, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

I have added bug 21213 to bugzilla... Thanks, GerardM 06:19, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Signpost interview request

Gerard, I invite you to answer a set of questions for the Wikipedia Signpost about your board candidacy: w:Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/2009 Board elections/Gerard Meijssen. If you choose to do so, please let me know. I also encourage you to respond by 26 July; interviews with all candidates who respond will be publicized in the 27 July issue of the Signpost.

Faithfully, Ragesoss 21:13, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

So sorry. I fixed the linked.--Ragesoss 21:56, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

[edit] length of my candidate statement

Hoi, it has been pointed out to me that my statement was too big. It turned out to be some 1398 characters. I did not know because MediaWiki does not tell you that. As I was told that the officials might remove my statement, I did some surgery on the text.

The only regret I have is that people need to know that GLAM or galleries libraries archives and museums.. They are many characters.. GerardM 13:23, 24 July 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Your candidacy statement

Hi Gerard, I believe to have fixed a typo in your candidacy statement. --Purodha Blissenbach 11:18, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, GerardM 11:43, 27 July 2009 (UTC)

[edit] I thought this included your duties

It says your duties affect how fundraising is done. With far less content in the English language wikipedia, which is the largest of them, there are far less people coming here, to look for things enjoyable to read. The mass destruction of a considerable number of articles, after a very small number of people managed to change the notability rules, I think would concern any board set up for the foundation. Someone asked a question about regulating sexual content, so I don't see how that is any different than regulating what else people can keep or destroy. Do you agree that the more people who come to wikipedia, the more donations there would be, and the better off it is? That the massive amounts of destruction, by elitists deletionists who consider everything fancruft and unnecessary, hurts the wikipedia? I mean, when you find an article on a bestselling novel you looked up information on deleted, wouldn't that give you a negative opinion of wikipedia? Dream Focus 17:39, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

The more mature projects are not waiting for directions from the board and, by and large, this should not be necessary. With a project of sufficient size, these things will be taken care off one way or another.

In my opinion there are other things that are more important particularly making sure that the support each and every language gets is sufficient to have viable projects. This is imho vastly more important. The fact that right to left support for languages like Arabic are no properly implemented or that the font used for Lingala is not working well. I think the board is also better positioned to stimulate cooperation with like minded organisations.

It is also important to grow our smaller projects so that they can have the same problems the English Wikipedia has.. The same problems and the same success. Thanks, GerardM 12:25, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Update

Hello Gerard, will you be so kind to update this page?Regards,--George Mel 10:57, 14 August 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Www.wikipedia.org template

Hey Gerard, changes to the project portals should be done on the /temp (ie. Www.wikipedia.org template/temp) pages first and then sync'ed. This makes sure the two pages are up-to-date and changes can be tested first on the temp page (especially when non-admins need to change something). Cbrown1023 talk 21:02, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

That is nice and non obvious. What is obvious is that there are problems with the implememtation of language codes.. this has been mentioned in a bug in bugzilla. GerardM 05:53, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Questionable edit at Public_speakers

Regarding the content of the Public_speakers page, absent a process to evaluate actual speaking engagements or the like, which I invite you to help work on at the talk page, anyone who wants to put themselves forward as a speaker should be allowed to do so without interference, within reason. This edit could be construed as a personal attack. Please don't do that, and don't edit war with others, no matter how much you may think they are not here in the best interests of the project. ++Lar: t/c 22:48, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

Also, are you really prepared to say that the contributions of everyone else on that list are universally welcomed within the WMF community? That's an awfully big word. —Random832 23:10, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

Please unblock the IP you were in a dispute with. It's obviously not Kohs, it's based in Great Britain. This kind of behaviour – for an admin – is very poor. Majorly talk 00:51, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

• The comment that Lar points out is extremely disrespectful to Wikimedia as a whole. This is our public face and should not be used to attack other users. If you have a problem with another user, please keep it out of site instead of putting it right in an area intended for the public to see. The edit was highly unprofessional and I ask that you never make such attacks again. Ottava Rima 02:35, 18 September 2009 (UTC)
  • I have started a discussion on the talk page of this page, to examine your use of administrator tools (ie. editing a protected page) to continue your revert-warring which you started prior to the page protection. Daniel (talk) 05:18, 18 September 2009 (UTC)
    • warning - If you edit war through protection again, as you did here you may find yourself blocked. Make the case at the talk page but do not edit war. As an admin at multiple projects you should know better. ++Lar: t/c 12:00, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Edited a template

Are you aware that with this edit you edited a template to add a comment? That was rather careless. An editor who is an admin on multiple projects would be expected to realise that. Or if they made a mistake, not have to rely on the good offices of someone else to clean it up. I'm suspecting that your passion in this matter is perhaps making your act rashly and without sufficient care, causing you to make simple mistakes, as well as say things that are not supportable. I note you have yet to answer why you felt it appropriate to edit through page protection. ++Lar: t/c 19:37, 20 September 2009 (UTC)

You may be surprised that I am proud to make mistakes. If anything it proves that I actually do something. When I read what you write you give the impression that this whole thing takes a lot of my attention. It does not. It is a little affair that is only relevant because it is another instance where Mr Kohs abuses the wiki. Personally I find that it has taken too much of my time already. Thanks, GerardM 21:26, 20 September 2009 (UTC)

Then you should step away entirely, because in my view it's not been a good use of your time at all and your contributions are far from constructive so far. I note you have yet to answer why you felt it appropriate to edit through page protection. ++Lar: t/c 11:54, 21 September 2009 (UTC)

The question is what is constructive. Reverting the nonsense of Mr Kohs was worthwhile. The removal is the best solution as far as I am concerned. This is in my objective a constructive aim as too much time has been wasted as a result of this gentlemen already. Thanks, GerardM 12:20, 21 September 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Localization of the Zazaki language

Hi Gerard,I am writing for the Zazaki Wiktionary project. As you told me, one of the requirements of opening a new wiki project is to translate “most-used MediaWiki messages”, “all MediaWiki messages”, and “all extensions used by Wikimedia Foundation wikis”. We have so far only translated all of the “most-used MediaWiki messages” and half of the “all MediaWiki messages” for the Zazaki language. There are thousands of messages that are not translated, and we are having a hard time to translate all. That is because special status of the Zazaki language.

Zazaki language is spoken in Turkey. Between 1923 -2003 Zazaki was banned by the government, along with the Kurdish language. Only until 2003 some of the restriction in the Turkish law removed in favor of the Zazaki and Kurdish languages. However Zazaki is still cannot be thought in schools, and it is not a formal language. That is why the Zazaki language is mostly a non-literal language. Zazaki literacy has only peaked up around late 90’s.

Because the language was forced to stay as backward as possible in the past, translating all those Wikimedia messages is very hard. Zazaki is not like Turkish, Persian, or any other state language. There is almost no computer software translated to Zazaki. Zazaki lacks words that define many of the modern-day terms. Messages translated to Zazaki also do not make that much sense to a Zazaki speaker. Most of Zaza people know Turkish and English, and they use computer programs in English or Turkish. Is it possible for us to use either Turkish or English translation for the Zazaki Wiktionary? Then we can slowly translate other messages slowly. I believe that would make much more sense for us for the Zazaki Wiktionary project. --Xoser 04:13, 27 September 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Localization of North Frisian

DONE! --Pyt 06:51, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

Determination of North Frisian:Mooringer North Frisian has frontal sch and frequently contains the character å. Other dialects have frontal sk but contain no å, â, ô, û. --Pyt 21:26, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Mail

Please don't send me mail to attack other users. Guido den Broeder 10:01, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Please read that mail again. It is not about other users, it is about your misrepresenting what is said about a given subject. Thanks, GerardM 10:37, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

I stand corrected. You attacked TWO people, both me and the other user. Don't do it again. Guido den Broeder 11:45, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

You do not stand corrected, because you are still not getting why you are wrong at what you did. GerardM 17:24, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Fiji Hindi Wiktionary Test Site

Hi

When I try to carry out any edit edit in the Hindi Wiktionary Test Site, I get the message: This wiki is closed

This is an active Wiki and I have not seen any prior proposal to close this wiki.

Can you please let me know as to what is happening?

Girmitya 12:15, 15 October 2009 (UTC) ..

this looks good to me. I am not involved in the Incubator but there is no reason to deny this project.. You do know that you will have to do the full localisation ... Thanks, GerardM 21:19, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Unlock of Kirmanjki Wiktionary project

Dear Gerard!

For reasons of time, I have neglected the Kirmanjki Wiktionary project and so it is now closed. I would like to continue the activity in this project again. Can you possibly help me here please? See also my talk on language committee. Best regards! --Mirzali 22:16, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Closure of Incubator?

This together with the blocking of Incubator pages and its new top line A proposal has been made to close this project. Please vote to close this wiki. is very alarming. --Pyt 20:44, 18 October 2009 (UTC)

Incubator will not be closed. Thanks, GerardM 06:46, 19 October 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Zazaki Wiktionary Project

Gerard, it seems like we have met all the requirements for the Zazaki Wiktionary project [4]. What is the next step and the time line? We would like to move to our new place as soon as possible. We would like to know if more needs to be done. Sooner we get our place, the better we can work. One of my partner is also wondering when this process will end. He doesn't know English. I am writing for him too. He says he has a lot of time these days and could contribute more in the new place. We also have many entries and it is becoming hard to work with prefixes (wt/diq). I look forward to hearing from you soon. Cheers. --Xoser 23:08, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

Dear Gerard,

I thank my colleagues Xosere and Aspar for their great effort, although I am not satisfied with their translations of MediaWiki messages of Zazaki in 100%, because they made many grammatical mistakes, these need to be corrected. But we will correct them gradually too.

I'm also not necessarily happy on the requested Wiktionary, because on here the two (Xosere and Aspar) act against the will of others (all other Zazas) and try to enforce the Kurdish alphabet and they are writing everything with the Kurdish alphabet. That is absolutely not acceptable and needs necessarily to be changed. Please see my arguments against!--Mirzali 20:52, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Veurblad nds-nl

Dag Gerard! Ik heb even een vraagje, op de huidige versie van Wikipedie staat op 'veurblad' van nds-nl geen kop met "Veurblad" (dat heb ik zo ingesteld) maar als ik naar Beta ga, dan staat ie daar wel (zogenaamde: heading 1). Het tabblad "artikel" op de voorpagina staat in de huidige versie van Wikipedia wel goed ingesteld als 'veurblad / vuurblad' maar op de betaversie niet. Ik heb van alles geprobeerd maar het wil niet lukken, enig idee hoe ik dit weer goed kan krijgen? 92.254.96.174 16:05, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Ik snap je vraag niet.. GerardM 16:22, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Sorry, zo duidelijker? :P 92.254.96.174 18:06, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Ik vermoed dat het in de CSS geregeld moet worden van de Vector skin. Dat is waar je grafische elementen kunt onderdrukken. GerardM 18:55, 1 November 2009 (UTC)

Ik heb Vector.css aangemaakt (gekopieerd van nl.wiki) maar dat maakt ook geen verschil verder. Heeft dat misschien ook iets met dat streepje te maken in "nds-nl" want ik zie dat fr.wiki en nl.wiki er verder geen last van hebben. Servien 10:18, 2 November 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Proposal: The general rules of language use in Wikimedia

Dear GerardM!

[I know that my English is not perfect. And I sorry for possible grammatical and stylistic errors.]

I am a professional anthropologist and at the same time, a man with considerable experience as a politician and as a party to legal conflicts. I am very interesting by those most bitter conflicts in the Wikipedia community around the creation of Wikipedia in those or other languages. This, in particular, the sharp conflicts over language: Volapük, Lombardian, Siberian, Klingon, Quenya, Toki Pona, Moldovan.

[I note that the closing pages of the Moldovan and Siberian languages was partly inspired by political motives, respectively, the representatives of Romanian and Russian languages. There is no doubt in the existence of a group of Siberian dialects of the Russian language, and there is no doubt in the existence of a formal written language, which was called "Moldovan" and was considered different from Romanian.]

I believe that decisions on these matters do not meet many of the panellists. This means that the problem of the continued functioning of languages of the Wikipedia needs more regulation. Should be introduced simple and obvious rules, which could satisfy all. Moreover, these rules should be considered obvious and fair to all members of the Wikipedia community.

These rules I have set out in the form of a few simple and universal legal norms. These rules have a few sources.

Main source: These rules follow from the main purpose of Wikipedia. The purpose of Wikipedia - creating the most complete and high quality on-line version of the encyclopedia in all languages of the Earth.

Second source: own practice of the Wikipedia community (especially the Language committee) in dealing with such issues, the presence in the practice of historical precedents.

The third source: the general universal principles of law that have proved themselves throughout the history of mankind, and which recognized the basic legal systems of almost all States, except in the most odious dictatorships. In this case there are two such universal principles:

1) A person shall not be liable for the acts of illegality which he could not have known. In particular, it should not be punished for acts which at the time they were committed were not illegal.

2) If people are free to enjoy certain rights, these rights they can not be taken away or limited. This is a very important universal principle, which dictates the obvious solution of a number of the most violent conflicts in the Wikipedia community.

Based on this latter principle, those languages that already have existing Wikipedia pages, or who have already obtained the right to create such pages in the wiki-Incubator, in any case can not be denied the right to own Wikipedia.

Because of this legal principle should be necessary to reopen the languages of the Wikipedia: Klingon, Toki Pona, Moldovan and Siberian.

On the other hand, these Wikipedias have been closed due to fair and honest reasons. So we must not allow the emergence of similar pages in the future. For this purpose, and should be taken these guidelines.

The general rules of language use in Wikimedia

A. Rules of use of existing languages in Wikimedia

1) Any language of Wikimedia may not be removed from it.

2) Administrators of each active Wikipedia in any language are obliged to care about the quality of Wikipedia articles. In particular, there is considered unacceptable the bot-creation of the main part of Wikipedia articles in any language.

In case of serious doubt as Wikipedia in this language guide Wikimedia Foundation may require the removal of all articles that have been bot-uploaded.

3) If necessary, bad-quality Wikimedia to correct the deficiencies can be returned to the Wiki-incubator.

4) In case if the language is used in two or more writing systems, separate sections for each type of writing is not created. Instead, is necessary to create a program that can translate the contents of any article on this language from one writing system into another.

We are welcoming the creation for any language of Wikipedia, program that gives the contents of articles into the International Phonetic Alphabet, as well as program that translates into the Latin transcription of the contents of articles in those languages, which made other writing systems.

B. Rules for the establishment of Wikipedia and Wiki-Incubator for new languages

1) In the Wikipedia and Wiki-incubator can be created sections in any native (living or dead) language, having the code ISO 639-3.

2) In the Wikipedia can be created partitions on any living language, not having the code ISO 639-3, if it satisfies the following conditions:

a) there are people for whom this language is native;

b) these language has a literature and electronic sites;

c) there is a scientific description of the language: its vocabulary and grammar;

d) The Wikipedia has pages devoted to this language in English and at least three other languages.

3) In the Wikipedia can be created sections on any recently extinct language, not having the code ISO 639-3, if it satisfies the following conditions:

a) The language died out not earlier than 1850;

b) there is a tutorial of the language;

c) these language has a literature and electronic sites;

d) there is the scientific description of the language: its vocabulary and grammar;

e) The Wikipedia has pages devoted to this language in English and at least three other languages.

4) In the Wikipedia can be created partitions on any dead language, not having the code ISO 639-3, if it satisfies the following conditions:

a) in that language existed and survived to the present day own rich literature;

b) there is a tutorial of the language;

c) these language has a modern literature and electronic sites;

d) there is the scientific description of the language: its vocabulary and grammar;

e) The Wikipedia has pages devoted to this language in English and at least three other languages.

5) All the languages that do not meet the criteria set out in paragraphs 1), 2), 3) and 4), are considered to be artificial.

In Wikipedia, there are sections of the following artificial (constructed) languages: Esperanto, Simple English, Ido, Novial, Intelingua, Interlingue (Occidental), Volapük, Lojban, Quenya, Klingon, Siberian, Toki Pona, and Lingua Franca Nova.

In the Wikipedia is not possible to create partitions on any other artificial languages.

As an exception, the decision to establish a section of Wikipedia in any other artificial language can be accepted by Wikimedia Board of Trustees. In this case the language must meet all the requirements of paragraph 4) for the dead languages and have code ISO 639-3 and a level of development and popularity of not less than the Quenya in 2009.

6) If a native language has the code ISO 639-3, but does not satisfy the conditions about 2) or 3) or 4), proposal of this language can be rejected.

I believe that the adoption of these rules will remove all the stress and all the discussions around the language policy of Wikipedia.

Best Regards,

Ihor Rassokha, Ukraine

[edit] validation criteria of a project in incubation

At what rate translation project in incubation (incubator, wikisource or betawikiversity) can claim to be observed and followed with interest by the commitees. It would also be interesting to know the rate of monthly contributions is the second criteria. Does this rate may be added in terms of indication of maturity of a project ? Crochet.david 17:11, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

Personally I start looking at the content of projects once they have achieved the threshold for localisation. Often people signal when their localisation is done. Typically I am likely to notice when I do my monthly localisation updates on Wikipedias.

The prodding is welcomed. GerardM 17:19, 12 November 2009 (UTC)

more than 80 % of "Extensions used by Wikimedia message" translated since 5 months and 5 monthly actives contributors since 5 months are a good starting to allow comittee to be noted with interest an incubating project ? Crochet.david 17:15, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

The activity is recongised by the tool of Pathoschild. The point is that there is enough to start with, the localisation should be done and there is a start of a community.. Thanks, ~~

[edit] Recent coments

Hi Gerard,

I have seen it before and noticed it today again but I would like to ask you to not place comments like no anonymous cowards since Wikimedia and Wikipedia are based on the believe that everybody can edit it.

You protect a page with this comment so you believe that every ip that edits is a coward? I would like to say that there are people working as ip that do more and better work than you or me.

Could you please use more agf comments in the future?

Best regards, Huib talk 10:52, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

I am involved in the language politics. I have found that most of the destructive comments are from anonymous cowards. Most of their remarks are damaging. Given that the languages policy asks people for their support, we require users to commit themselves. Your point is correct in many instances. It is not for things that have to deal with new languages and with the deletion of languages.

I do not consider anonymous requests to me personally as relevant. Also I disagree that there are ips that do a better job. Thanks, GerardM 10:58, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Public speakers

Gerard, please stop editwarring on Public speakers. Of the users that showed up on talk, you are the only one who wants the page look like that. Guido den Broeder 14:11, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

This is a formal warning, GerardM. You should know better. Stop edit warring over this. Majorly talk 14:38, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

That is actually not the case. There are more people who have objected. This is only conveniently forgotten.. GerardM 16:41, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

For what it's worth: as Mr. Den Broeder very well knows Gerard is right here: he was certainly not the only one who objected. Wutsje 16:49, 30 November 2009 (UTC)