IRC office hours/Office hours 2010-11-05
[18:01] <@Jamesofur> awesome looks like we have everyone here
[18:01] <guillom> Philippe, don't make me regret the fact I didn't follow up on lustre 's line :P
[18:01] <Brian_S> Hi zackexley
[18:01] <zackexley> Hi
[18:02] <@Jamesofur> Thanks for coming, we have most of the fundraising team here to help answer questions but are going to start off with Philippe with some intro remarks that may answer some of them right off. We're going to run this as an open meeting so please feel free to ask questions directly into the channel
[18:02] <@Jamesofur> if you think it is going to get lost you can send me a private message and I'll keep track as well
[18:02] * kylu[afk] (~m3w@wikimedia/Kylu) has joined #wikimedia-office
[18:02] <@Philippe> Thanks, James... :)
[18:02] <@Philippe> Hi everyone! Thanks for being here today. Most of you know me – I’m Head of Reader Relations for the Wikimedia Foundation, but I’m serving in a second position during this fundraising cycle: I’m heading up the annual fundraising campaign.
[18:02] <@Philippe> I’m honored to be doing it, and having a ball.
[18:03] <@Philippe> Zack Exley, the Chief Community Officer and I have put together a team of of really committed people who are all committed to maximizing the potential of this year’s fundraiser so that the chapters and the Foundation are able to meet their mission.
[18:03] <@Philippe> I sent out a memo to the community yesterday, which you can read at http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fundraising_2010/Updates. Just for general overview though, our target this year for the fundraiser is $16Million.
[18:04] <ipatrol> a ball, or two? ;-P
[18:04] <@Philippe> We will put up banners on Friday, November 12th and do a full scale functional test over the weekend and then officially announce and kick off the fundraiser on Nov 15th.
[18:04] <@Philippe> With that done, I’d like to begin by inviting your questions, but I want to say that I’m going to ask that you restrict questions to things about the actual operation of the fundraiser.
[18:04] <@Philippe> That is, I’m the wrong person to talk about the budget, or how the money is being spent: my job is to facilitate the massive group of people inside and outside of the community who raise the money. So if it’s not a question about raising money, I’m going to defer the question.
[18:04] <@Philippe> OK? :)
[18:05] <bodnotbod> QUESTION: $16m? I thought the WMF had spending commitments of c.$20m for 2011?
[18:05] * zakg is now known as zakg|away
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[18:05] <harej> I request $100,000 for the creation of a Wikimedia District of Columbia, Incorporated
[18:05] <ipatrol> so you're like the tax collectors?
[18:05] <@Philippe> That's right, bodnotbod ... we get a certain amount of funding from outside this event...
[18:05] <@Philippe> for instance, from major donors or foundations. :)
[18:05] <bodnotbod> OK, thanks Philippe.
[18:05] <lustre> Which banners/landing pages will be used, if that has been decided already?
[18:05] <@Philippe> No problem, and good to see you. :)
[18:06] <ipatrol> I ssy the USA needsa national chapter
[18:06] <derp> Canada too
[18:06] <@Philippe> lustre: Great question... we're in the process of testing landing pages and banners as you may know...
[18:06] <harej> the USA is too large for a national chapter.
[18:06] <harej> Canada is WAY too large for a national chapter.
[18:06] <@Philippe> we're going to begin with an appeal from Jimmy Wales, and we're testing all the various variables right now.
[18:06] <derp> harej, look at Ottawa
[18:06] <derp> :P
[18:06] <Theo10011> lol
[18:06] <harej> A District of Columbia chapter would be able to dedicate its scope to the various opportunities present by the beautifully unique District of Columbia.
[18:06] <ipatrol> the USSR way to HUEG for a national chapter
[18:06] <@Philippe> But we have a pretty good idea how it will look.
[18:06] <@Philippe> In USSR, Fundraiser watch you.
[18:07] <derp> harej, i was born in DC
[18:07] <derp> :)
[18:07] <@Jamesofur> oh no he went there
[18:07] <harej> So was my dad!
[18:07] * @Philippe once visited DC
[18:07] <ipatrol> black and white and read all over? X-P
[18:07] * Jyothis (Jyothis@wikipedia/Jyothis) has joined #wikimedia-office
[18:07] <@Philippe> So without going down that particular rabbit hole... any other questions? :)
[18:07] <killiondude> I could get more info from emailing people than by reading these office hours logs. :(
[18:07] <@Philippe> Good, let's all go home. See ya!
[18:08] <lustre> That was it?
[18:08] <ipatrol> what about a groundhog hole?
[18:08] <@Philippe> No
[18:08] <@Philippe> you're right
[18:08] <@Philippe> I left the groundhog hole out.
[18:08] <@Philippe> If I could, I’d like to call your attention to a group of really wonderful people, who are staffing this fundraiser. Rather than take the time to have them introduce themselves, I’m going to just give you their names and what they’re working on…. These are a mix of full-time and temporary staff, and contractors.
[18:08] <@Philippe> Megan is in charge of all of our testing and in charge of banners and landing pages. She’s the detail person, and joined us almost exactly a year ago. She’s also our only full time staff member. Working on payment processing and administration is Molly. James and Alex are responsible for the execution of banners and the campaigns.
[18:08] <Shirley> You're just pasting?
[18:09] <@Philippe> Heck yes.
[18:09] <DenizG> he's a really fast typer
[18:09] <ChristineM> BUSTED!
[18:09] <@Philippe> I paste some :)
[18:09] * harej appoints Shirley as Deputy Chairman of Wikimedia District of Columbia, Incorporated.
[18:09] <Shirley> The apostrophes give it away.
[18:09] <@Philippe> we call it "preparing"
[18:09] <ipatrol> if we're hiring contractors, what about expanders?
[18:09] <Shirley> I call it spam.
[18:09] <@Jamesofur> well to be fair no one is asking questions
[18:09] <Shirley> Spam is off-topic on freenode.
[18:09] <Theo10011> go ahead introduce the rest of the band......
[18:09] <lustre> How did people get hired?
[18:09] <@Philippe> Deniz handles communications and creative . Kelly, Keegan and Sam are focused on outreach to our 600 wikis and making sure they all know about the fundraiser and our donor contact through email. Theo is also doing outreach, but specifically to Indian languages and wikis.
[18:09] <ipatrol> do you need a drummer too?
[18:10] <@Philippe> Yes.
[18:10] <bodnotbod> It's hardly spam. And it gives people a chance to think of questions. I would ask some but I'm figuring the answers are already on the wiki.
[18:10] <@Philippe> Ryan is our data guy – he tracks all of our numbers and performance metrics. Moushira is in charge of global campaigns, meaning she works closely with chapters. Steven and Peter execute our email campaign, though Steven is technically part of our major gifts group. Dan is working specifically on outreach to the English Wikipedia, and coordinating the contribution team there.
[18:10] <ipatrol> it's canned ham
[18:10] <@Philippe> This group of people have worked together with several hundred community members who have submitted banners, worked on testing protocols, and helped with analysis, localization, and all of the huge number of details that it takes to run a fundraiser of the size and scope of this one.
[18:10] <killiondude> I was spammed on otrs-en-l yesterday.
[18:10] <killiondude> I've come to expect this.
[18:10] <BloodRedSandman> There has been *searches for careful term* tensions in non-Wikipedia communties when fundraising banners came up declaring everything to be in the name of 'Wikipedia'. What measures are in place to avoid that this year?
[18:10] <ipatrol> *viking chorus*
[18:11] <@Philippe> Several of these people came to us through the community call. :) Others were people we hired on a temporary basis through a service.
[18:11] * Risker doesn't mind spam if it is informative spam. Wonders what was said on internal-L that wasn't considered relevant for community consumption, though.
[18:11] <killiondude> [15:08:06] <killiondude> I could get more info from emailing people than by reading these office hours logs. :(
[18:11] <Theo10011> Hey Risker
[18:11] <killiondude> whoops.
[18:11] <harej> Risker can be the Canadian Liaison to the Wikimedia District of Columbia, Incorporated.
[18:11] <@Philippe> BRS - you're talking about "Wikipedia Forever", I suppose.
[18:11] <killiondude> [15:05:29] <bodnotbod> QUESTION: $16m? I thought the WMF had spending commitments of c.$20m for 2011?
[18:12] <BloodRedSandman> etc, Philippe
[18:12] <@Philippe> This year we're working very very hard to keep the project specific identities
[18:12] <ipatrol> wait, we're supposed to eat it?
[18:12] <@Philippe> killiondude: we already did that one.
[18:12] <@Jamesofur> Risker: It was just instructions about the landing pages which she was asking about
[18:12] <BloodRedSandman> what i wanted to hear :)
[18:12] <Abbasjnr> So aare all members of the Fundraiser staff based in SF or are some working remotely?
[18:12] <@Philippe> Risker, nothing that wasn't relevant, just instructions on naming convention for landing pages, stuff like that.
[18:12] <killiondude> Can someone PM me the answer? I don't see it
[18:12] <@Philippe> Abbasjnr: a mixture of remote and local
[18:12] <@Jamesofur> on it's way killiondude
[18:12] <Abbasjnr> ok
[18:12] <derp> why did the WMF foundation open a office in india
[18:12] <Risker> Philippe, fair enough. Makes sense for that information to not be spammed to Foundation-L :)
[18:13] <ipatrol> and some quantum?
[18:13] * sma (~email@example.com) has joined #wikimedia-office
[18:13] <@Philippe> derp - I'm here to talk about the fundraiser. Stuff like that is outside my purview. :) Sue will be back in a few weeks and that's a good one to ask her
[18:13] <@Philippe> Although you could check the old office hours logs
[18:13] <derp> ah ok
[18:13] <Abbasjnr> And was the hiring advertised or an internal matter?
[18:13] <lustre> How is the social media and other outreach things going?
[18:13] <@Philippe> I know she's addressed it.
[18:13] <@Philippe> Abbasjnr: The hiring came from the "WORK AT WIKIMEDIA" banner for the international folks :)
[18:13] <ipatrol> purrrrrview? =^_^=
[18:14] <@Philippe> lustre: really really well, thank you!
[18:14] <Theo10011> thats where I saw it
[18:14] <Abbasjnr> OK
[18:14] <Theo10011> it was an open community call Abbas
[18:14] <DenizG> lustre: social media is going well, we're putting together a sm team currently
[18:14] <@Philippe> We've reached out to every wiki community by now, and also engaged a huge number of them in localization efforts.
[18:14] <@Philippe> Our social media team is working hard to get things in place for that end
[18:14] <lustre> Will that launch on the same day as banners, DenizG, and how long will it last?
[18:14] <DenizG> if anyone is interested in more information or signing up, do contact me
[18:14] <ipatrol> and as for FR?
[18:14] <@Philippe> And the "contributions committee" on the English wikipedia is getting up and going now.
[18:15] <ipatrol> wtf?
[18:15] <SWATJester> For that, you can sign up at Wikipedia:Contribution
[18:15] <harej> Serious question: How much financial support could I expect for a regional chapter?
[18:15] <DenizG> lustre: Yes, our SM will launch on the 15th along with the rest of the campaign, and continue through the entire duration of the fundraiser
[18:15] <ipatrol> I thought we *all* were one
[18:15] <Theo10011> It will run through out the fundraiser atleast lustre
[18:15] <lustre> thanks
[18:15] <@Philippe> So I'm really pleased with that aspect of what we're doing.
[18:15] <DenizG> We're going to be working hard to promote the anniversary as well
[18:16] <bodnotbod> Ooh, I forgot about the anniversary.
[18:16] <@Philippe> Next? :)
[18:16] <lustre> SWATJester: Do I just add my name at that page?
[18:16] <Theo10011> the big Xth
[18:16] <DenizG> how could you forget bodnotbod?!
[18:16] <bodnotbod> Very remiss of me :O)
[18:16] <@Philippe> harej: I honestly wouldn't know.
[18:16] <Theo10011> Wikipedia becomes a teenager like GerardM said
[18:17] <DenizG> lustre, yes add your name to that list
[18:17] <lustre> ok
[18:17] <DenizG> I think 10 is 'tween'
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[18:17] * AlexZ_ (~1568@wikimedia/Az1568) Quit (Disconnected by services)
[18:17] <@Jamesofur> anyone have more questions that have popped up? We're speeding through quickly :)
[18:17] <ChristineM> yeah it is
[18:17] * ipatrol pops open a champagne bottle
[18:17] * Az1568 is now known as AlexZ_
[18:17] <@Jamesofur> 'doublt digits'
[18:17] <ChristineM> it's looking at posters of Justin Bieber and sighing
[18:17] <@Philippe> i can haz, ipatrol
[18:17] <@Philippe> ?
[18:17] <DenizG> Yes, I hope you're sharing
[18:17] <@Jamesofur> ChristineM: That was uncalled for!
[18:17] <@Philippe> lol
[18:18] <@Jamesofur> but yes let's share the champagne
[18:18] <Theo10011> should we expect mood swings
[18:18] <ChristineM> isn't that what tweens are doing these days?
[18:18] <Theo10011> possible awkward phase
[18:18] <@Philippe> mood swings? or WIKI? :P
[18:18] * Az1568 (~firstname.lastname@example.org) has joined #wikimedia-office
[18:18] <bodnotbod> QUESTION: (but only since there's no competition) - can you remind me when the fundraiser is scheduled to finish?
[18:18] <@Philippe> on WIKI, i mean?
[18:18] <BloodRedSandman> WP is into Bieber?
[18:18] * BloodRedSandman resigns adminship
[18:18] <DenizG> lol
[18:18] <Theo10011> lol
[18:18] <lustre> Who's not into Bieber?
[18:18] <AlexZ_> haha
[18:18] <Theo10011> ahh....me
[18:18] <@Jamesofur> no we never have those Philippe. Get with the message.
[18:18] <@Philippe> bodnotbod: we're going to stop asking for money around the point at which we make the $16M
[18:18] <DenizG> BloodRedSandman: you have the entire room cracking up
[18:19] <@Philippe> We'll switch to banners encouraging people to make their first contribution
[18:19] <@Philippe> We know that with almost 400 Million Unique Visitors per month, tons of people have never done a single one.
[18:19] * privatemusings (~chatzilla@unaffiliated/privatemusings) has joined #wikimedia-office
[18:19] <Theo10011> absolutely
[18:19] <Theo10011> time to get 'em
[18:19] <bodnotbod> Thanks Philippe. Glad I asked now! I thought there was a set date.
[18:19] <Theo10011> contributing
[18:19] <@Philippe> bodnotbod: our goal is to be done before Jan 15th :)
[18:19] <@Philippe> but we'll see :)
[18:20] <@Philippe> Depends on how much you give. Yes you.
[18:20] <killiondude> Only you can prevent forest fires.
[18:20] <DenizG> You, personally
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[18:20] <@Philippe> well, you and killiondude
[18:20] <Theo10011> we're looking at all of you
[18:20] <lustre> i've never prevented a forest fire
[18:20] <@Philippe> I believe that.
[18:20] <killiondude> QUESTION: Who has prior fundraising experience that is being staffed particularly for the fundraiser?
[18:20] <bodnotbod> I might order some Pedia Press stuff for Christmas. Actually, I'd better do it soon if I'm going to do it...
[18:21] <@Philippe> killiondude: I do. As does Zack, and Peter. Kelly, and Deniz.
[18:21] <@Philippe> Megan.
[18:21] <@Philippe> :)
[18:21] <mhernandez_> yep, I was around last year
[18:21] <DenizG> Specifically nonprofit fundraising
[18:21] <Theo10011> I donated last year if it counts
[18:21] <DenizG> I helped out with social media for us last year as well
[18:21] <mhernandez_> have also done some fundraising for a couple other non-profits in the past
[18:22] <SWATJester> I've done fundraising with nonprofits in the past as well too.
[18:22] <@Philippe> And Dan :)
[18:22] <Abbasjnr> Basing on previous fundraisers, which country/region/continent contributes the most amount of funds?
[18:22] <@Philippe> (Dan passed the bar!)
[18:22] <killiondude> Dan's employeed for the fundraiser?
[18:22] <Theo10011> US by a large margin Abbas
[18:22] <@Philippe> killiondude: you didn't read my pastes :P
[18:22] <killiondude> How silly of me.
[18:22] <@Philippe> Abbasjnr: Theo's right... it's North America, particularly the US
[18:22] <Theo10011> then europe
[18:22] <Abbasjnr> OK
[18:22] <@Philippe> Although Europe is very close as well.
[18:23] <privatemusings> I wanted to ask a rather basic question that I think is probably covered elsewhere :-)
[18:23] <Abbasjnr> Canada?
[18:23] <privatemusings> are the chapters' agreements (in terms of how money is raised / shared etc.) public? - I couldn't find them!
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[18:23] <ipatrol> and then the world, MUAHAHAHAHA
[18:23] <@Philippe> privatemusings: the chapter's agreements don't contain that info.
[18:23] * BloodRedSandman would be interested to see funds contributed relative to population for various countries, but that's wishful thinking
[18:23] <@Philippe> There aren't particular targets like that :)
[18:23] <Theo10011> canada at #4 I believe
[18:24] <Theo10011> behind UK
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[18:24] <privatemusings> could you explain simply how the chapter donation thing works (for fools like me) :-)
[18:24] <ipatrol> if we have chapters, why not volumes? we are an encyclopedia after all
[18:24] <@Philippe> I'll give it a shot...
[18:24] * aude_ (a452550f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.8.131.52) has joined #wikimedia-office
[18:24] <privatemusings> thanks!
[18:24] <bodnotbod> Why don't we tell India that unless they give us $16m we won't give them an office? I think that kills pretty much every single bird with one stone, and I commend this proposal to the channel.
[18:24] <ipatrol> coercion?
[18:25] <@Philippe> Chapters help to raise money in their geographic areas. In some cases they are able to actually collect money themselves, and remit part of that to the Foundation to support global wrork
[18:25] <ipatrol> and you expect to draw flies that way?
[18:25] <brianmc-phone> This looks like a fun discussion....
[18:25] <bodnotbod> That's an unpleasant word, ipatrol.
[18:25] <BloodRedSandman> When you've got them by the balls their hearts and minds soon come round...
[18:25] <@Philippe> In other cases, the Foundation collects the money and provides it to chapters in the form of grants.
[18:25] <@Philippe> Does that make sense, privatemusings?
[18:25] <privatemusings> could you confirm which chapters have the agreement of the foundation to raise money themselves through the foundation fundraiser?
[18:25] <privatemusings> and yeah - it certainly does :-)
[18:26] <@Philippe> No, because the contracts are still being signed.
[18:26] <ipatrol> FFS, call a spade a spade
[18:26] <privatemusings> ah - gotcha :-)
[18:26] <@Philippe> I don't have that information, I'm sorry.
[18:26] <privatemusings> when will that be finalised? - presumably pretty bloomin soon?
[18:26] <@Philippe> Well, I hope so :)
[18:26] <@Philippe> It would make me happy. :)
[18:26] <bodnotbod> (It was just a joke, Ipatrol)
[18:26] <privatemusings> do you have any idea why the delay - is it a bit last minute?
[18:26] <@Philippe> privatemusings: that's not something I'm directly involved in, I'm sorry
[18:26] <@Philippe> That is being managed by Barry Newstead
[18:27] <privatemusings> no worries - thanks for the info :-)
[18:27] <@Philippe> So I just don't know the answer.
[18:27] <brianmc-phone> Phillipe knows I've basically ony one question/challenge.
[18:27] <brianmc-phone> The one that saw me withdraw from ComCom....
[18:27] <ipatrol> in soviet russia, chapter reads YOU
[18:27] <@Philippe> brianmc-phone: ?
[18:27] <bodnotbod> Brian has us all on the edge of our seats...
[18:28] <lustre> Do we have to go into this again?
[18:28] * Abbasjnr (295a86a3@gateway/web/freenode/ip.184.108.40.206) has left #wikimedia-office
[18:28] * @Philippe (~Philippe@wikimedia/Philippe) Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[18:28] <DenizG> Philippe was disconnected, he shall return shortly
[18:28] * Philippe (~Philippe@220.127.116.11) has joined #wikimedia-office
[18:28] <killiondude> philippe got upset.
[18:28] * Philippe (~Philippe@18.104.22.168) Quit (Changing host)
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[18:28] <DenizG> and he's back
[18:28] <Philippe> sorry, wifi fail
[18:28] <brianmc-phone> Oh, the question is simple: Are you going to splatter idiocy like "Wikipedia Forever" over sister projects for the third year in a row?
[18:29] <Philippe> killiondude: ragequit
[18:29] * aude (~firstname.lastname@example.org) Quit (Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi)
[18:29] <privatemusings> heh... I can answer that one!
[18:29] <privatemusings> 'yes' :-)
[18:29] <Philippe> brianmc-phone: I believe I already answered that :)
[18:29] <Theo10011> No
[18:29] <killiondude> brianmc-phone, this is the fundraiser *you* can edit!
[18:29] * Philippe (~Philippe@wikimedia/Philippe) Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
[18:29] * BloodRedSandman asked before Brian arrived
[18:29] <lustre> fail.
[18:29] <@Jamesofur> we actually just talked about that earlier brianmc-phone
[18:29] * harej edits the numbers in the bank account.
[18:29] * ipatrol edits your facre
[18:29] <BloodRedSandman> apparently, not this year
[18:29] * Philippe (~Philippe@wikimedia/Philippe) has joined #wikimedia-office
[18:29] <ipatrol> *face
[18:29] <lustre> lol
[18:29] <@Jamesofur> (sorry Philippe is having wifi issues)
[18:29] <Philippe> Sorry about that.
[18:29] <Philippe> stupid wifi
[18:29] <killiondude> If anyone has a link to the banners from last year, I would be most appreciative. For old time's sake!
[18:30] <Philippe> So no, Brian, the fundraising team committed to not doing that.
[18:30] <lustre> the beta new features link is still splattered with apparent idiocy
[18:30] <ipatrol> in soviet mrussia, wiki edits YOU
[18:30] <lustre> killiondude: WIKIPEDIA FOREVER
[18:30] <lustre> and meta:special:centralnotice
[18:30] <Philippe> We are doing banners that specifically do not reference particular projects.
[18:30] <Philippe> It was one of our design requirements early on.
[18:30] <ipatrol> (or at least until the heat death of the universe
[18:31] <lustre> Philippe, how is the geolocation thing going? Are we using that?
[18:31] <brianmc-phone> At least there's a degree of humour around it this year...
[18:31] <BloodRedSandman> So now it's WIKIMEDIA FOREVER, Phlippe? :p
[18:31] <Philippe> lustre: Geolocation.... we're really thrilled, actually!
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[18:31] <Philippe> We've got it working and tested... Tomasz and his team did an amazing job on that.
[18:31] <BloodRedSandman> *Philippe
[18:31] <Philippe> BRS FOREVER
[18:32] <lustre> ok
[18:32] <lustre> http://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:NoticeTemplate/view&template=2009_Notice12
[18:32] <@Jamesofur> brianmc-phone: We have also been making decisions on what to run based on the actual tests, and really only on that data. We aren't going to run something just because we think it is going to do the best.
[18:32] <Philippe> Does everyone know what geolocation does?
[18:32] <lustre> I like that one
[18:32] <ipatrol> BRAS 4EVAH
[18:32] <Philippe> it's cool technology, actually
[18:32] <Theo10011> and works great
[18:32] <brianmc-phone> Spying on where people edit from :p
[18:32] <Philippe> We can target particular countries with banners, and serve particular landing pages based on their location
[18:33] <privatemusings> can you say which locations that will apply to?
[18:33] <Philippe> So people in, for instance, Canada, can get banners that end with ",eh?" in a funny accent :)
[18:33] <privatemusings> presumably australia (my interest) - for example
[18:33] <BloodRedSandman> $£€ FOREVER
[18:33] <Theo10011> bawdy mate
[18:33] <ipatrol> UR MUM FREVER
[18:33] <DenizG> We can geolocate to every country
[18:34] <Philippe> privatemusings: If you're in a country where there's a chapter, you'll be taken to a landing page that includes that chapter's work, if they set it up :)
[18:34] <ipatrol> and ur mum
[18:34] <DenizG> Just not sub-nationally
[18:34] <Philippe> I know WM-au is working on it already
[18:34] <killiondude> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Fundraising doesn't have a link to an FAQ specifically for the fundraiser.
[18:34] <privatemusings> yup
[18:34] <@Jamesofur> we have the option to do it for any country but will only do it where we have something specific to change (different ask string, the chapters etc)
[18:34] <killiondude> I would suggest one.
[18:34] <Philippe> killiondude: yeah, that's being developed. I saw the text for it yesterday
[18:35] <Philippe> Thanks :)
[18:35] <privatemusings> and the individual contracts that chapters sign aren't within your purview?
[18:35] <privatemusings> (just reiterating....)
[18:35] <Philippe> privatemusings: no. :) I'm a fundraiser, not a contracts guy.
[18:35] <brianmc-phone> As long as I don't have to post "cultural insensitivity messages on nWN's main talk again,...
[18:35] <privatemusings> but the chapter will get a pretty free reign in the layout / appearance of said 'landing page', right?
[18:35] * Risker trouts Philippe for the "eh" comment
[18:35] * aude_ is now known as aude
[18:35] <ipatrol> wikimedia, eh?
[18:36] <Philippe> privatemusings: it depends on which type of chapter they are. Some chapters, which collect donations online on their own, will have their own landing pages which they design and control.
[18:36] <Philippe> For those who do not, or have some other impediment to that, we design the page, and they control a particular area of it. :)
[18:36] <privatemusings> do you know which chapters fall into which categories?
[18:36] <Philippe> But we don't restrict what they do or say with it.
[18:36] <lustre> Can we make the banners prettier?
[18:36] <privatemusings> it'd be cool to see which chapters are doing what etc. :-)
[18:36] <lustre> Like the creative commons campaign
[18:37] <DenizG> lustre: we're doing just that right now
[18:37] <killiondude> Steve mentioned last office hours that he'd create a page to list suggested topics for upcoming office hours. Was that ever done?
[18:37] <Philippe> privatemusings: once that's finalized, I think we could get that public.
[18:37] <DenizG> I'm working with a designer to develop better graphic banners
[18:37] <Philippe> killiondude: I don't know, but I'll ask him:)
[18:37] <privatemusings> sounds like there's a fair bit to finalise :-)
[18:37] <DenizG> but we are also asking the community to take a swing at designing them
[18:37] <Philippe> privatemusings: that's related to the chapters agreement :)
[18:38] <DenizG> http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fundraising_2010/TwoAsks/GraphicBanners
[18:38] * Philippe listens to mouse clicks
[18:38] <Chzz> out-of-nowhere-comment: The word 'Chapter' has connotations w/ Hell's Angels here in UK... dunno if it does in USA. That's what I always think of when I hear the word 'Chapter' in this context.
[18:38] <Philippe> Chzz: Interesting!
[18:39] <Philippe> I had no idea.
[18:39] <DenizG> Our chapters are just as tough and rowdy
[18:39] <privatemusings> if we've got a spare sec. would you take a kinda awkward question, philippe? - about that Q2 thing?
[18:39] <Philippe> (I once knew a lady who was the lawyer for the Banditos.)
[18:39] <Philippe> yeah. A lawyer.
[18:39] <privatemusings> I'm just wondering if you had the chance to put anything on the record at all?
[18:39] <Chzz> I suspect our hazing is more harsh, too
[18:39] <Theo10011> no and Hell's angel are an american organization
[18:39] <Philippe> privatemusings: I'd be happy to talk to you about it later, but not during this one... i've asked that the questions be restricted to the fundraiser
[18:39] <privatemusings> no worries
[18:39] <Philippe> thanks :)
[18:39] <privatemusings> (or hells angels, presumably) ;-)
[18:40] <Philippe> Theo10011: they're international :)
[18:40] <bodnotbod> I'm in the UK and don't tend to think of Hell's Angels. I think of Warhammer 40k. I don't even like Warhammer.
[18:40] <Chzz> It's just the only context I think I have ever heard the word 'Chapter' meaning a sub-group thingy, is all
[18:40] <SWATJester> i think of fraternities
[18:40] <Theo10011> I thought they were founded and based out of cali
[18:40] <BloodRedSandman> Getting local project logos etc into the banners would be even better, but I'm glad at least if we don't have to repeat Godwin parachuting in to yell at people striving to fix the damage of Wikipedia Forever on hard-battled-for local identity
[18:40] <ChristineM> a lot of orgs have chapters
[18:40] <Theo10011> ya warhammer 40k
[18:40] <Philippe> Well, I'd pay a dollar to see Godwin parachute :)
[18:40] <ChristineM> American Red Cross, fraternal organizations, etc.
[18:41] * BloodRedSandman didn't think Hells Angels but prolly will now, Chzz
[18:41] <DenizG> I'd pay 10
[18:41] <@Jamesofur> I'd pay more then $1.
[18:41] <Philippe> But as for logos in banners, we now (thanks to some updates to centralnotice) could actually do that too.
[18:41] <brianmc-phone> 'Chapters', as in chapter and verse. Probably something to do with revelations.
[18:41] <ipatrol> I still say we should group our chapters into volumes
[18:41] <Philippe> Tomasz's team did some HUGE improvements to the centralnotice tool. It's really cool.
[18:41] <killiondude> @.@
[18:41] <bodnotbod> I'll donate $30 if Godwin dresses up as Hitler and poses for a picture of him posting on an internet forum.
[18:42] * BloodRedSandman would like that, Philippe.
[18:42] <Philippe> Megan, have we tested logos in banners?
[18:42] * BloodRedSandman promises to match bodnotbod
[18:42] <Chzz> ooh, can I start up the Eastwood, Nottinghamshire chapter, and put "This chapter intentionally left blank"
[18:42] <@Jamesofur> It really is Everyone who sees Kaldari should give him big virtual (or real) hugs for his work on Central Notice and on the landing page geolocation system
[18:42] <BloodRedSandman> (in Zimbabwean dollars)
[18:42] <mhernandez_> we haven't tested logos in the banners this year
[18:42] <Philippe> But we did test graphical versus text... it's really interesting.
[18:43] <mhernandez_> I know we used them in past years though
[18:43] <Philippe> Graphical banners perform significantly better.
[18:43] <Theo10011> and Graphics performed better
[18:43] <Theo10011> ya
[18:43] <DenizG> like, 100% better
[18:43] <@Jamesofur> yea so far the graphical Jimmy banner has been 2-300%+ better on all projects
[18:43] <Theo10011> Now you see Jimmy staring back at you to donate
[18:43] <Philippe> But those are limited duration tests :)
[18:43] <Philippe> We can't count on that to scale for 24 hours a day every day :0
[18:43] <delphine> wow, what pic of Jimmy is that?
[18:44] <delphine> not the one with the crazy eyes, is it?
[18:44] <bodnotbod> Hmmm... I'm not sure I hold out huge hope that the community will produce good graphical banners by the time the fundraiser starts.
[18:44] <@Jamesofur> aye Philippe is right scaleing is an issue we don't know about yet
[18:44] <DenizG> bodnotbod: we can accept banners throughout the duration of the fundraiser
[18:44] <ipatrol> I for North America, II for Western Europe, III for South and Latin America, IV for East Asia, V for India, southwest Asia, and the Middle East, VI for Africa, and VII for Australia and the Pacific
[18:44] <Philippe> James, do we have a graphic somewhere online that's easily linkable to show delphine?
[18:44] <mhernandez_> we'll also continue testing new banner ideas even after the fundraiser launches
[18:44] <@Jamesofur> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page?banner=2010_testing50
[18:45] <@Jamesofur> Philippe: The jimmy banner? ^^
[18:45] <Philippe> that's it, thanks
[18:45] <Philippe> delphine: that's the one
[18:45] <delphine> ok, that's a nice one
[18:45] <@Jamesofur> That has been our winner for a while so far
[18:45] <delphine> no crazy eyes
[18:45] <delphine> I find the black a bit sad though :(
[18:45] <Philippe> Well, we aim to please :)
[18:45] <Philippe> delphine: we're experimenting with some other colors
[18:45] <ipatrol> Oh, forgot VIII for Eastern Europe and Russia
[18:45] <Philippe> We just haven't gotten there yet.
[18:45] <privatemusings> will there be any linkage to the videos as part of the fundraiser?
[18:45] <delphine> I seriously thought for a split second that we were announciung Jimmy's death or something
[18:46] <privatemusings> (seeing delphine in here reminded me of this - 'cos she's in them, right? :-) )
[18:46] <ipatrol> (too lazy to renumber)
[18:46] <Philippe> privatemusings: possibly... but videos tend to be donation killers when you use them wrong, so it would be very careful.
[18:46] <DenizG> privatemusings: yes, we'd like to point to our videos through social media
[18:46] <killiondude> /o Philippe
[18:46] <DenizG> we won't have them on landing pages
[18:46] <privatemusings> unless the chapters put them on!
[18:46] <Philippe> They can be used to raise the general awareness
[18:46] <privatemusings> that could be fun :-)
[18:46] -ChanServ- Channel Philippe is not registered.
[18:46] <Theo10011> http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/P1-AS624_WikiJm_G_20091122190122.jpg
[18:46] <delphine> Jamesofur: have you tried the same banner with the clik link on the right?
[18:46] <Philippe> privatemusings: I assume the chapters know what works best in their area, and trust them to do what's best :)
[18:46] * Jamesofur sets mode: +o Philippe
[18:46] <bodnotbod> I used to have Teh Graphix Skillz but haven't used them for years and years now. Hmmm... maybe I'll have a go at creating some banners next week. No harm in trying, I won't feel hurt if they don't get used.
[18:46] <@Jamesofur> delphine: You mean the donate button?
[18:47] <delphine> it seems very strange to me to have to go back to the text on the left
[18:47] <@Jamesofur> yes we have
[18:47] <privatemusings> what is it they say about assuming?
[18:47] <privatemusings> ;-)
[18:47] <@Jamesofur> right now the whole banner is clickable
[18:47] <delphine> Jamesofur: ok, and that one works better?
[18:47] <DenizG> I'd love to see your banners bodnotbod, I encourage everyone to take a swing at it
[18:47] <@Jamesofur> when we had the button we had significantly less clicks and donations
[18:47] <@Jamesofur> delphine: aye
[18:47] <@Philippe> privatemusings: our chapters are smart and talented people. I've got enough to do without second guessing their choices for their landing pages. :)
[18:47] <delphine> how people tick
[18:47] <delphine> weird
[18:47] <Theo10011> http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Wikimania_2009_GOLDBERGN-9427.jpg
[18:48] <Theo10011> http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Wikimania_2009_GOLDBERGN-9436.jpg
[18:48] <@Jamesofur> yea, interestingly for text banners we found the button decreased click rate but increased donations. It was not the same for the graphical banner
[18:48] <delphine> I really should make an appeal
[18:48] <DenizG> Yes! you should delphine :)
[18:48] <lustre> when designing banners, what is needed?
[18:48] <delphine> do we have someone-elses appeals?
[18:48] <lustre> should the text be included on the image?
[18:49] <@Philippe> delphine: We're actually testing other appeals next week, I hope.
[18:49] <@Philippe> We have several really good ones.
[18:49] <DenizG> delphine: and are accepting more :)
[18:49] <delphine> do we actually calculate how long the peopel stay on the appeal page?
[18:49] <delphine> ie. if they actually read the appeal?
[18:49] * BloodRedSandman would like to hear more, Philippe
[18:49] <@Jamesofur> lustre: Either way. Generally it is best not to include the text in the actual banner or at least to include a version of just the image. That way we can localize and translate easily
[18:49] * ipatrol (~ipatrol@wikimedia/Ipatrol) Quit (Quit: TCP FIN)
[18:49] <delphine> DenizG: ;)
[18:49] <@Philippe> delphine: we don't, but we know some things anecdotally....
[18:49] <DenizG> lustre: you can include whatever you'd like - the banners you create can always be used as a template for others to lay text over
[18:49] <killiondude> we need a "photos of jimbo" category for faster searching.
[18:49] <delphine> DenizG: Philippe asked me a while ago, but I wasn't inspired :P
[18:50] <mhernandez_> delphine, I think the appeal really does motivate people to actually complete a donation
[18:50] <DenizG> delphine: feeling slightly more inspired now? :P
[18:50] <guillom> coucou delphine
[18:50] <@Philippe> when we make a change in the middle of a testing cycle, we know for instance that people tend to be on the page for sevearl minutes because the clicks come from the "old" version for several minutes while they are reading the cached version
[18:50] <delphine> salut guillom
[18:50] <brianmc-phone> Ask Pink Floyd to dpnate a 15 second audio sample from 'Money'. :p
[18:50] <bodnotbod> Lustre, I'm not sure what you mean by "what is needed" but GIMP is an open source graphics application you could use to make banners. And Commons would be good for base images.
[18:50] <lustre> killiondude: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Jimmy_Wales
[18:50] <lustre> bodnotbod, yeah
[18:50] <lustre> Just wondering how best to design them
[18:50] <@Philippe> yes, because audio on browser is a great idea, brianmc-phone </sarcasm>
[18:51] <@Philippe> I can just see the emails now :)
[18:51] <killiondude> lustre, plz fix the pics Theo10011 linked!
[18:51] <BloodRedSandman> AUDIO ADS FOREVER
[18:51] <DenizG> lustre: if you have specific questions about banners PM me - I can help out
[18:51] <killiondude> BloodRedSandman, in MIDI format, plz
[18:51] <mhernandez_> delphine, we tried a couple different versions of Jimmy's letter and the donation rate depended on the letter. looks like people do actually read it
[18:51] <@Jamesofur> We also had a test where we moved where in the letter we specifically asked for a donation from the start of the letter to the end of the letter. The end of the letter actually had significantly more donations which makes me think they are actually reading it
[18:51] <@Jamesofur> what Megan said :)
[18:52] * zackexley (~zackexley@wikimedia/zackexley) Quit (Quit: zackexley)
[18:52] <@Philippe> Yeah, we suspect these are people who are carefully reading and making choices. It's interesting how much changing little things can affect donation rates.
[18:52] <@Philippe> That's one of the coolest things we're doing this year - all the iterative testing.
[18:52] <delphine> mhernandez_: crazy :)
[18:52] <@Philippe> And, in keeping with wiki principles, it's all being done publicly, and the results are on meta
[18:52] <@Philippe> including our analysis
[18:53] <DenizG> http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fundraising_2010/Banner_testing
[18:53] <BloodRedSandman> It's a bigger, more complex version fo how subtle changes in survey questions produce wildly different answers.... Have you considered getting in people who have researched that?
[18:53] <@Philippe> So we hope that the chapters will read that when designing their landing pages as well :)
[18:53] <DenizG> there's also a google spreadsheet with way too much data if you want to geek out with us
[18:53] <mhernandez_> It's been really interesting to see how little tweaks to the landing page and affect donation rates
[18:53] <@Philippe> BloodRedSandman: We did, in fact. We've used consultants who are experts in that.
[18:53] <BloodRedSandman> You've thought this through :p
[18:53] * brianmc-phone so enjoys these Reggie Perrin-esque meetings. Such a motivational forum.
[18:53] <@Philippe> I do try my best :)
[18:54] <delphine> DenizG: thanks, I'll geek out on you geekeries ;)
[18:54] <DenizG> delphine: good, that's what I like to hear :)
[18:54] <@Philippe> geekeries. I read "bakeries".
[18:54] <@Philippe> mmm. cake.
[18:54] <@Jamesofur> we do like to geek out :) You should see us talk about stats.
[18:54] <delphine> on *your* geekeries
[18:54] * BloodRedSandman belongs to a joke org, the motto of which is "if thinking things through just isn't for you"
[18:54] <@Philippe> <perk> stats?! :)
[18:54] * bodnotbod watches Brian strip naked and walk - without looking back - into the sea.
[18:54] <@Jamesofur> Philippe of course proves my point ;)
[18:54] <DenizG> hmmm....
[18:54] <@Philippe> i'm gonna let that go without comment.
[18:55] <harej> What is a geekery?
[18:55] <ChristineM> ***MWAH*** g'night everybody!
[18:55] <@Philippe> harej: where geeks are stored? :)
[18:55] <DenizG> geekery is what we do every day
[18:55] <@Philippe> OK, with that in mind... any last questions?
[18:55] <@Jamesofur> Anyone with more questions? Starting to get close to the end of the hour
[18:55] <@Philippe> Before we get back to geeking?
[18:55] <privatemusings> what's the capital of nebraska?
[18:55] <@Philippe> Lincoln?
[18:55] <lustre> Can we make a Obamaized picture of Jimbo?
[18:55] <privatemusings> yup... you win!
[18:55] <@Philippe> GO ME!
[18:55] <DenizG> phew
[18:55] <@Philippe> lustre: YES, WE CAN!
[18:56] <harej> let's not, lsutre
[18:56] <harej> lustre
[18:56] <harej> it's such a cliche
[18:56] <lustre> aw
[18:56] <@Philippe> lol
[18:56] * BloodRedSandman merely pretends to be a geek and hopes the real ones won;t realise he couldn't code through a wet paper bag
[18:56] <@Philippe> BloodRedSandman: I do the same. :)
[18:56] <brianmc-phone> I'm in fscking Scotland! WALK INTO THE SEA NAKED? That would see me institutionalised!
[18:56] <@Philippe> OK, folks... thanks for being here today.
[18:56] <@Philippe> I really really appreciate your interest and thoughts.
[18:56] <bodnotbod> I have no questions. Thanks to the fundraising team for holding the meeting. I am feeling rather anxious about the fundraiser due to the high target. < crosses fingers >
[18:56] <mhernandez_> thanks, all
[18:56] <@Philippe> Feel free to contact me directly....
[18:56] <@Philippe> it's firstname.lastname@example.org
[18:57] <@Jamesofur> Thanks everyone!
[18:57] <@Philippe> I'm happy to answer questions, and if I don't know the answer, I promise to make one up that sounds implausible.
[18:57] <DenizG> and me if you have questions about designs, social media, etc
[18:57] <DenizG> email@example.com
[18:57] <@Philippe> So thanks for being here today ;)
[18:57] <@Philippe> I'm out.
[18:57] * @Philippe (~Philippe@wikimedia/Philippe) Quit (Quit: Philippe)
[18:57] * schapman (~firstname.lastname@example.org) Quit (Quit: schapman)
[18:57] <harej> Ladies and gentlemen, Philippe Beaudette has left the building.
[18:57] * Chzz (Chzz@wikipedia/Chzz) has left #wikimedia-office
[18:57] * brianmc-phone (~brianmc@wikinews/brianmc) has left #wikimedia-office
[18:57] <@Jamesofur> For those interested we also have a channel that we are working in essentially 24/7
[18:57] <bodnotbod> Goodnight (UK time) all... have a good weekend.
[18:57] <@Jamesofur> at #wikimedia-fundraising
[18:57] * harej (~chatzilla@wikipedia/MessedRocker) has left #wikimedia-office
[18:58] <@Jamesofur> we all idle in there and use it as a meeting room both during tests and outside