IRC office hours/Office hours 2013-09-23

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Researcher Office Hours

Monday 23 September 2013

0600-0700 UTC

marktraceur has changed the topic to: Office hour with WMF researchers | 2013-09-23 18:00-19:00 UTC | IRC office hours - (11:01:11 AM)
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DarTar_clone [DarTar@wikimedia/DarTar] entered the room. (11:02:25 AM)
11:02:30 AM Ironholds: Pine: pong
11:02:58 AM marktraceur: Pine: There's no +t in here, so anyone can change the topic
11:03:02 AM Pine: Ironhold, thanks marktraceur changed the topic
11:03:06 AM Pine: oh
11:03:07 AM DarTar_clone: ok everybody, let's get started
11:03:07 AM Pine: ok
11:03:17 AM DarTar_clone: quick round of intros for those of you who don't know who's attending
11:03:17 AM marktraceur: Hilariously it winds up being me about 50% of the time anyway. 
11:03:33 AM DarTar_clone: I'll go first
marestivo [8131488a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.] entered the room. (11:03:36 AM)
11:04:24 AM DarTar_clone: I'm Dario, sr research analyst, worked with Product for a while and now I'm part of the Research & Data team in Analytics
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11:05:13 AM HenriqueCrang: I'm Henrique, data analyst and experiments consultant in the Brazil Catalyst Program
11:05:24 AM J-Mo: I'm Jonathan Morgan, Learning Strategist in Grantmaking. Been contracting for a while, and just joined a full time staff.
11:05:35 AM halfak: I'm Aaron Halfaker. I've been doing research work for the Foundation as a contractor for a couple of years, but I just transitioned to full-time research-analyst last week. I'm currently working with the Growth team (formerly Editor Engagement Experiments) to model new editor behavior.
11:06:05 AM J-Mo: …and that's it for the researchers, I believe. Anyone else want to introduce themselves?
11:06:29 AM Pine: We have a professor here also right?
11:06:30 AM marktraceur: *is tho topic change robot*
11:06:44 AM J-Mo: Pine: no, Aaron Shaw wasn't able to make it.
11:06:51 AM Pine: ok
11:06:57 AM J-Mo: but hopefully at future office hourse!
11:06:59 AM Haitham: I'm Haitham. Learning Strategist, works with the grantmaking team on global south and grant program evaluation.
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11:08:43 AM Pine: I think that's it for intros. DarTar there was something you wanted to announce?
11:09:12 AM DarTar: yeah
11:09:26 AM DarTar: a couple of service announcements before we get into ask-me-anything mode
tnegrin [tnegrin@conference/wikimedia/x-nawpwkjilumyfkbl] entered the room. (11:09:55 AM)
11:10:05 AM DarTar: 1) we're organizing a Wikimedia research hackathon/meetup some time in late October/early November
11:10:29 AM DarTar: the date is still to be defined but I think J-Mo and halfak should give a quick pitch
11:11:27 AM J-Mo: so, basically, we're looking to assembling a bunch of folks who are interested in research related to Wikis
11:11:29 AM halfak: ^^ If you'd like to get updates, add your name here:
PcLanglais [5a025999@gateway/web/cgi-irc/] entered the room. (11:11:32 AM)
11:12:14 AM J-Mo: …academics, foundation folks, and volunteers.
GorillaWarfare [~GorillaWa@wikipedia/GorillaWarfare] entered the room. (11:12:35 AM)
11:12:50 AM J-Mo: to answer research questions, build tools, and perform analyses that people are interested in.
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11:13:04 AM DarTar: and evangelize our data sources
11:13:11 AM halfak: Ironholds: Can you give us a quick example by talking about your project with block reasons?
11:13:23 AM J-Mo: the idea would be to have different local hackathons on the same day, and connect them to one another using the magic of THE INTERNET
11:14:14 AM halfak: Ironholds: ?
11:14:25 AM halfak: I can give a quick overview too.
KatyLove [KatyLove@wikimedia/KLove-WMF] entered the room. (11:14:27 AM)
11:14:28 AM halfak: OK.
11:14:41 AM halfak: So, we're looking at how blocking behavior has changed over time in English Wikipedia.
11:14:58 AM halfak: Specifically, we're looking for evidence that abuse filter is reducing the rate and type of blocks that happened.
11:16:15 AM HenriqueCrang: cool
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11:16:35 AM halfak: I just wanted to give you guys that so you'd know what we were talking about. This event could involve performing this type of analysis, building tools, etc.
11:16:39 AM halfak: Any questions?
11:16:54 AM Pine: Is there any coordination between that research and what's happening with Snuggle?
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11:17:36 AM halfak: Not that research specifically, but I'm using a similar set of strategies to add better block detection support into Snuggle.
11:17:55 AM Pine: ok
11:18:50 AM Pine: DarTar was there another announcement?
11:18:54 AM DarTar: yes
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11:19:27 AM DarTar: so we've been working for a while with OKFN to experiment with the use of CKAN as a data repository
ashaw [~chatzilla@] entered the room. (11:19:38 AM)
11:19:46 AM DarTar: acronym expansion:
11:19:50 AM DarTar: hey ashaw
11:19:53 AM ashaw: greetings!
11:19:59 AM ashaw: sorry to be a bit late
11:20:00 AM Pine: Welcome ashaw.
11:20:06 AM DarTar: OKFN: Open Knowledge Foundation
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11:20:57 AM DarTar: CKAN: Comprehensive Knowledge Archive Network (it's the open source software currently used by large open data repos like the US and UK gov data hubs)
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11:21:53 AM DarTar: we've used for a while as our semi-official data sharing solution
11:22:17 AM DarTar: and they recently went through a major upgrade/refresh
11:22:43 AM DarTar: they reenabled the data store which allows researchers/community members to upload and share datasets in the Wikimedia group
Maryana [Maryana@wikipedia/Accedie] entered the room. (11:22:49 AM)
11:23:13 AM DarTar: so help us spread the word and get more people to share their data, when they run research on our projects
11:23:36 AM DarTar: and ping me if you have any issues using the datahub
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11:25:36 AM DarTar: last service announcement
11:26:06 AM DarTar: we're still looking for contributors for the next issue of the research newsletter (Sep 2013), due for publication on Wednesday
jcorneli [896c9128@gateway/web/freenode/ip.] entered the room. (11:26:30 AM)
11:26:43 AM halfak: Research newsletter:
OrenBochman [] entered the room. (11:26:57 AM)
11:27:14 AM PcLanglais: I can give some help. I'm going to relaunch the French version in a shortwhile.
11:27:21 AM OrenBochman: hello
11:27:27 AM J-Mo: </announcements> At this point, we're going to switch to an AMA style format. So anyone in this chan with a BURNING question about research should chime in at any time.
11:27:28 AM DarTar: if you've read any of the papers listed in this etherpad: we'd love to have your notes and short summaries
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11:27:37 AM DarTar: PcLanglais: that'd be grand
11:28:21 AM OrenBochman: I've gone through Gellart's chapter
11:28:30 AM jcorneli: @J-Mo: could you say more about what you do as a "Learning Strategist"?
11:28:30 AM OrenBochman: not sure of someone else is covering it
11:29:13 AM PcLanglais: It's a deal 
11:29:38 AM J-Mo: heh. that's a good question jcorneli.
11:30:12 AM halfak: OrenBochman: Are you referring to one of the open papers for the Research Newsletter?
11:30:14 AM J-Mo: basically, at this point, Haitham and I are working on setting up an infrastructure to help grantees measure the impact of the grant-funded activities they perform
11:30:19 AM OrenBochman: yes
11:30:31 AM J-Mo: and also developing tools to help them measure impact.
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11:30:42 AM J-Mo: (in that capacity, we work closely with Analytics)
11:30:44 AM jcorneli: So, and grants are related to learning activities?
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11:31:30 AM OrenBochman: it's the one called Reliable Sources for Indigenous Knowledge: Dissecting Wikipedia’s Catch–22
11:31:44 AM J-Mo: yeah, the word "learning" is kind of strange. My former title "research strategist" made more sense, to me anyway. But as part of the Learning and Evaluation team within Grantmaking, we're s'posed to help make sure that we get the best results for the grant money we spend.
11:31:51 AM DarTar: OrenBochman: make sure you add your name to the etherpad
11:31:55 AM Pine: J-Mo: how is your job different from the Program Evaluation Specialist?
11:31:57 AM DarTar: if you haven;t yet
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11:32:13 AM halfak: OrenBochman: It looks like that one is available to me. You should feel free to claim it.
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11:32:46 AM OrenBochman: done
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11:32:56 AM J-Mo: another good question, Pine. The Program Evaluation Specialist (janstee) works primarily with Chapters and large-scale funded programs. Haitham and I tend to work more with smaller grants.
11:32:59 AM halfak: OrenBochman: Thanks!
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11:33:15 AM J-Mo: Haitham, janstee, feel free to chime in with more/better explanation 
11:33:17 AM jcorneli: @J-Mo: OK, I think I understand better - you're *learning* how to develop more effective grant programs
11:33:20 AM Pine: J-Mo: ok. Is jwild supervising both?
11:33:26 AM J-Mo: icorneli: YES
11:33:33 AM jcorneli: Sounds good
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11:33:47 AM J-Mo: no, jwild is Haitham and my boss, but not janstee's
11:33:54 AM J-Mo: she works with Frank Schulenberg
11:34:27 AM jcorneli: @J-Mo: here's a short "use case" for peer learning techniques that's related to your job (I think):
11:34:33 AM jcorneli: I'd be curious to know what you think of that!
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11:35:04 AM OrenBochman: is Aaron Shaw around ?
11:35:06 AM DarTar: J-Mo: it's actually Schulenburg (it usually takes a few months for people to get it right) 
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11:35:19 AM halfak: OrenBochman: He's having technical difficulties at the moment.
11:35:29 AM OrenBochman: too bad
11:35:33 AM tnegrin: J-Mo: how is this different from wikimetrics?
11:35:53 AM halfak: Doc. Shaw may still make it.
11:35:53 AM J-Mo: ooh, I like this jcorneli. I'm working on a similar format to capturing key tips and considerations for evaluation, that uses Design patterns.
11:36:09 AM J-Mo: tnegrin: how is what different?
11:36:14 AM ashaw: i'm around!
11:36:18 AM OrenBochman: anyone here looking into gendergap these days ?
11:36:18 AM ashaw: just not on the video at the moment
11:36:20 AM jcorneli: @J-Mo: yeah, we have a lot of those too...
11:36:23 AM ashaw: oh yes
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11:36:29 AM OrenBochman: is there video too ?
11:36:42 AM Pine: OrenBochman: sikob may be able to answer the gender gap question. Siko?
11:36:56 AM DarTar: OrenBochman: did you see the gender microsurveys?
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11:37:07 AM OrenBochman: don't think so
11:37:10 AM tnegrin: J-Mo: sorry, let's do this offline
11:37:13 AM tnegrin: I'll reach out
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11:37:18 AM J-Mo: jcorneli, I clearly need to follow up with you more. Do you have time this week to teach me a little more about what you're doing with peerology?
11:37:26 AM J-Mo: tnegrin: k
11:37:45 AM DarTar: OrenBochman: here's some high-level description of what the project is about
11:37:55 AM halfak: DarTar: Can you link to info about those micro-surveys?
11:38:02 AM OrenBochman: I've am looking at neutrality and gendered language on en.wikipedia.
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11:38:07 AM Pine: OrenBochman: we're aware of gender gap and related issues in IEGCom. I'm not sure what's happening in the rest of WMF these days.
11:38:26 AM sikob: nothing specifically aimed at gender gap wmf-wide
11:38:29 AM Pine: I think that was deprioritized as a part of "narrowing focus" but not sure.
11:38:30 AM OrenBochman: what is IEDCom
11:38:38 AM Pine: IEG, not IED.
11:38:43 AM Pine: Individual Engagement Grants.
11:38:43 AM sikob: but always interested in research on the topic
11:38:51 AM marktraceur: IED is a way more exciting and shorter conference.
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11:39:03 AM jcorneli: @J-Mo: Yeah - generally free around this time of day (UK evenings), if that works well. If you want to browse through my thesis, it's online. I see that we're on about the same schedule, PhD-wise
11:39:18 AM OrenBochman: I've done some work using game theory to look at how gender gap arise
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11:39:28 AM jcorneli: I'll send you an email to facilitate follow-up
11:39:28 AM sumanah: *looks at logs *
11:39:28 AM DarTar: wikimedia-office needs an acronym-solving bot
11:39:59 AM Pine: OrenBochman: that would be interesting for the research newsletter! Can you work that in with DarTar?
11:40:03 AM J-Mo: nice! Want to meet here tomorrow at 11 PDT and I can pick your brian?
11:40:07 AM J-Mo: *brain
11:40:13 AM OrenBochman: I'be found a family of models which model some of the qualitative issues
11:40:23 AM OrenBochman: it's too early for this one
11:40:53 AM OrenBochman: anyhow the most intersting results so far come from three areas
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11:41:39 AM OrenBochman: I looked at gate keeping and the model indicate a prepensity for agression by gatekeeprs
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11:42:03 AM J-Mo: jcorneli: sweeeet
11:42:18 AM DarTar: for context, the micro-survey approach is designed to measure gender breakdown in different parts of the reader -> new contributor funnel, we have only rolled out one for account registrations for now, but I expect we'll have more in the future
11:42:34 AM OrenBochman: a second model needs a very long survey to check
11:43:36 AM OrenBochman: it looks at alternative to Wikipedia in term of Cognetive surplus
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11:45:00 AM OrenBochman: DarTar: What I want to check is if there is gender assymetric - hyperbolic discounting
11:45:21 AM OrenBochman: problem is a typical survey has around 480 questions
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11:46:12 AM DarTar: that's one of the reason why I believe we're moving away from surveys for reader/editor demographics 
11:46:27 AM DarTar: OrenBochman: do you have a short project description in the Research index?
11:46:32 AM DarTar: or is it too premature?
11:47:00 AM OrenBochman: I'm looking to create an adaptive survey to reduce it to around 20 questions
11:47:23 AM OrenBochman: I planned to present this at the diversity confrence.
11:47:29 AM halfak: For those who don't know, the "Research Index" is a place where we list out all of our internal, WMF projects and ask external researchers to list there projects as well. See
11:47:33 AM OrenBochman: but I don
11:47:36 AM J-Mo: looks like things are slowing down. anyone have any more questions for researchers?
11:47:42 AM OrenBochman: I don't think I'll be going
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11:48:23 AM OrenBochman: any how I am currently looking at gendered bias in langague
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11:48:39 AM Pine: Haitham and HenriqueCrang: can you talk about what you've learned about Brazil and Global South in general? Has there been any major improvement since WMF first started looking into improving Global South participation?
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11:48:52 AM OrenBochman: I'm creating a tool that works like sentiment analsis but for gendered language
11:49:43 AM OrenBochman: I'll be putting that up in a few days on the web
11:49:56 AM HenriqueCrang: Pine, we cant already point any improvements directly linked to the WMF action here in Brazil
11:50:12 AM Pine: halfak: is there a researcher assigned to what was E2?
11:50:24 AM sumanah: I'm curious about who's using WikiMetrics, but I know that is less a researcher question and more a general analytics question
11:50:33 AM DarTar: Pine: there are some high priority parts of E2 that we're supporting
11:50:39 AM Haitham: Sadly there wasn't any significant improvement, but what we have now is a better understanding about where the key regions are, and this helped forming our new Global South strategy.
11:50:40 AM OrenBochman: I've used it one or twice
11:50:52 AM DarTar: Beta and Flow in particular
11:50:57 AM HenriqueCrang: We have seen some rates stoping to going down, but we cant afirm that there were a conection between this data and the catalyst program explicity
11:51:23 AM Pine: ok. Haitham what about India?
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11:51:46 AM Pine: as compared to Brazil?
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11:52:16 AM DarTar: I have to run, thanks folks (and thanks Pine for putting this together)
11:52:24 AM Pine: Thanks for participating!
11:52:35 AM HenriqueCrang: but we can really see some rates improving after the begining of the program, like in:
11:52:46 AM HenriqueCrang: bye DarTar !
11:52:49 AM DarTar: ciao
11:52:51 AM OrenBochman: not sure why WikiMetrics requires cohorts to be from one wiki
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11:53:19 AM OrenBochman: our events often have people editing multiple projects
11:53:39 AM drdee_: OrenBochman: we have that request in our backlog
11:53:44 AM OrenBochman: the last one was commons,en.wik and
11:53:47 AM Haitham: Pine, Most of the work in India is being supervised now by CIS, and we believe that they are able to do a better job as they have a better understanding of the local communities. I believe the same model be replicated other places too.
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11:54:29 AM Pine: Haitham: ok but who is gathering data on their outcomes and is it being compared with data from Brazil?
11:54:32 AM HenriqueCrang: Pine, we hope to run some controlled experiments this season to be able to connect the actions performed with changes, since historically ptwiki numbers are pretty unstable
11:55:48 AM OrenBochman: DarTar: regarding - do I just add a new page under projects ?
11:56:10 AM HenriqueCrang: Pine, i started conversations with the guys form CIS in India and we really want to share learnings and analysis
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11:56:27 AM Haitham: CIS does the data gathering on its own, you may have an updated version at Henrique might be the best to tell about Brazil.
11:56:39 AM J-Mo: OrenBorchman: DarTar's gone, but yes, you can just create a new research project page.
11:56:41 AM halfak: OrenBochman: I can field that. Yes. The best way is to use the input box on the lower left of Research:Index.
11:56:56 AM HenriqueCrang: but now we dont have any comparative data, and I dont know if we are going to, since we have so diferent realities in both countries
11:57:22 AM sumanah: see y'all later!
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11:57:25 AM OrenBochman: ok
11:57:26 AM halfak: OrenBochman: On, there's a header in the lower left for "Create a new project page"
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11:57:33 AM OrenBochman: I saw that
11:57:37 AM halfak: Awesome.
11:57:38 AM OrenBochman: I'll add it
11:58:04 AM halfak: hasta sumanah 
11:58:07 AM OrenBochman: halfak: are you still doing the survey on your tool
11:58:08 AM halfak: Woops. too late
11:58:15 AM Pine: HenriqueCrang: if WMF is going to put a bunch of money into a Brazil consultant program I think it should have a baseline out of India and do comparisons as Brazil moves forward.
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11:58:22 AM halfak: OrenBochman: Finished a couple of weeks ago.
11:58:42 AM J-Mo: alright everyone, I hereby call this meeting to a close. We hope to have another next month, so keep your eyes on the wikiresearch-l mailing list!
11:58:43 AM OrenBochman: I was moving again
11:58:55 AM J-Mo: and thanks again to Pine for organizing this.
11:58:57 AM Pine: J-Mo: you are two minutes early!
11:59:02 AM Pine: but ok
11:59:09 AM halfak: Two minutes for goodbyes.
11:59:16 AM J-Mo: lol.
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11:59:19 AM halfak: And yeah, cheers to Pine.
11:59:25 AM OrenBochman: ashaw: I'd like to chat about your paper on the gender gap surveys
11:59:26 AM Pine: thanks everyone!
11:59:35 AM Pine: I look forward to the research newsletter
11:59:41 AM OrenBochman: 
11:59:43 AM Haitham: Thank you Pine for organizing this.
11:59:47 AM Pine: J-Mo: will you post logs please?
12:00:00 PM J-Mo: mmm. where?
12:00:05 PM Ocastro: Hi Pine, comparing Brazil and India is possible, but very challenging
12:00:07 PM J-Mo: never done that.
12:00:32 PM Pine: J-Mo:
12:00:33 PM J-Mo: (but yes, I will do so!)
12:00:40 PM J-Mo: perf. thanks
12:00:50 PM Ocastro: challenging not because of technical reasons, but because of different context and multiple aspects that should be taken into account
12:00:51 PM Haitham: I made a copy of the logs, will see where other folk post them and do the same.
12:01:03 PM Pine: Haitham:
12:01:12 PM Haitham: ok, see you all.
12:01:13 PM OrenBochman: one more question - anyone working with R
12:01:21 PM halfak: J-Mo, if you don't have a complete lot to post, let me know. I have one.
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12:01:24 PM ashaw: See you all! Sorry I was unable to join video this time around.
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12:01:35 PM Pine: I'm going offline also. Bye!