IRC office hours/Office hours 2014-10-08

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[13:42:56] <Betacommand> the collections meeting is this channel correct?
[13:43:41] <Krenair> Nemo_bis, ^
[13:49:15] <Keegan> Betacommand: correct, at least according to the email sent out :)
[13:51:35] <Nemo_bis> yep
[13:57:35] <Nemo_bis> Those who want can start picking their bugs at https://etherpad.wikimedia.org/BugTriage-Collection :P but don't drive over your neighbours
[14:00:23] <andre__> PDF/Collection/OCG Bugday! Yay!
[14:00:23] <andre__> Welcome everybody! (and big big thanks to Nemo_bis for kicking this!)
[14:00:28] <Nemo_bis> So, who's in for the bug day?
[14:00:30] <Nemo_bis> o/
[14:00:34] * Romaine takes up the flyswatter
[14:00:55] <andre__> o/ (with interruptions)
[14:01:09] <Nemo_bis> saper?
[14:01:14] <Nemo_bis> welcome Kelson :)
[14:01:26] <Romaine> o/ is interested
[14:01:37] <Kelson> Nemo_bis: hi. Happy to be here.. even have done my homework. I have installed the OCG
[14:01:40] <saper> Nemo_bis: hi
[14:01:47] <Nemo_bis> Kelson: well done!
[14:01:54] <saper> oh it's bugday today:(
[14:02:04] <Kelson> saper: hi, nice to meet you
[14:02:15] <Kelson> Nemo_bis: you will make bug triaging and I will open a few new ones
[14:02:21] <saper> hello Kelson
[14:02:32] <Nemo_bis> What's Arno's nick on IRC?
[14:03:13] <Nemo_bis> Do we have any wiki better than http://wikieducator.org/ for ePub/ZIM/DocBook testing? (I think that's good enough)
[14:03:24] <Kelson> Nemo_bis: cscott is not here?
[14:03:27] <Nemo_bis> * Arlo I meant
[14:03:35] <Nemo_bis> soon coming
[14:03:38] <andre__> Kelson, not yet I guess. Timezones
[14:03:45] <saper> and I just wanted to go to sleep :(
[14:04:10] <Nemo_bis> ouch
[14:04:20] <saper> are you working on old PediaPress bugs or also on bugzilla ones?
[14:04:24] <Kelson> andre__: Hi
[14:04:30] <saper> I am kind of lost
[14:04:43] <Nemo_bis> saper: both
[14:04:52] <Nemo_bis> See https://www.mediawiki.org/?curid=295353
[14:05:45] <Nemo_bis> Betacommand, have you already tried exporting something to PDF with the new rendering?
[14:08:04] <Nemo_bis> Helder: ping
[14:10:26] <Nemo_bis> So, this is a parallel effort in which we attack the enemy from all sides
[14:10:42] <Nemo_bis> One source of old bugs is PediaPress tracker, see list in https://etherpad.wikimedia.org/p/BugTriage-Collection
[14:10:49] <Nemo_bis> The other is https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/buglist.cgi?component=Collection&list_id=349829&order=changeddate%2Cbug_id&product=MediaWiki%20extensions&resolution=---
[14:11:36] <Nemo_bis> If you see some strange output and don't understand how Parsoid has a role in it (cf. https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Bug_management/Triage/201410 instructions), just ask the others here
[14:12:02] <Nemo_bis> Oh, we should call User:Headbomb too
[14:14:19] <Nemo_bis> (done)
[14:14:20] <Krenair> Nemo_bis, arlolra
[14:14:24] <Nemo_bis> Right
[14:17:04] <Nemo_bis> One bug I have questions about is http://web.archive.org/web/20110800000000/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/875
[14:17:11] <Nemo_bis> Cuneiform script not supported / Cuneiform script support
[14:17:47] <Nemo_bis> Do we have any test case for this? In theory there are pages including cuneiform text, but in practice they usually have transliterations...
[14:20:14] <Nemo_bis> I guess we should just try and print https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuneiform
[14:22:11] <Nemo_bis> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuneiform#Syllabary can be read nicely when I enable webfonts from languages > gear > fonts > download fonts
[14:24:24] <Nemo_bis> https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Book&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=Cuneiform&oldid=628516652&writer=rdf2latex doesn't even respond? O_o
[14:26:49] <Nemo_bis> ok, still current; filing
[14:27:01] <Nemo_bis> ** right-to-left mark/left-to-right mark ignored/text does not change direction
[14:27:20] <Nemo_bis> matanya might know how to find a test case for this
[14:31:32] <Nemo_bis> So I filed https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71798 and moved the bullet at the end of the pad
[14:32:52] <Nemo_bis> ouch, no aharoni for RTL clue
[14:32:53] <Nemo_bis> * http://web.archive.org/web/20110800000000/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/76
[14:32:56] <Nemo_bis> ** tag attributes that affect text styles are not used
[14:33:27] <Nemo_bis> This was about inline styles like font-variant:small-caps, which works now; any other legit case?
[14:35:15] <Nemo_bis> (if someone can find another test case to verify, please recover it from the bottom of the pad)
[14:37:14] <Nemo_bis> * http://web.archive.org/web/20110800000000/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/376
[14:37:18] <Nemo_bis> ** Problems with PDFs in Adobe Reader
[14:37:24] <Nemo_bis> Does someone have Adobe Reader?
[14:38:08] <valhallasw`cloud> Nemo_bis: yeah, do you need something tested?
[14:38:11] <Nemo_bis> If yes try and download https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Book&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=Asbestos&oldid=273776279&writer=rdf2latex to see how it's displayed
[14:40:30] <Nemo_bis> Looks fine in Okular 0.20.0
[14:40:42] <Nemo_bis> (wow, wikipe-tan is among the authors :p)
[14:44:36] <Nemo_bis> hi Azitrex
[14:44:45] <Azitrex> hi Nemo_bis
[14:45:24] <Nemo_bis> Azitrex: do you know what this report might refer to "right-to-left mark/left-to-right mark ignored/text does not change direction "?
[14:46:05] <valhallasw`cloud> Nemo_bis: looks ok in Adobe Reader X
[14:46:16] <Nemo_bis> valhallasw`cloud: thanks!
[14:46:32] <Azitrex> no Nemo_bis
[14:46:39] <Nemo_bis> To verify that RTL issue it's probablyy enough to print some RTL wiki's village pump
[14:47:19] <ebraminio> First, is it possible to use a font doesn't have package on debian?
[14:47:23] <ebraminio> *free
[14:47:29] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: probably not
[14:47:47] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: but if you have specific suggestions for fonts for a languauge please file one bug
[14:48:01] <ebraminio> Nemo_bis: yeah filled before
[14:48:12] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: ah nice, number?
[14:49:57] <Nemo_bis> "Universal Language Selector will be enabled by default again on this wiki by 21 February 2014" is an example of section with ltr marks, in https://fa.wiktionary.org/?oldid=662342
[14:50:18] <ebraminio> 71592
[14:50:23] <Nemo_bis> Heh, silly me, fa.wiki has no Collection enabled
[14:50:47] <Reedy> We should ask cscott about enabling it everywhere
[14:51:00] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: would you oppose enabling Collection on fa.wiki?
[14:51:18] <ebraminio> we have it currently AFAIK
[14:51:44] <Nemo_bis> Hm, why not in sidebar though
[14:51:46] <ebraminio> https://fa.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=%D9%88%DB%8C%DA%98%D9%87:%DA%A9%D8%AA%D8%A7%D8%A8&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=%D9%85%D9%86%D9%88%D8%B3%DA%A9&oldid=10428665&writer=rdf2latex
[14:51:51] <ebraminio> https://fa.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D9%85%D9%86%D9%88%D8%B3%DA%A9
[14:51:57] <ebraminio> دریافت به‌صورت PDF
[14:51:58] <Nemo_bis> yep, I loaded it now
[14:51:58] <ebraminio> it is
[14:52:26] <Nemo_bis> https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71592 should be moved to OCG product, right?
[14:53:04] <ebraminio> 71592 could be fixed very well by replacing it by a not currently packaged OFL licensed font
[14:53:31] <Reedy> Packaging a font shouldn't be too difficult
[14:53:33] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71592 doesn't mention any suggested font though
[14:53:36] * Reedy looks shifty
[14:53:38] <ebraminio> saying that as the suggester of the current font
[14:53:43] <Nemo_bis> hi cscott
[14:54:03] <Nemo_bis> cscott: a request for specific font in PDF should be moved to OCG product, right? https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/71592
[14:54:04] <ebraminio> Nemo_bis: yes, reporter want to hand improving it
[14:54:16] <ebraminio> the current packaged font
[14:54:52] <Nemo_bis> I'm not sure we'd fork a font..
[14:54:59] <ebraminio> Nemo_bis: me neither
[14:55:09] <ebraminio> Nemo_bis: this is not what I want
[14:55:21] <ebraminio> I like to replace Nazli with XB Zar
[14:55:33] <ebraminio> it doesn't have that issue
[14:55:37] <ebraminio> and is much better
[14:55:59] <ebraminio> most TeX templates on Persian use that font already
[14:57:07] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: ULS uses IranianSans, IranianSerif, Lateef, Nazli, Scheherazade
[14:57:13] <Nemo_bis> Is any of those good?
[14:57:17] <ebraminio> http://wiki.irmug.com/index.php/X_Series_2 obviously have better quality than the font available on ttf-farsiweb
[14:57:29] <ebraminio> Nemo_bis: I put most of them there
[14:57:39] <ebraminio> No
[14:57:46] <ebraminio> They are web fonts not print ones
[14:58:08] <ebraminio> and Iranian* doesn't have debian package
[14:58:35] <Nemo_bis> that would be solvable
[14:58:46] <Nemo_bis> The problem is knowing which font(s) are ok
[14:58:54] <Nemo_bis> The bug report currently doesn't say
[14:59:40] <ebraminio> Yes, he wants to the thing he did before for mwrlib, hand optimizing Nazli
[15:00:46] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: if you don't want to "steal" that bug, please report a separate one asking a specific print-ok font to be used by the new PDF export
[15:02:11] <Nemo_bis> Now trying to print https://fa.wikipedia.org/?oldid=13346385
[15:02:42] <ebraminio> Okay, next issue
[15:02:46] <ebraminio> [1] [2] [3]
[15:02:48] <Nemo_bis> Or better https://fa.wikipedia.org/?oldid=13257784
[15:02:56] <Nemo_bis> References?
[15:03:05] <ebraminio> they are not in native digits
[15:03:11] <Nemo_bis> https://fa.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=%D9%88%DB%8C%DA%98%D9%87:%DA%A9%D8%AA%D8%A7%D8%A8&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=%D9%88%DB%8C%DA%A9%DB%8C%E2%80%8C%D9%BE%D8%AF%DB%8C%D8%A7%3A%D9%82%D9%87%D9%88%D9%87%E2%80%8C%D8%AE%D8%A7%D9%86%D9%87%2F%DA%AF%D9%88%D9%86%D8%A7%DA%AF%D9%88%D9%86&oldid=13257784&writer=rdf2latex
[15:03:30] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: example page?
[15:03:30] <ebraminio> I currently forget my bugzilla pass :)
[15:03:37] <Nemo_bis> ugh
[15:04:18] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: then tell us a good font on this channel :)
[15:04:44] <ebraminio> I said, http://wiki.irmug.com/index.php/X_Series_2 XB Zar
[15:04:57] <ebraminio> It is high quality TeX ready font
[15:04:59] <ebraminio> OFL
[15:05:39] <Nemo_bis> doesn't say OFL there though
[15:05:48] <Nemo_bis> but filing
[15:05:54] <ebraminio> Inside the package
[15:05:58] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: can you check the PDF I last linked above? last section looks ok
[15:06:30] <ebraminio> VisualEditor available on Internet Explorer 11 ?
[15:06:41] <Nemo_bis> yep
[15:06:53] <cscott> Nemo_bis: yes, font issues should be filed against OCG. and please cc the reporter on the bug, in my experience tweaks to rendering issues like these usually take a number of back and forth passes with a native speaker to work out all the issues.
[15:07:07] <ebraminio> Looks ok, thank you
[15:07:20] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: what's the email or "real name" you use on bugzilla?
[15:07:23] <ebraminio> about reference
[15:07:28] <ebraminio> ebrahim@gnu.org
[15:07:55] <ebraminio> about reference not being in native digits, https://fa.wikipedia.org/wiki/%DA%AF%D9%88%DA%AF%D9%84
[15:08:55] <Nemo_bis> �https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71802
[15:08:59] <cscott> does the cite extension use native digits for <ref>? It would be useful to be able to borrow its localization strings if possible.
[15:09:21] <Nemo_bis> localised digits don't use strings
[15:10:03] <ebraminio> or this one https://fa.wikipedia.org/wiki/%DA%86%D9%BE%D9%82%D9%84%D9%88_(%D8%B1%D8%B2%D9%86)
[15:10:03] <ebraminio> [۱]
[15:10:03] <ebraminio> [۲]
[15:10:03] <Nemo_bis> http://parsoid-lb.eqiad.wikimedia.org/fawiki/%DA%AF%D9%88%DA%AF%D9%84 doesn't even respond 8quickly)
[15:10:29] <Nemo_bis> ok, so this is a parsoid bug http://parsoid-lb.eqiad.wikimedia.org/fawiki/%DA%AF%D9%88%DA%AF%D9%84?oldid=13402018
[15:11:22] <ebraminio> okay, smaller page http://parsoid-lb.eqiad.wikimedia.org/fawiki/%DA%86%D9%BE%D9%82%D9%84%D9%88_(%D8%B1%D8%B2%D9%86)?oldid=10111059
[15:12:01] <cscott> Nemo_bis: localization code, then. ;)
[15:12:30] <ebraminio> Okay, next issue
[15:12:36] <Nemo_bis> https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71803
[15:12:49] <Nemo_bis> cscott: see formatNum function and friends
[15:14:02] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: waiting :)
[15:14:24] <ebraminio> https://fa.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D8%B3%D9%86%D8%AA-%D8%B1%D8%B2-%D8%AF%D9%88-%D9%88%D8%A7%D8%AA%D9%81%D9%88%D8%B1%D8%8C_%DA%A9%D8%A8%DA%A9
[15:14:51] <ebraminio> <reference />
[15:14:56] <Nemo_bis> The bottom of https://etherpad.wikimedia.org/p/BugTriage-Collection looks better ;)
[15:15:01] <ebraminio> on pdf output
[15:15:21] <ebraminio> isn't LTR
[15:15:31] <ebraminio> we wrapped it on mw-content-ltr however
[15:16:01] <ebraminio> but not just being not LTR but also parentheses looks misplaced/borken
[15:16:06] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: can you please link a page where you're using bare <references/> then?
[15:16:28] <Nemo_bis> this is probably again a parsoid bug
[15:16:54] <Nemo_bis> str4nd: ping
[15:17:01] <Nemo_bis> no stryn
[15:17:22] <Nemo_bis> I'm so good at Finnish hyphenation as to test http://web.archive.org/web/20090211065715/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/197
[15:19:04] <ebraminio> https://fa.wikipedia.org/wiki/%DA%A9%D8%A7%D8%B1%D8%A8%D8%B1:Ebraminio/pdf
[15:20:31] <Nemo_bis> heh
[15:20:48] <ebraminio> Nemo_bis: http://i.imgur.com/fX6v2mg.png
[15:21:03] <Nemo_bis> yes I see
[15:21:14] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: are you able to tell me if some arabic characters are joined correctly?
[15:21:51] <Nemo_bis> Does someone dare print https://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suomen_kunnanvaakunat ? :)
[15:22:21] <ebraminio> Nemo_bis: Yes they are
[15:24:56] <Nemo_bis> https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71804
[15:25:04] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: in Arabic too?
[15:25:16] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: e.g. https://test.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Book&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=%D9%83%D9%84%D8%A8&oldid=62651&writer=rdf2latex
[15:26:15] <Nemo_bis> Does someone have example pages of <u> used to span multiple lines?
[15:26:31] <Nemo_bis> cscott: maybe from the parsoid beasts gallery?
[15:27:24] <ebraminio> Nemo_bis:
[15:27:31] <ebraminio> not rendered yet
[15:27:35] <ebraminio> but another issue
[15:27:36] <ebraminio> https://fa.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D8%B3%DB%8C%D8%A7%D8%B1%DA%A9_%DB%B2%DB%B0%DB%B3%DB%B0%DB%B4
[15:27:50] <ebraminio> second page looks very broken
[15:28:39] <ebraminio> http://i.imgur.com/VmEN4Eo.png
[15:28:48] <cscott> ebraminio: http://parsoid-lb.eqiad.wikimedia.org/fawiki/%DA%A9%D8%A7%D8%B1%D8%A8%D8%B1%3AEbraminio%2Fpdf?oldid=13406924 and https://fa.wikipedia.org/wiki/%DA%A9%D8%A7%D8%B1%D8%A8%D8%B1:Ebraminio/pdf look identical to me.
[15:28:59] <cscott> i don't understand the RTL issue here.
[15:29:13] <cscott> this seems like a bug in the cite extension in core, if anything.
[15:29:26] <Nemo_bis> I'm marking " handle right-to-left articles " WORKSFORME
[15:29:28] <ebraminio> cscott: yes, broken on pdf output http://i.imgur.com/fX6v2mg.png
[15:29:55] <ebraminio> it should be (انگلیسی) not )انگلیسی(
[15:30:11] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: {{int:}} issues?
[15:30:38] <cscott> so the bug is that the references *should* be ltr, not rtl.
[15:30:39] <ebraminio> {{int: }} issue is on https://fa.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D8%B3%DB%8C%D8%A7%D8%B1%DA%A9_%DB%B2%DB%B0%DB%B3%DB%B0%DB%B4
[15:30:54] <Nemo_bis> yes that's what I'm looking at now
[15:31:35] <ebraminio> cscott: not all of <reference> should be LTR, we set that with a parameter, but there, yes
[15:32:15] <ebraminio> (the parameter is using mw-content-ltr and at least pdf output should care about that)
[15:32:46] <ebraminio> despite setting dir="ltr" also
[15:33:16] <Nemo_bis> I'm not sure if that int error is in PDF or what... filing as Collection
[15:33:30] <ebraminio> cscott, Nemo_bis: but generally, new pdf renderer looks awesome
[15:33:32] <ebraminio> thank you
[15:33:49] <Nemo_bis> josu confirmed that hyphenation is ok
[15:33:52] <ebraminio> the old one was unable of justifying Arabic text
[15:33:57] * Nemo_bis has no merits
[15:34:20] <cscott> ok, moved https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71804 to OCG/PDF, since parsoid is emitting a dir=ltr which PDF is ignoring for some reason.
[15:34:22] <ebraminio> but this one, doing two column things, really nice
[15:34:40] <Nemo_bis> thanks cscott
[15:34:46] <ebraminio> community also like the new pdf renderer, good job really
[15:34:48] <Nemo_bis> cscott: did you file a bug for the "letter" size etc.?
[15:35:10] <cscott> maybe open a new bug for mw-content-ltr, but that won't be able to be implemented until I implement some more CSS support (which is https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71339)
[15:35:24] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: yes, it's a huge effort to redo it from scratch, but adopting a "standard" solution for PDF creation gives huge benefits
[15:36:12] <ebraminio> old one had more issues even and I don't think had these issues fixed
[15:36:22] <cscott> Nemo_bis: you mean being able to export as letter? I didn't file a bug, I just fixed it. ;) https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/165253
[15:36:23] <ebraminio> this one is really good, I just wanted to thanks
[15:37:19] <cscott> i'm glad i could improve things. my main personal motivation was improving support for non-latin languages. since i knew it would be a little worse at rendering some things (tables, for example) i was hoping that at least we'd make enough improvement for non-latin scripts that it would be worth it.
[15:38:06] <Nemo_bis> for int, https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71805
[15:38:17] <ebraminio> cscott: Thank you
[15:38:22] <Nemo_bis> cscott: great :) any other format that makes sense to fix?
[15:38:24] <ebraminio> Nemo_bis: still unable to render https://test.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D9%83%D9%84%D8%A8
[15:38:36] <ebraminio> And yes, I can read arabic script
[15:38:42] <ebraminio> and I know arabic a little even
[15:39:10] <Nemo_bis> ebraminio: can you test any ar.wiki page then
[15:39:11] <ebraminio> we have same script but different languages
[15:39:22] <cscott> can we render anything on test.wikipedia.org? i haven't tested there before, maybe it's misconfigured?
[15:39:48] <Nemo_bis> at some point it worked IIRC?
[15:39:48] <ebraminio> Nemo_bis: Okay, I should go right now but ping when you wanted more :)
[15:39:55] <Nemo_bis> aww
[15:40:19] <ebraminio> Nemo_bis: also please find someone to review https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/165465/
[15:40:25] <Nemo_bis> cscott: what's the status with GIFs?
[15:40:52] <ebraminio> I feel really bad when my patches don't get any review :(
[15:42:57] <Nemo_bis> commented
[15:43:04] <Nemo_bis> now test me an ar.wiki page :D
[15:43:46] <cscott> Nemo_bis: there shouldn't be any problems with GIFs that I know of. For animated GIFs we take the first frame. (That's another bug that was fixed fairly recently?)
[15:44:41] <Nemo_bis> Generation of the document file has failed. Status: ENOSPC, write https://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Spezial:Buch&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=Zweiter+Weltkrieg&oldid=132331085&writer=rdf2latex
[15:45:57] <Nemo_bis> Reviews appreciated for https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/163139/ as well :)
[15:48:22] <Nemo_bis> cscott: do you have an example of transparent gif with gray background? or do you think one such issue would be superseded by the new PDF rendering
[15:49:57] <Nemo_bis> I'm marking WONTFIX "Use the image size specified by users https://en.wikipedia.org/?oldid=627081015 / SVG size should not be increased to a default value "
[15:52:25] <cscott> i don't know exactly how transparent gifs would be rendered.
[15:54:38] <Nemo_bis> asked on -commons
[15:55:36] <Nemo_bis> "Overlines not rendered in PDFs " is another I don't have a test case for
[15:56:37] <Nemo_bis> cscott: did you ever look at https://github.com/pediapress/mwlib.rl/blob/master/mwlib/rl/fontconfig.py ?
[15:57:06] <cscott> overlines?
[15:57:47] <Nemo_bis> yeah not sure what is meant there
[16:00:08] <Nemo_bis> hmmm are these sorts of things handled automagically well by the latex converter in all languages? https://www.mail-archive.com/mwlib@googlegroups.com/msg00501.html
[16:01:19] <cscott> Nemo_bis: customconfig.py?
[16:01:33] <cscott> maybe you pasted the wrong url?
[16:02:12] <Nemo_bis> nope, it's the correct one
[16:02:24] <Nemo_bis> how are margins etc. etc. decided now?
[16:03:29] <Nemo_bis> "Block javascript injection in inline html" i'm closing this as WORKSFORME unless someone suspects it may happen still
[16:04:52] <Nemo_bis> cscott: for https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28206 , the issue is that it's not very clear what's the way forward: are you just going to hardcode fonts and configs tailored for each language/script? does that solve any issue?
[16:06:29] <cscott> I hard code fonts for each script (which is different than for each language). this is necessary because a lot of wiki content includes short sections of other languages. so you can't really customize per-wiki, you need to have a global config that works with whatever is given.
[16:06:39] <cscott> at some point that probably won't scale, but it hasn't happened yet.
[16:07:34] <Nemo_bis> Now printing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overline
[16:07:58] <jem> Hi everyone
[16:08:21] <Nemo_bis> Hi jem
[16:08:27] <jem> In es.wiki a user is very concerned about infoboxes not being displayed in the PDFs
[16:08:36] <jem> Is this known / going to be fixed?
[16:08:55] <Nemo_bis> jem: all tables are excluded currently; cscott will know if there's a plan
[16:09:00] <Nemo_bis> This looks very bad https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Book&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=Overline&oldid=627236686&writer=rdf2latex
[16:09:51] <jem> Ah, you're right, I hadn't realized infoboxes are tables also :)
[16:10:43] <jem> While cscott comments, I had another question/curiosity also
[16:11:23] <Nemo_bis> yess
[16:11:47] <jem> So, is the PediaPress agreement/possibility completely over?
[16:12:21] <jem> I've read an announcement in... maybe July, for it to be cancelled "in the next weeks"
[16:13:08] <Nemo_bis> Reedy: can you restore https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Headbomb/Chess ?
[16:13:56] <jem> But the point is that http://pediapress.com/ keeps on announcing it
[16:13:59] <Nemo_bis> jem: no decision is known to intentionally kill it
[16:14:04] <jem> Ah
[16:14:20] <Nemo_bis> Follow https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71675
[16:14:48] <jem> Good
[16:14:54] <jem> Following
[16:15:15] <jem> The idea is to remove it from the help page also, if it is no longer valid...
[16:15:19] <jem> Thanks
[16:17:07] <Nemo_bis> jem: which help page?
[16:17:20] <Reedy> Nemo_bis: Done
[16:17:27] <Nemo_bis> Now testing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fork_%28chess%29 https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Book&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=Fork+%28chess%29&oldid=628656334&writer=rdf2latex
[16:17:32] <Nemo_bis> thanks Reedy
[16:18:44] <jem> Nemo_bis: In our case, https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayuda:Libros#Impresi.C3.B3n_en_PediaPress
[16:19:57] <Nemo_bis> Hm chess diagram not ooutput at all, is it in a table orr what
[16:19:59] <Nemo_bis> ok jem
[16:20:50] <Nemo_bis> yes it is, sigh
[16:21:17] <Nemo_bis> cscott: should we file a tracking bug for tables having specific use cases as blockers, or are they given for granted?
[16:21:37] <cscott> hm, i guess you might as well make a tracking bug
[16:21:55] <jem> cscott: And any possible estimation I can give to this es.wiki user?
[16:22:04] <jem> (about tables, or infoboxes in particular)
[16:22:09] <cscott> my plan is to enable tables for specific cases gradually, since it is easy for a bad table layout to really screw up the page.
[16:22:42] <jem> I can also link that tracking bug to him
[16:22:47] <cscott> so it will be useful to track the specific cases so can see how many of them i've addressed.
[16:23:29] <cscott> wrt pediapress -- right now we're not sending the requests to pediapress because of a misconfiguration. but the patch to fix that has already been merged, and will be deployed through the normal processes to all wikis within the next two weeks.
[16:23:52] <cscott> but that's not going to help much by itself, because the pediapress server appears to be overloaded and so is rejecting the requests.
[16:23:59] <jem> Ah
[16:24:09] <cscott> we need to work out with pediapress whether they can continue to operate the service.
[16:24:34] <Nemo_bis> So we were DOS'ing them?
[16:24:36] <cscott> so i guess i'd recommend commenting out links to pediapress for the moment, and hopefully we can re-add them in a few weeks.
[16:24:56] <jem> Ok, will do in es.wiki then
[16:25:15] <Nemo_bis> Is the default Collection config still pointing to PediaPress rendering? The extension is expected t work at least partially out of the box, at least per its current docs
[16:25:17] <cscott> Nemo_bis: i don't think *we* were doing it -- i was testing their service at a point when I know that wp is sending them zero requests.
[16:25:40] <cscott> but i don't think their public server can handle the non-wp load.
[16:26:23] <cscott> part of the detail here is that we're splitting the requests slightly differently -- we used to process the post_zip request ourself, and then send them a zip file. that second stage seems to be able to handle more load, it's the post_zip request which is rejecting requests at the moment.
[16:26:55] <Nemo_bis> tracking bug https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71808
[16:27:14] <Nemo_bis> cscott: do you mean non-Wikimedia by non-wp?
[16:27:50] <Nemo_bis> they've traditionally handled most (or all?) non-Wikimedia wikis AFAICS; usually that's what I see around
[16:31:12] <cscott> yes, i mean non-wmf
[16:31:32] <jem> Ok, following both bugs
[16:31:43] <cscott> it seems they can't quite handle the non-wikimedia wikis at the moment, which makes me doubt that they will be able to handle the wmf wiki as well.
[16:32:54] <jem> Last question
[16:33:26] <jem> When the page shows a previously rendered version, I can't download it at all
[16:33:55] <jem> (And also, a plain text HTML link appears)
[16:36:30] <jem> Ok, I must correct myself
[16:37:08] <Nemo_bis> maybe that was a cached page
[16:37:15] <Nemo_bis> it's a bug which was fixed some weeks ago
[16:37:24] <Nemo_bis> still testing [[en:Overline]]...
[16:38:48] <jem> Probably, now it downloaded but it took some time...
[16:38:51] <jem> Well
[16:39:24] <Nemo_bis> lol even just mentioning Word breaks the rendering, it seems
[16:39:34] <Nemo_bis> "In Microsoft Word, overstriking of text can be accomplished with the" etc.
[16:42:03] <jem> Ok, that's everything for the moment, thanks for the help and keep on the good work
[16:42:38] <jem> I'll notify that user. See you :)
[16:45:54] <Nemo_bis> Did that user file the bug with huge PDFs?
[16:48:12] <Nemo_bis> yes, though he quit right now (!) https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71791
[16:48:46] <Nemo_bis> andre__: are the comments towards the top of the etherpad yours?
[16:50:06] <Nemo_bis> Does someone understand "--template-blacklist and --metabook don't work together "
[16:53:20] <andre__> Nemo_bis: no, not mine. Been rather inactive here so far, Phabricator stealing time :(
[16:53:28] <Nemo_bis> ok
[16:53:38] * Nemo_bis stabs phabricator
[16:54:07] <Nemo_bis> Now testing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ACF_Fiorentina , section "Kit evolution"
[16:54:36] <Nemo_bis> it's broken
[16:58:12] <Nemo_bis> Filed https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71812
[17:04:15] <Nemo_bis> * http://web.archive.org/web/20110800000000/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/899
[17:04:19] <Nemo_bis> ** Reference handling in printed books
[17:04:37] <Nemo_bis> Asked to show references closer to their usage, rather than at the end. Thoughts?
[17:05:01] <Reedy> At the bottom of the physical page type of thing?
[17:05:41] <Nemo_bis> For instance
[17:05:54] <Nemo_bis> "Alternatively, notes are often used in tables, and should be present where the author intended (i.e. immediately below the table)"
[17:08:20] <Nemo_bis> wtf, teh en.wiki dump contains things like: <u>wikitext</model>
[17:08:43] <Nemo_bis> more likely grep doing weird things with newlines
[17:08:46] <Nemo_bis> I hope!
[17:11:49] <Nemo_bis> Next: references group on https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Book&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=Hydrogen&oldid=628723283&writer=rdf2latex
[17:19:59] <Nemo_bis> MatmaRex_mobile: good news :) https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=39095
[17:21:10] <MatmaRex_mobile> :D
[17:21:26] <MatmaRex_mobile> i think there were a couple more bugs about reference handling, btw
[17:21:37] <Nemo_bis> 4 to be exact
[17:21:42] <Nemo_bis> Plus 4 which we just filed :P
[17:21:46] <Nemo_bis> now testing https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71094
[17:22:56] <Nemo_bis> Raymond_: do you want to test https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=47818
[17:26:30] <Nemo_bis> MatmaRex_mobile: maybe you have more ideas about http://web.archive.org/web/20111002214114/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/899
[17:27:03] <Raymond_> Nemo_bis: CAN DO
[17:27:07] <Raymond_> sorry
[17:28:43] <Nemo_bis> {{NFPA 704}} does not render properly http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Book&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=Lithium&oldid=346341406&writer=rl
[17:28:48] <Nemo_bis> Someone wants to test?
[17:33:42] <Nemo_bis> Filed https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71814 for more infobox support todos
[17:34:56] <Nemo_bis> cscott: is there a specific bug about outputting PDF in Latin script from a Serbian wiki e.g. http://sr.wikipedia.org/sr-el/Википедија ?
[17:35:00] <Nemo_bis> hi henna !
[17:35:13] * henna waves
[17:35:16] <cscott> Nemo_bis: i think that's probably language converter
[17:35:50] <Nemo_bis> cscott: sure :) but there's only one bug for language converter issues in parsoid, dunno if there should be something in OCG or something per language
[17:35:59] <Nemo_bis> Generation of the document file has failed. Status: ! Too many }'s.
[17:36:02] <Nemo_bis> wtf
[17:36:04] <cscott> so it falls in general under 'parsoid support for language converter', which is https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=52661 -- but that's actually only the variant part of language converter, not the script support.
[17:36:37] <cscott> you might as well file a bug in OCG for it, make it depend on 52661. there will probably be some amount of work needed in OCG to put all the pieces together.
[17:37:01] <cscott> maybe in the collection extension as well, in order to ensure that the selected variant is passed down to the renderer.
[17:37:17] <Nemo_bis> hmm
[17:40:11] <MatmaRex_mobile> Nemo_bis: sorry, currently i'm unable to have any thoughts about anything
[17:40:53] <Nemo_bis> :)
[17:40:56] <Nemo_bis> thanks
[17:41:20] <Raymond_> Nemo_bis: tested and bug closed :-)
[17:42:15] <Nemo_bis> yay
[17:43:35] <Nemo_bis> Now doing http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Book&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=Lithium&oldid=346341406&writer=rl
[17:52:42] <Nemo_bis> table again; cscott, this is a small one, any way to special case them? https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71818
[17:52:51] <Nemo_bis> Of course not on a case by case basis, would be a nightmare
[17:54:40] <Nemo_bis> We're about 56 % done with the bug day goal :D
[17:54:53] <Nemo_bis> Perfectly on track to complete by midnight
[17:56:43] * andre__ shakes his head, respectfully impressed
[17:59:17] <Nemo_bis> Does someone manage to get any suggestion from the book tool?
[17:59:25] <Nemo_bis> ** To see suggestions: 1) open book creator, 2) add at least one page, 3) click "suggest" option on top
[18:01:44] <Nemo_bis> Filed https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71819
[18:03:10] <Nemo_bis> Kelson: we have 6 open bugs about ZIM in Collection component, what to do about them?= https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=zim%20component%3Acollection&list_id=349929
[18:03:27] <Kelson> Nemo_bis: let me have a look
[18:04:44] <Kelson> Nemo_bis: I think https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=39651 should be closed as this is fixed in mwoffliner (and I guess in OCG too) cscott ?
[18:05:03] <Nemo_bis> btw http://wikieducator.org/Main_Page has ZIM export still
[18:05:09] <Nemo_bis> (didn't test though)
[18:05:17] <Kelson> Nemo_bis: with OCG?
[18:05:27] <Nemo_bis> no
[18:05:34] <Nemo_bis> but it's last stable release
[18:06:13] <Kelson> Nemo_bis: ok, in anycase this is a bug in the mwlib or pyzim.... not something which seems to be longer supported by pediapress.
[18:06:19] <cscott> Nemo_bis: what server is it using?
[18:07:10] <Nemo_bis> cscott: the extension's default i.e. pediapress, I assume; it's a smallish wiki in terms of traffic
[18:07:31] <cscott> yeah, and it's failing because pediapress's server seems to be down. :(
[18:07:31] <Nemo_bis> (though it might be bigger than wikibooks, lol; no idea)
[18:08:16] <Kelson> https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=37220 depends on the parsoid dev... give me a few minutes to find the bug on parsoid side
[18:08:25] <Nemo_bis> cscott: in case of rendering epic fail on an indic page, should I conclude the script is not supported? https://wikisource.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Book&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=%E0%A4%86%E0%A4%B0%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%AF%E0%A5%8B%E0%A4%A6%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%A6%E0%A5%87%E0%A4%B6%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%AF%E0%A4%B0%E0%A4%A4%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%A8%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%B2%E0%A4%BE&oldid=262309&writer=rdf2latex
[18:11:07] <cscott> Nemo_bis: that might be a parsoid fail. it's rare to see bundling fail otherwise.
[18:11:14] <cscott> and there are no images on that page to bundle
[18:11:54] <Kelson> Nemo_bis: hmm I don't find how to add a dependency https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=56304
[18:12:08] <Kelson> 37220 depends on 56304
[18:12:46] <Kelson> got it sorry
[18:13:56] <Nemo_bis> cscott: Cannot GET: http://parsoid-lb.eqiad.wikimedia.org/sourceswiki/%E0%A4%86%E0%A4%B0%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%AF%E0%A5%8B%E0%A4%A6%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%A6%E0%A5%87%E0%A4%B6%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%AF%E0%A4%B0%E0%A4%A4%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%A8%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%B2%E0%A4%BE
[18:14:07] <Nemo_bis> But I'm not sure that's the correct URL
[18:14:21] <Nemo_bis> maybe gwicke knows
[18:14:57] <Nemo_bis> wikisource.org has DBname sourceswiki, iw sometimes oldwikisource
[18:20:48] <Kelson> Nemo_bis: why not closing https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30511 ?
[18:20:59] <Kelson> Nemo_bis: ZIM/PDF already have the date in the medatada
[18:21:04] <Nemo_bis> *click*
[18:22:06] <Nemo_bis> Kelson: hm, but I think they meant for the print
[18:22:21] <Nemo_bis> Do printers print the date from PDF metadata?
[18:22:33] <Kelson> Nemo_bis: I don't think so
[18:27:51] <Nemo_bis> Kelson: but does it matter after all? usually printers add print date, which is at least an upper limit for the date of the content
[18:28:39] <Kelson> Nemo_bis: IMO, it does not really matter
[18:29:34] <Nemo_bis> yep, can be WORKSFORME'd
[18:39:42] <Nemo_bis> thanks rupert for https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71820
[18:49:06] <Nemo_bis> now looking for a devanagari Wikisource
[18:49:08] <andre__> cscott: Hey, can I trick you into commenting on https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71675#c9 ? Want to avoid bad blood if possible...
[18:52:25] <Nemo_bis> Kelson: closed
[18:52:41] <Kelson> Nemo_bis: thx
[18:54:35] <Nemo_bis> https://mr.wikisource.org/wiki/%E0%A4%AE%E0%A5%81%E0%A4%96%E0%A4%AA%E0%A5%83%E0%A4%B7%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%A0
[18:57:12] <Nemo_bis> hm, rendering initially failed
[18:59:41] <Nemo_bis> हेमंत अच्युत जोशी in room? :)
[18:59:58] <Nemo_bis> Sureshkhole, Nirmos
[19:05:35] <cscott> andre__: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71675#c10
[19:05:40] <andre__> thank you!
[19:07:32] <kepper> hi cscott - i just saw your invitiation in the comments
[19:07:42] <cscott> hello!
[19:07:52] <kepper> please to meet you :-)
[19:08:30] <Nemo_bis> now to unbalanced h2 https://www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Book&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=Project%3ASandbox&oldid=1187603&writer=rdf2latex
[19:08:31] <cscott> i think perhaps you'd been speaking to Erik and/or Matt Walker about this before?
[19:08:43] <Nemo_bis> hi kepper
[19:08:49] <kepper> hi Nemo_bis
[19:09:24] <kepper> I believe that Heiko wrote to Erik but there was no definite outcome
[19:10:00] <Nemo_bis> there wasn't Erik in cc
[19:10:38] <kepper> I was just wondering if you would want to turn PP off completely... so I might have reacted a little panic-y
[19:11:17] <Nemo_bis> Well, Erik communicated on ML the imminent closure of PediaPress months ago already
[19:11:57] <cscott> well, speaking for myself, i'd obviously prefer to have a functioning pediapress. ;)
[19:12:00] <kepper> I know. I thought it was a misunderstanding
[19:12:21] <kepper> we recently had some changes in our team. Volker and Ralf (schmir) left.
[19:12:50] <cscott> well, on the WMF side Matt Walker recently left, so some communication might have gotten lost there too.
[19:14:06] <cscott> but i'm the new proud owner of the OCG service. and there's a small ocg-team@wikimedia.org list, you can put that in your address book.
[19:14:29] <kepper> ok. I will :-)
[19:14:38] <cscott> actually, i take that back. i think services@wikimedia.org is the better list to use.
[19:14:54] <kepper> ok - will use that then ;-)
[19:15:23] <cscott> (i'm not sure that ocg-team allows posts from non-members, but services@ is a real WMF list: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/services )
[19:15:38] <kepper> I have to see if (and how) we can keep PP working. I am not sure, if I am able to handle the transition to the new ocg-format
[19:16:00] <cscott> and, while we're all talking about administrivia, i'll note that i'm actually on vacation next week, M-F. i'll be back the week after that.
[19:16:08] <kepper> k
[19:17:04] <cscott> kepper: the zip_post API should be unchanged, it's just a matter of having to do that on the public mw-serve and making sure it can handle the load.
[19:17:26] <kepper> in the last few days we received one or two orders via tools.pediapress.com - so it should be able to handle it.
[19:17:38] <kepper> I will check the server and make sure that it is up and running.
[19:17:40] <cscott> if you want us to do the .zip bundling and hand it off to you, then we might need to do some more work to make sure that our .zip file format is actually compatible.
[19:18:29] <kepper> I would like to check the server first
[19:18:43] <kepper> before we make any changes or tests with new formats
[19:19:23] <kepper> eventually, it's much cheaper to buy a stronger server than to spend days with development
[19:20:22] <Nemo_bis> +1
[19:21:05] <kepper> tomorrow I will talk with our new admin konrad about the toolserver
[19:23:17] <Nemo_bis> Now trying some Hadronic matter https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Book&bookcmd=render_collection&colltitle=Book:Hadronic_Matter&writer=rdf2latex
[19:23:28] <Nemo_bis> kepper: wanna help us with some bug triaging? :)
[19:23:49] <kepper> I am not sure if I am the right person for this ...
[19:23:54] <Nemo_bis> we've now retriaged about 80 % of PediaPress bugs https://etherpad.wikimedia.org/BugTriage-Collection
[19:24:12] <Nemo_bis> you only need to be able to click a "PDF" link and have a PDF reader :D
[19:24:22] <Nemo_bis> plus points if you know an indic language of course :P
[19:24:42] <kepper> it's great that you are taking care of some of those stale old bugs
[19:24:59] <kepper> I have a PDF reader - no problem with that :-)
[19:26:00] <ebraminio> Nemo_bis: You asked to check an Arabic Wikipedia to check if its characters are joining on PDF output and it looks good mostly and doesn't have that issues, thank you. I tried clear out https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/165465/ please let me known if is okay
[19:26:17] <kepper> 63 MB for a book - are you serious? maybe you should ask if people want their PDF for screen use or printing...
[19:26:34] <MusikAnimal> hello all, hope you don't mind me asking this here, I thought you may be able to help me faster. I think someone is trying to compromise my account! they requested a password change
[19:26:43] <ebraminio> *I checked and
[19:27:02] <hoo> MusikAnimal: That can happen... as long as your email account is safe, don't worry about it
[19:27:17] <ebraminio> however there is some aspects on PDF output of Arabic Wikipedia which can be made better
[19:27:23] <Reedy> hoo: Though, that patchset that is outstanding to cancel the temporary passwords...
[19:27:30] <ebraminio> I would say if you interested in
[19:27:43] <MusikAnimal> hoo: okay... just wanted to make sure! do I have to use the temporary password?
[19:27:52] <Reedy> Nope
[19:27:55] <MusikAnimal> I'm currently logged in and able to browse just fine, afraid to log out!
[19:28:13] <hoo> MusikAnimal: Just ignore it :)
[19:28:22] <hoo> Reedy: Is that in gerrit? I saw the bug
[19:28:27] <hoo> sometime back
[19:28:31] <Reedy> Yeah, I saw it recently
[19:28:35] <MusikAnimal> hoo: Okay thank you for the reassurance!
[19:28:39] <Reedy> needs a rebase
[19:29:26] <Reedy> hoo: https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/147496
[19:30:10] <Reedy> Luis' use case is very evident here too
[19:30:18] <hoo> Added myself, thanks
[19:33:44] <Nemo_bis> thanks ebraminio
[19:35:02] <Nemo_bis> is someone able to see problems with tt here? https://www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Book&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=Project%3ASandbox&oldid=1187436&writer=rdf2latex
[19:35:33] <Nemo_bis> kepper: size varies greatly, I don't know yet why
[19:35:43] <Nemo_bis> There is https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=68576
[19:36:07] <kepper> Nemo_bis: ah ok. You still have some issues with widows and orphans and unusual line breaks
[19:36:27] <Nemo_bis> kepper: please file :) https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=OCG
[19:41:33] <kepper> Nemo_bis: in general the new layout looks great, i think
[19:42:33] <Nemo_bis> Hm, the custom titles are ignored https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Books/Hadronic_Matter&oldid=317119756
[19:42:50] <Nemo_bis> I'm not sure they ever worked, actually
[19:43:13] <Nemo_bis> kepper: it looks more professional because of the professional/standard latex rendering :)
[19:44:05] <kepper> yeah - i have heard of a company that even tries to create books from Wikipedia with latex ;-)
[19:44:16] <Nemo_bis> Oh!
[19:44:17] <Nemo_bis> ;)
[19:44:47] <Nemo_bis> Helder: I don't remember, does one of your bugs ask for custom "page"/section title?
[19:45:03] <Nemo_bis> kepper: but that part was never on Wikimedia projects directly, was it
[19:45:26] <Nemo_bis> Helder: like this
[19:45:27] <Nemo_bis> :[[Up quark|''u'' quark]]
[19:45:40] <kepper> no - we thought of it as our secret sauce ;-)
[19:46:28] <Helder> I think the bug I reported was about the subtitles informed in the {{saved_book}} template, not about the text used in the page links
[19:46:44] <kepper> we put an enormous amount of work in handling tables and Wikipedia oddities
[19:47:25] <Nemo_bis> Helder: but I don't see any parameter to the template https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Book:Hadronic_Matter&action=edit&oldid=317119756
[19:47:25] <kepper> most of which became obsolete after switching to the new output engine
[19:47:39] <Nemo_bis> kepper: definitely not tables
[19:47:42] <Reedy> hoo|away: lol. CONFLICT (content): Merge conflict in includes/specials/SpecialPasswordReset.php
[19:47:43] <Reedy> not i18n
[19:48:12] <Helder> Nemo_bis: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=60578
[19:48:19] <kepper> Nemo_bis: what do you mean? we tried to detect headings and aspect ratios of tables
[19:48:39] <Nemo_bis> kepper: work on tables is not obsolete now, because tables are not output at all by OCG
[19:49:10] <Nemo_bis> Helder: so that bug doesn't cover the ''u'' quark thingy?
[19:49:10] <kepper> well, but you probably work directly with the html output, not with wikimarkup
[19:49:21] <Helder> yeah...
[19:49:26] <Nemo_bis> oki
[19:49:45] <Nemo_bis> kepper: "directly" but with Parsoid's HTML
[19:49:58] <Nemo_bis> Hmmm "Unbound caches _cache in mwlib.expr and parsedTemplateCache in mwlib.templ.evaluate.Expander result in huge memory usage and eventually out of memory errors when processing article collections as small as ~200000. "
[19:50:15] <Nemo_bis> 200000 what, bytes? pages? image? GB? :)
[19:50:48] <Helder> Nemo_bis: but supposedly, the title should be working:
[19:50:48] <Helder> https://github.com/wikimedia/mediawiki-extensions-Collection/blob/master/Collection.body.php#L832
[19:52:20] <Nemo_bis> Helder: ok, can you file then? it's completely ignored now
[19:53:27] <Nemo_bis> kepper: what do you think about references at the end of page http://web.archive.org/web/20111002214114/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/899
[19:54:35] <kepper> volker at his best :-)
[19:55:28] <kepper> I like references at the end of the page, but they create layout problems
[19:55:53] <kepper> your content area gets smaller and you have to watch out when positioning images
[19:56:13] <kepper> we tried floating images at the top and bottom of pages
[19:56:30] <kepper> this could have led to problems with footnotes
[19:56:56] <Nemo_bis> Filed https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71830 in the meanwhile
[19:57:11] <Nemo_bis> kepper: I don't remember the floating images
[19:57:55] <kepper> Moreover, if you use hadronic matter as a test case, you will loose half the page to the footnotes
[19:58:17] <kepper> floating images were not part of mwlib.rl
[19:58:29] <kepper> but they will create a much more pleasing layout
[19:58:30] <Nemo_bis> What's most silly in that PDF is the half dozen pages of credits for flags
[19:59:42] <kepper> footnotes at the end of an article are still the worst solution in terms of readability and user friendliness
[19:59:42] <Helder> done: https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71831
[19:59:52] <Nemo_bis> thanks Helder
[20:00:36] <Nemo_bis> Helder: I'd really really like to decide something on http://web.archive.org/web/20110800000000/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/828
[20:01:03] <Nemo_bis> It shouldn't be particularly hard, just some reuse of the category adding function (which is like 30 lines)
[20:02:03] <Helder> yeah that looks useful
[20:02:53] <Nemo_bis> Helder: can you file that too?
[20:02:58] <kepper> footnotes at the end of an article are still the worst solution in terms of readability and user friendliness
[20:03:05] <Nemo_bis> I dream a situation in which you can even feed links from a special page :)
[20:03:19] <Nemo_bis> kepper: do you think end of the book is better?
[20:03:19] <kepper> deja vú
[20:03:46] <kepper> for us it was the easiest and most uncomplicated solution, that's why we did it
[20:03:49] <Nemo_bis> cscott: are OCG progress messages localised?
[20:04:18] <Nemo_bis> kepper: end of book was?
[20:04:20] * Nemo_bis forgot
[20:04:24] <kepper> yes
[20:04:33] <cscott> Nemo_bis: they are partially localized. there's some work to be done there still.
[20:05:08] <cscott> (sorry, i'm behind on reading the irc log; i'll read through the backlog later)
[20:05:09] <kepper> only problem is that numbers get really huge, if you want to print say - 500 articles into a single volume
[20:05:21] <Nemo_bis> sure
[20:05:34] <Nemo_bis> kepper: true
[20:05:54] <Nemo_bis> Though nothing forces having a single numerical sequence
[20:05:55] <kepper> maybe it makes sense to have a separate footnote section at the end
[20:06:20] <kepper> maybe use an alphabetical sequence for each article and a numerical for the footnotes
[20:06:25] <Nemo_bis> I assume nobody sees problems in https://www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Book&bookcmd=render_article&arttitle=Project%3ASandbox&oldid=1187436&writer=rdf2latex then
[20:08:03] <kepper> ok folks, i have to go to bed. cu
[20:11:16] <Nemo_bis> bye
[20:13:00] <Nemo_bis> Filed as https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71834
[20:13:25] * gordo wanders off....
[20:13:43] <Nemo_bis> hi gordo
[20:13:46] <Helder> https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71835
[20:14:46] <gordo> Hi, sorry, to leave, but I very glad to see this work in progress. I have been fighting for some time with "Collecton"!
[20:15:22] <Nemo_bis> We all did, for several years :)
[20:20:06] <Nemo_bis> and https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71835 filed as well
[20:23:41] <Nemo_bis> let's see if there's some useful test case around here http://wikieducator.org/Math_Tables_and_Formulas/Basic_Math/Common_Number_Sets
[20:24:10] <Nemo_bis> doesn't look well :[
[20:24:37] <Nemo_bis> Helder: how to handle this problem? http://web.archive.org/web/20110600000000/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/951
[20:33:48] <Nemo_bis> testing book containing a redirect
[20:38:18] <Nemo_bis> Helder: oh, there is a way to change the title for a page, create a redirect :D
[20:38:29] <Nemo_bis> We should create millions redirects in Wikisource and Wikibooks :P
[20:39:32] <Nemo_bis> and that's 3 tickets closed at once
[20:43:26] <Nemo_bis> whee first PR for this project :P https://github.com/pediapress/mwlib.docbook/pull/1
[20:46:30] <Nemo_bis> https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71838
[20:50:07] <Nemo_bis> brion: what's the equivalent of MagicNumberedHeadings nowadays? http://web.archive.org/web/20110800000000/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/259
[20:51:41] <Nemo_bis> Helder: do you think the structure of this book is invalid? it doesn't render Benutzer:Hlamerz/Bücher/BGM
[20:51:54] <Nemo_bis> or cscott
[20:56:50] <Nemo_bis> 18 bugs left!
[20:57:38] <hoo> Nemo_bis: That would be aweomse :D
[20:57:42] <andre__> Impressive. and 63min/18bugs=3.5min
[20:57:54] <hoo> I know your triaging :)
[20:58:12] <Nemo_bis> I'll just WONTFIX everything that's left, of course
[20:58:25] <brion> Nemo_bis: no idea :D
[20:58:31] <Nemo_bis> oh, a dupe
[20:58:33] <Nemo_bis> ok brion
[21:01:17] <Nemo_bis> Any objection to closing as INVALID the following two? :) 1 min time to speak up
[21:01:20] <Nemo_bis> Add support for MagicNumberedHeadings
[21:01:21] <Nemo_bis> * http://web.archive.org/web/20110800000000/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/259
[21:01:25] <Nemo_bis> * http://web.archive.org/web/20110800000000/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/360
[21:01:28] <Nemo_bis> ** Error in handling links in templates to Wikipedia articles after stripping the oldid
[21:01:58] <Nemo_bis> csteipp or anomie: do you understand this one? "Protect all requests that modify the session against CSRF " http://web.archive.org/web/20110600000000/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/629
[21:02:18] <andre__> 259 is "worked around" anyway, yeah. 360 no idea.
[21:02:25] <andre__> no objections ever :)
[21:02:58] <anomie> Nemo_bis: Presumably adding CSRF tokens to various form submissions.
[21:03:12] <Nemo_bis> "Graceful fallback for non-js clients " is presumably still something we may strive for
[21:03:35] <Nemo_bis> anomie: do you think Collection extension might still have such problems? I hope not... but I doubt it was looked into much
[21:05:02] <csteipp> Nemo_bis: Wow, do they not do csrf tokens anywhere? That's kinda bad...
[21:07:35] <Nemo_bis> csteipp: I have no idea :) I asked you two to find out
[21:07:36] <Nemo_bis> :P
[21:07:49] <Nemo_bis> That bug is 5 years old... but most of these 5 years old bugs are still valid :[
[21:07:55] <Nemo_bis> https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44187 saved books drafts?!?
[21:08:06] <Nemo_bis> I'd WONTFIX this one, saving to userspace is draft-y enough
[21:08:14] <Nemo_bis> Filed https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71840
[21:08:46] <andre__> it's at least an enhancement request for new functionality, not "\minor"
[21:09:43] <andre__> and "userspace" feels could also feel like 'worksforme'. and the comment that 44185 would solve this more elegantly also makes it a wontfix? so many options...
[21:12:58] <Nemo_bis> yeah, now i'm unsure myself :P
[21:13:09] <Nemo_bis> needly in haystack... http://web.archive.org/web/20111002081258/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/600
[21:14:22] <Nemo_bis> (closed; but if someone finds the test case with magic why not)
[21:14:23] <Nemo_bis> * http://web.archive.org/web/20110800000000/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/680
[21:14:26] <Nemo_bis> ** Use more compact style for "Image Sources, Licenses and Contributors"
[21:14:40] <Nemo_bis> I'd use the hadronic matter example with 6 pages of flag licenses :P
[21:16:04] <Nemo_bis> cscott: uh, I forgot this; are the /Print subpages used now? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Val/Print
[21:17:22] <Nemo_bis> the lead section of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alkali_metal is a jungle
[21:17:51] <Nemo_bis> cscott: for context, at some point /Print subpages were introduced for "print-friendly" versions of templates
[21:20:47] <Nemo_bis> tgr: should we add more tracking categories for these sort of files too? :) http://web.archive.org/web/20111002214301/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/596
[21:24:36] <Nemo_bis> testing some https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Fair_use_images_of_art
[21:27:53] <Nemo_bis> they're not included, ok
[21:31:14] <Nemo_bis> got sick of this one:
[21:31:15] <Nemo_bis> * http://web.archive.org/web/20110800000000/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/680
[21:31:18] <Nemo_bis> ** Use more compact style for "Image Sources, Licenses and Contributors"
[21:31:21] <Nemo_bis> ** WONTFIX, makes no sense to compress licensing information before cleaning it up https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Files_and_licenses_concept
[21:31:35] <Nemo_bis> objections? any idea how to formulate it in an actionable way?
[21:35:04] <Nemo_bis> hah, RoanKattouw's favourite, nested ref https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alkali_metal#cite_ref-38
[21:35:18] <Nemo_bis> "Standard Uncertainty and Relative Standard Uncertainty". CODATA reference.
[21:35:24] <Nemo_bis> perfect example
[21:35:50] <RoanKattouw> That's a note pointing to a reference
[21:35:57] <RoanKattouw> So at least they're not in the same numbering namespace
[21:36:33] <Nemo_bis> true
[21:36:47] <Nemo_bis> Does that make it any better for the parser?
[21:37:10] <RoanKattouw> No, it just breaks my brain slightly less
[21:37:24] <Nemo_bis> :)
[21:37:48] <Nemo_bis> RoanKattouw: imagine when the note points to a reference which is not even on the same printed page
[21:38:23] <Nemo_bis> Though perhaps OCG avoids that
[21:46:26] <Nemo_bis> cscott: is it intentional for OCG to ignoire <big>?
[21:47:28] <Nemo_bis> parsoid doesn't, good :) http://parsoid-lb.eqiad.wikimedia.org/mediawikiwiki/?oldid=1216039
[21:48:24] <cscott> no, there are just a few HTML tags I overlooked when I wrote the pdf backend. most of those turn out not to be missed much, like <big>.
[21:48:42] <cscott> but if there's a legit use case in a page, file a bug and i can implement it.
[21:52:25] <Nemo_bis> cscott: no specific page mentioned, let's wait for one
[21:55:32] <Nemo_bis> https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71847
[21:55:59] <Nemo_bis> 5 bugs left :P
[21:58:49] <Nemo_bis> 3
[21:58:58] <Nemo_bis> cscott: does OCG handle private wikis in any way?
[22:00:14] <Nemo_bis> ugh
[22:01:55] <Nemo_bis> I think not, so https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71849
[22:04:00] <Nemo_bis> Reedy: can you restore https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Headbomb/TestShroom
[22:04:04] <Nemo_bis> hi ireas
[22:04:13] <ireas> hi Nemo_bis
[22:04:45] <Reedy> Done
[22:04:48] <Nemo_bis> thanks
[22:05:06] <Nemo_bis> last one :( http://web.archive.org/web/20111002161759/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/383
[22:05:38] <Reedy> Your guess of midnight wasn't far off :P
[22:06:21] <Nemo_bis> :D
[22:06:53] <Nemo_bis> err, what's the expected PDF output for such a thing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Headbomb/TestShroom
[22:08:01] <Nemo_bis> hmm is it a table
[22:08:27] <Nemo_bis> of course
[22:08:46] <Nemo_bis> grrrrrrrr
[22:10:22] <Nemo_bis> https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71851
[22:15:16] <Nemo_bis> I think http://web.archive.org/web/20110600000000/http://code.pediapress.com/wiki/ticket/383 is fixed... there is no JS-y updating of that stuff, just a form
[22:15:21] <Nemo_bis> So that's it
[22:15:48] <andre__> I think I can't express in words how impressed I am. I seriously didn't expect that you'll manage to go through all tickets. Congratulations!
[22:15:51] <andre__> Do you plan to send a summary to wikitech-l and update https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Bug_management/Triage/201410 (or shall I try the latter)?
[22:16:04] <Reedy> Subject: Fuck Extension:Collection
[22:16:07] <Nemo_bis> I'll paste some stuff
[22:16:28] <Nemo_bis> can someone restore /topic
[22:20:29] <Nemo_bis> 38 bugzilla reports added, if I count correctly
[22:27:45] <Nemo_bis> Can somoene sprinkle some <nowiki>? :) https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Bug_management/Triage/201410
[22:27:58] <Nemo_bis> andre__: I let you pull the exact numbers from bugzilla ;)
[22:29:28] <andre__> heh, sure!
[22:37:52] <Nemo_bis> hmpf, did my mailing list update go through or not
[22:44:32] <Nemo_bis> mailman plays me tricks, better wait tomorrow
[23:18:31] <cscott> Nemo_bis: thanks for your great work today!
[23:22:51] <andre__> +1