Talk:User language

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Archives: 2007, 2008, 2011.

Language Code Proficiency Level Categories: en vs. mi[edit]

The language code proficiency level categories at User language written in English would define me as a 'native speaker' of language code mi (henceforth referred to as 'the reo'). However, the reo translation used at [[1]] for level "N" can be translated as 'the Maori language is the language of upbringing of this person'. As the reo was not the primary language of my home as a child, I have opted to prioritise [[2]] definition over the User language English language version. It is recommended that a standardisation test be developed to measure equivalence of categories between languages. --Te Karere 12:17, 12 November 2011 (UTC)

Parser function sorts differently[edit]

The {{#babel:}} parser function provided by the Babel extension (in use on this wiki, and presumably intended to eventually replace the template-based Babel scheme) places users into the same categories as this template, but sorts them according to fluency level (so, e.g., "1" = level 1, not native level ["N" is used for native]). This template and {{User language category}} should really be changed to match the way the parser function categorizes users. As things currently stand, the description in the various user-language categories of how users are sorted is (mostly?) just plain wrong. - dcljr 08:37, 31 January 2012 (UTC)

I've updated the English text and examples, but the translations will need to be updated manually for each category. —Pathoschild 02:49:12, 01 February 2012 (UTC)

Neapolitan language (nap)[edit]

The neapolitan box for the babel it's in italian. We should write it in neapolitan. Where can I modify it? -- Vicipaedianus X 10:33, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

See the doc of the MediaWiki extension, it explains the installation. Notably the Babel extension depends on some "MediaWiki:*" resource pages, whose content can be translated in TranslateWiki.net. When there"s no available translation in "MediaWiki:resourcename/languagecode" ; for the specified languagecode (which is the user UI language; not the content language), MediaWiki trt to locate some fallbacks using language configuration of fallbacks (that's why it finds Italian as a fallback for Neapolitan), or otherwise use the default content language of the wiki (English on Meta-Wiki); and this is even fails it will try the untranslated value of "MediaWiki:resourcename" (if it also does not exists, it will just display the "resourcename" between parentheses, instead of displaying a red link to "MediaWiki:resourcename", because pages in "MediaWiki:*" or normally not editable except by admins; but these pages are fed by a bot importing transaltions from TranslateWiki.net).
In some of the translations proposed in "MediaWiki:*/llanguagecode" there are some configuration variables to specifiy the format of template names to use to render each box. In most Wikimedia wikis they are defined in "Template:User <languagecode>-<proficiency>" (such as "Template:User en-N").
The text of the Babel header is in one of these "Mediawiki:*" resources translatable in Translatewiki.net. So go to it and add the missing napolitan translations. A bot will import them within the day on MetaWiki and other wikis that have chosen to subscribe to import Babelbox extension (the MediaWiki import bot taking data from TranslateWiki.net performs so,e consistency checks and notifies the administrators of each wiki when there are new sets of resources: these imports may be blocked or reviewed before being imported.
Be careful: when translating resources in TranslateWiki.net, the texts must be fully independant of the target wiki that will import them otherwise they will be blocked, and you'll need to contact a local wiki administrator to edit a MediaWiki:*/* page (but you can already look at its content).
For example the Babel box header is in MediaWiki:Babel, its Italian version is in MediaWiki:Babel/it, the neapolitan version should be in MediaWiki:Babel/nap (which curently has the same content as Italian, it is not using a fallback)... So look in TranslateWiki.net for the resource named "Babel" in the project for MediaWiki extension translations : there's an associated translation group containing these resources for that Babel extension
note that pages in "MediaWiki:*" cannot be transalted locally using the Translate extension; but TranslateWiki.net does use the Translate extension to allow users translating the MediaWiki UI and its extensions, or other opensourced projects. You need to create a local user account on TranslateWiki.net and logon there, separately from Wikimedia and confim your email account (SUL does not work there): Translatewiki.net is more restrictive than standard Wikimedia wikis, for security reasons. verdy_p (talk) 18:04, 1 June 2014 (UTC)

categories included by mistake[edit]

The use of the babel template in this page causes some (ru+en+az+fr) user language categories to be included in the page (and it shouldn't be). I know there's a way (like the "noinclude" markup) to prevent that, but I'm not that proficient in the "wiki grammer". can anybody fix that?
in this opportunity, is there a way in the language categories to see users with a specific language level? (not from level 2 and above, but only level 2. I tried to change the "from" keyword in the URL and I didn't find the right parameter). Hummingbird (talk) 14:42, 19 April 2015 (UTC)

Mandarin Chinese (cmn)[edit]

Why does {{#babel:cmn}} displays "English" rather than "Mandarin Chinese" (or the equivalent translated text)? A clean mediawiki vagrant instance shows "Mandarin Chinese" correctly. -- KTC (talk) 17:38, 25 July 2015 (UTC)

Maybe "Mandarin Chinese" is not supported by Wikimedia as separate language? See also related (probably) discussion - Requests for new languages/Wikipedia Mandarin Chinese. --Kaganer (talk) 12:42, 21 October 2015 (UTC)
Whether there is a specific language Wikipedia is unrelated to the display of babel language. The babel text displays correctly on other Wikimedia wikis such as Commons. The only place I have encountered an issue is here on Meta. -- KTC (talk) 00:51, 27 October 2015 (UTC)
I asked this issue to Nemo on your task and he told me that that should be modified on CLDR. --Liuxinyu970226 (talk) 09:36, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

Custom layout (babel-plain)[edit]

The "babel-plain" workaround is not working for me. It used to, but something must be broken or disappeared. ~ Ningauble (talk) 18:30, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

This was removed from css. Documentation is updated. --Kaganer (talk) 12:33, 21 October 2015 (UTC)
Cf. Phabricator task T33309 for enabling "plain" opt-out from header and footer links. ~ Ningauble (talk) 20:07, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

BiDi issues[edit]

Hi! cc: @EugeneZelenko

I noted some bidirectional issues related to the rendering of LTR type text snippets (as "This user can read and write intermediate English.") in RTL wikis:

test links for m:user:EugeneZelenko:

  1. b:ar:user:EugeneZelenko
  2. n:fa:user:EugeneZelenko
  3. q:he:user:EugeneZelenko
  4. s:yi:user:EugeneZelenko
  5. v:ar:user:EugeneZelenko
  6. w:yi:user:EugeneZelenko
  7. wikivoyage:ur:user:EugeneZelenko at incubator:user:EugeneZelenko
  8. wikt:yi:user:EugeneZelenko

failing test links for m:user:בײַ מיר ביסטו שיין:

  1. b:ar:user:בײַ מיר ביסטו שיין
  2. n:fa:user:בײַ מיר ביסטו שיין
  3. q:he:user:בײַ מיר ביסטו שיין
  4. s:yi:user:בײַ מיר ביסטו שיין
  5. v:ar:user:בײַ מיר ביסטו שיין
  6. w:yi:user:בײַ מיר ביסטו שיין
  7. wikivoyage:ur:user:בײַ מיר ביסטו שיין at incubator:user:בײַ מיר ביסטו שיין
  8. wikt:yi:user:בײַ מיר ביסטו שיין
added: 23:22, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

requirements:

  1. the text mentioned above should be aligned left
  2. the final colon was at the wrong place; it was at the beginning of the second LTR line; it should be at the end
  3. the listed links to the WMF projects where adjacent to the rendered Babel templates making a great difference between the rendering at LTR WMF projects and the rendering at RTL WMF projects

https://meta.wikimedia.org/?diff=13253599&oldid=863968 shows a change which fixed the BiDirectional issues for this particular global user page.

Please see also template_talk:Translatable template#BiDi_issues. Best regards lɛʁi ʁɑjnhɑʁt (leri raynhart)

‫·‏לערי ריינהארט‏·‏Th‏·‏T‏·‏email me‏·‏‬ 21:14, 22 August 2015 (UTC)


Origins of the classification[edit]

It seems like a great system to classify language skills. I'm curious as to where it is from. Is there a broader theoretical background / empirical research it is set against, or is it based on practices and traditions of wikipedians? Is there information beyond the one sentence as to how to classify yourself?

Thanks, the system looks really good, and it's a great feature for Wikipedia to have some standards for proficiency marking.

Pusle8 (talk) 09:19, 6 January 2016 (UTC)

Discrepancy between page and template?[edit]

Wierdly, the page describing the classification has 0-5+N while the template only has 0-4+N levels. Which one is meant as correct, and why the difference? Thanks.

I mean the difference between these two: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User_language https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Template:User_language . Pusle8 (talk) 09:39, 6 January 2016 (UTC)

Issue with ase[edit]

The language code "ase" (American Sign Language) doesn't seem to work correctly in user language boxes. See my userpage for an example: next to "ase-1", it reads "This user has basic knowledge of English" (rather than American Sign Language). If someone could let me know how to fix this, I would very much appreciate it. Thank you! Mr. Granger (talk) 00:17, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

The code "ase" works correctly for Wikipedia user pages but not Wikimedia user pages. AnotherPoint (talk) 18:46, 11 December 2016 (UTC)
Good point, thanks. Any idea how we can make it work for Meta userpages? Mx. Granger (talk) 18:51, 11 December 2016 (UTC)
I posted a bug report to the discussion page for the Babel extension and phabricator (phab:T152925). After some testing, I noticed that ASE is not the only language with this issue on Wikimedia. Hopefully this will get fixed soon. AnotherPoint (talk) 20:14, 11 December 2016 (UTC)
There are a bunch of similar issues on this wiki. For example:
I can hard-code |jam-0 into my babel. If I do that, it says (in jam) that I can't speak English. If I try to use a {{#switch| call, it doesn't show up at all, as if it doesn't recognize jam as a possible language choice. And I don't think the response I got below about bypassing the cache is the right explanation for my other question below, either, as far as it goes. StevenJ81 (talk) 22:23, 11 December 2016 (UTC)
Example links (examples always help!) - example revision link with 5 babel boxes, 3 correct and 2 wrong (and a screenshot for comparison after it gets fixed)
@Mr. Granger: I believe you (or someone) needs to complete the ASE translations at https://translatewiki.net/wiki/Special:Translate/ext-babel?group=ext-babel&language=ase&filter=&action=translate (Note: It's not a Wikimedia SUL wiki, so you'll need to create a new account per instructions at main page, https://translatewiki.net/ )
@AnotherPoint: Similar to the above, but someone just needs to correct the error in the translated "babel-x-n" translations (the second batch of near-identical messages) at translatewiki. The instructions say "The text “English” should also be localised to the language name of the Babel box." but that wasn't done correctly e.g. https://translatewiki.net/w/i.php?title=MediaWiki:Babel-3-n/jam&action=edit compared to https://translatewiki.net/w/i.php?title=MediaWiki:Babel-3-n/de&action=edit
Hope that helps, and hopefully all correct (this is not within my area of expertise). Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 18:34, 12 December 2016 (UTC)
@Quiddity:Thank you for this information. I have started the work on ASE Translatewiki (waiting on permissions from @Metalhead64:). As I noted earlier, multiple languages seem to have issues with Babel userboxes in Wikimedia. It would help if the settings in Wikipedia, where these issues seem to be solved, could somehow be copied over. However, for the moment, this information will help document what other users need to do to get their favourite Babel userboxes fixed. AnotherPoint (talk) 19:16, 12 December 2016 (UTC)
Thank you, Quiddity! That's just what I was looking for. Mx. Granger (talk) 19:48, 12 December 2016 (UTC)
@Quiddity and Quiddity (WMF): Thank you. That's a start. See the phabricator, though: there is still an issue that some of the parser functions do not recognize jam as a possible language choice. (As an example: go to my user page and set the user language to "Patois". My Babel is set to add "jam-0" if the language is set to "jam". But that doesn't work. (In contrast, if you set the user language to "Hindi", Babel does add "hi-0".) StevenJ81 (talk) 21:06, 12 December 2016 (UTC)
@StevenJ81: Oh, I understand now, interesting. (Handy example links, your userpage with: ?uselang=jam, and ?uselang=hi, and ?uselang=en). I'll investigate... Ah, it looks like there's yet another system available here, so you'll need to follow the instructions in Template:User_language#Translating_the_template to get that to work (IIUC). Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 21:50, 12 December 2016 (UTC)
@Quiddity (WMF): I see your point. Let me take a shot at this and let you know. StevenJ81 (talk) 21:54, 12 December 2016 (UTC)
@Quiddity (WMF): That didn't work. That affects {{User language}}, but not Babel. StevenJ81 (talk) 21:02, 19 December 2016 (UTC)
@Quiddity (WMF) and AnotherPoint: The fix to the "babel-x-n" pages worked for both of us. (I did notice on translatewiki.net that the babel-0-n/ase page hadn't been updated, so I did that.) As for my other problem, I needed to have the page MediaWiki:Lang/jam created here. Once it was, my problem was fixed. StevenJ81 (talk) 23:34, 21 December 2016 (UTC)

Multilingualism[edit]

Just wondering ... why doesn't {{#babel: ...}} output the header and footer of the box itself in the interface language? (It does that on Wikidata and Commons, as far as it goes.) StevenJ81 (talk) 21:31, 16 May 2016 (UTC)

Caching issues, aka load issues. Wikidata bypass the cache, I guess Commons do that too. It is a configuration variable in the extension. — Jeblad 22:08, 16 June 2016 (UTC)

Help page?[edit]

Isn't this an extension-specific help page, and as such should be on Mediawiki.org? — Jeblad 22:09, 16 June 2016 (UTC)

Mistaken tag:CHN[edit]

Minor error: CHN currently codes as English. It should read out as Chinukwawa. Thank you for your attention! 曙䬠 - Sant'owax Q'ulsnas (talk) 20:48, 16 July 2016 (UTC)

Ryu infoboxes and ruby[edit]

As you can see, these are written in English and talk about English. I've tried looking where to fix this myself to no avail, so if someone could point me in the right direction I'd be happy to at least provide the needed Ryukyuan text. Also, does this template support ruby for Japanese characters? If so, I'd like the ryu infoboxes to use it. ミーラー強斗武 (StG88ぬ会話) 06:48, 31 December 2016 (UTC)

  • Apparently I created the template at Template:User language/ryu and it accepts ruby, however I still can't find where to fix these old Babel infoboxes. You can literally copy and paste from the User language/ryu template, but it needs to get fixed. ミーラー強斗武 (StG88ぬ会話) 12:17, 31 December 2016 (UTC)
  • Start by going to translatewiki:MediaWiki:Babel-0-n/ryu (then ...Babel-1-n/ryu, etc.) and editing those pages. You will need an account and translator rights at translatewiki.net. If you can't do that, but are willing to write out exactly how you would like those boxes to appear, I'll copy and paste them for you. Be sure you somehow indicate exactly what part of what you are writing is the name of the language itself, so that I get the markup correct. StevenJ81 (talk) 17:06, 2 January 2017 (UTC)
@StevenJ81: Alright, I'll put the code in a box below. They're sorted from 0-5 and N. The language name is bolded and linked to a category, and the fluency level is bolded without a hyperlink:
Thank you. ミーラー強斗武 (StG88ぬ会話) 08:30, 3 January 2017 (UTC)
Hi, Sturmgewehr88. I need you to give me only the text, with the only markup in it being a bold markup for the name of the language itself. Right now, that page in translatewiki (for level 0) reads exactly:

This user has [[$1|no]] knowledge of [[$2|English]] (or understands it with considerable difficulty).

So what I need is the exact analogue of that in Ryukuan at levels 0-5 and -N. Please leave out all subtemplates, etc. thanks. StevenJ81 (talk) 13:54, 3 January 2017 (UTC)
@StevenJ81: Alright, I removed the subtemplates. Again, thank you for your help. ミーラー強斗武 (StG88ぬ会話) 23:56, 3 January 2017 (UTC)
@Sturmgewehr88: Done. It will take 2–3 days for it to appear in Wikimedia projects. Let me know how it comes out. StevenJ81 (talk) 03:54, 8 January 2017 (UTC)
@StevenJ81: Sorry to bug you again, but it's been almost three weeks and the template still doesn't seem to be updated. ミーラー強斗武 (StG88ぬ会話) 00:39, 21 January 2017 (UTC)

Klingon (tlh) is broken[edit]

User language
tlh-N This user has a native understanding of English.
tlh-5 This user has professional knowledge of English.
tlh-4 This user has near native speaker knowledge of English.
tlh-3 This user has advanced knowledge of English.
tlh-2 This user has intermediate knowledge of English.
tlh-1 This user has basic knowledge of English.
tlh-0 This user has no knowledge of English (or understands it with considerable difficulty).
Users by language

It all shows English instead of Klingon. Could someone please fix that? K'plah! --.js ((())) 20:01, 15 January 2017 (UTC)

See the related discussion #Issue with ase above. In that case, the translations could be added at https://translatewiki.net/ , but as far as I can tell translatewiki doesn't seem to recognize Klingon. Pinging @Quiddity (WMF): could you help with this too? Mx. Granger (talk) 20:51, 15 January 2017 (UTC)
Klingon was disabled as a language in 2005. I see references at https://translatewiki.net/wiki/Translatewiki.net_languages#Legacy_languages_and_codes and m:History of the Klingon Wikipedia. Hope that helps. Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 22:10, 16 January 2017 (UTC)