Wikimania 2011/Bids/Public meeting log/2010-03-30

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This meeting look place on March 30, 2010, between 17:01 and 19:01 UTC. All times in this log are UTC.

New York City[edit]

Mar 30 10:01:03 <cary>	Hi everyone!
Mar 30 10:01:15 <cary>	Please feel free to IM me or let me know in another channel if you want to ask the bidders a question
Mar 30 10:01:19 <cary>	we're starting with New York City
Mar 30 10:01:36 <cary>	And Pharos and benmoskowitz are here for New York
Mar 30 10:01:57 <cary>	If you'd like to start us off fellows?
Mar 30 10:02:09 <benmoskowitz>	please :)
Mar 30 10:02:15 <cary>	 /aside: if there is anyone here from Toronto, please let me know in PM./
Mar 30 10:02:38 <Pharos>	ok, I thought it was more you asking questions, but here goes...
Mar 30 10:03:00 <cary>	:)  Last year's public meeting log is at
Mar 30 10:03:14 <Pharos>	We think that NYC would be the ideal location to host Wikimania on thec 10th anniversary of Wikipedia
Mar 30 10:03:38 <benmoskowitz>	A few reasons for this
Mar 30 10:03:51 <Pharos>	we can attract a very large audience both locally and internationally
Mar 30 10:04:27 <Pharos>	and give wikimedia issues a very high profile in the eyes of the world
Mar 30 10:04:50 <Pharos>	we also have an excellent free culture movement team
Mar 30 10:05:03 <Pharos>	with experience in running large conferences
Mar 30 10:05:08 <Pharos>	especially ben :)
Mar 30 10:05:23 <benmoskowitz>	so, if you have a look at our bid page
Mar 30 10:05:29 <benmoskowitz>	we have a few very smart people on board
Mar 30 10:05:31 <Pharos>	something about OVC, Ben?
Mar 30 10:05:41 <benmoskowitz>	sure, will be happy to talk about ovc as well
Mar 30 10:05:58 <benmoskowitz>	cumulatively, we have lots of experience with event planning
Mar 30 10:05:58 <cary>	benmoskowitz, please provide links when you mention pages :)
Mar 30 10:06:04 <benmoskowitz>	nyc and elsewhere
Mar 30 10:06:18 <benmoskowitz>
Mar 30 10:06:30 <benmoskowitz>	pharos has coordinated a number of wiki conferences
Mar 30 10:06:45 <benmoskowitz>	i have coordinated two free culture conferences
Mar 30 10:06:52 <Pharos>	here is OVC, run by Ben:
Mar 30 10:06:53 <benmoskowitz>
Mar 30 10:06:58 <benmoskowitz>	and of course ovc
Mar 30 10:07:06 <Pharos>	similar size and audience, same venue at NYU
Mar 30 10:07:12 <benmoskowitz>	elizabeth stark and fred benenson have also worked on all these events
Mar 30 10:07:27 <benmoskowitz>	and we have invited andrew rasiej, co-founder of personal democracy forum
Mar 30 10:07:39 <benmoskowitz>	which holds an annual nyc conference, again on the scale of wikimania
Mar 30 10:07:49 <benmoskowitz>
Mar 30 10:08:04 <benmoskowitz>	cumulatively, we are a very capable team
Mar 30 10:08:20 <benmoskowitz>	and buttressed by a very strong local open knowledge/free culture community
Mar 30 10:08:34 <benmoskowitz>
Mar 30 10:08:46 <jowen>	What was the scale of those events, and how were they sponsored?
Mar 30 10:09:06 <benmoskowitz>	open video conference was about 900 people over the course of two days
Mar 30 10:09:15 <benmoskowitz>	a range of private and non-profit sponsors
Mar 30 10:09:25 <benmoskowitz>
Mar 30 10:09:39 <benmoskowitz>	OVC was also extremely cost-effective
Mar 30 10:09:43 <Pharos>	WikiConference NY was smaller, about 100+
Mar 30 10:09:58 <Pharos>	WikiConference NY was $1000 total
Mar 30 10:10:14 <benmoskowitz>	total budget for OVC was about $85k, including travel and accommodation for 40 VIPs
Mar 30 10:10:24 <jowen>	As we know sponsorships are very important to maintain low cost for participants.  What experience does the bidding team have with obtaining large sponsorships to support cost.
Mar 30 10:10:48 <benmoskowitz>	speaking for myself, we're very comfortable
Mar 30 10:10:56 <benmoskowitz>	have a look at the sponsor page
Mar 30 10:11:04 <benmoskowitz>	the PDF team is even more capable
Mar 30 10:11:12 <benmoskowitz>
Mar 30 10:11:49 <benmoskowitz>	if you look at the team and our experience you'll probably feel good about our prospects :)
Mar 30 10:12:36 <MarianoC1>	those seam to be more technology oriented sponsors; do you think you can get more free knowledge oriented sponsors?
Mar 30 10:12:36 <Pharos>	yes, i feel we are very strong in this regard
Mar 30 10:12:47 <MarianoC1>	or perhaps on communications
Mar 30 10:12:57 <jowen>	Will WMNY be sponsoring the event and using WMNY as the financial supporter for this event?
Mar 30 10:13:19 <benmoskowitz>	peer back into the archives too etc
Mar 30 10:13:36 <Pharos>	probably WMNYC will not be sponsoring directly
Mar 30 10:13:55 <benmoskowitz>	there are a number of orgs that would be happy to serve this role
Mar 30 10:13:58 <Pharos>	although the chapter will be playing a very active part
Mar 30 10:14:07 <jowen>	will the finances for Wikimania be funneled through WMNYC?
Mar 30 10:14:20 <jowen>	or will this be a separate entity?
Mar 30 10:15:14 <benmoskowitz>	we will not create a separate entity
Mar 30 10:15:32 <benmoskowitz>	at the discretion of the selection committee, and depending on a number of factors
Mar 30 10:15:38 <benmoskowitz>	there are 3-4 orgs that could serve this role
Mar 30 10:15:53 <benmoskowitz>	incl. potentially pdf, mozilla, others
Mar 30 10:16:13 <benmoskowitz>	we aren't worried about that administrative detail just yet, but we're confident in that regard
Mar 30 10:16:36 <benmoskowitz>	it's one of the benefits of having a diverse planning team
Mar 30 10:16:45 <benmoskowitz>	we work within a pretty broad network
Mar 30 10:17:06 <Seddon>	Other than the key planning team, how many volunteers will be actively involved in the run up organisation of the conference?
Mar 30 10:17:29 <Pharos>	well, the key planning team is quite limited
Mar 30 10:17:33 <Pharos>	as listed
Mar 30 10:17:44 <Pharos>	it only includes one member of wikimedia nyc
Mar 30 10:18:01 <benmoskowitz>	but the list isn't comprehensive
Mar 30 10:18:13 <Pharos>	mmany more of our members will participate as volunteers
Mar 30 10:18:17 <benmoskowitz>	in the ovc experience, we found it wortwhile to appoint a volunteer coordinator
Mar 30 10:18:25 <benmoskowitz>	most likely anne jonas would serve that role
Mar 30 10:18:35 <benmoskowitz>	at ovc, she managed about 50 volunteers from the local community
Mar 30 10:18:38 <Pharos>	many more free culture volunteers will participate than are listed
Mar 30 10:18:40 <benmoskowitz>	leading up to, during, and after
Mar 30 10:19:06 <Pharos>	we can expect students coming from universities up and down the northeast US to come and volunteer
Mar 30 10:19:12 <benmoskowitz>	have a look at the appendix again
Mar 30 10:19:26 <benmoskowitz>	each of the organizations under would bring volunteers
Mar 30 10:19:39 <benmoskowitz>	as well as the universities
Mar 30 10:19:53 <Seddon>	so in short you are cofident that with your large volunteer pool itll be easy to draft in people with organising the conference from now until day 1 of the conferece?
Mar 30 10:19:58 <jowen>	Can you tell me more about your plans for Wiki World Fair
Mar 30 10:20:08 <Pharos>	yes, be glad to
Mar 30 10:20:09 <benmoskowitz>	yes, we are very confident
Mar 30 10:20:44 <jowen>	also if you can add to your bid your vision for Wikimania and Wikimania programs that would be helpful
Mar 30 10:20:46 <Pharos>	the great thing about a city like new york is that we have a large and diverse group of nonprofits and activists
Mar 30 10:21:05 <Pharos>	in the open source and free culture fields
Mar 30 10:21:43 <Pharos>	we will be inviting members of the Free Culture Alliance and others to host pavillions at the fair
Mar 30 10:21:59 <Pharos>	showing off their particular contributions to wiki/freeculture
Mar 30 10:22:34 <Pharos>	this is a way to engage a much broader audience than just wikimania itself
Mar 30 10:23:15 <cary>	okay, about 8 more minutes and then we'll move on to the Haifa bid.
Mar 30 10:23:17 <cary>	7
Mar 30 10:23:18 <Pharos>	and to reach the general public with more complex ideas than "anyone can edit"
Mar 30 10:23:38 <benmoskowitz>	on this aspect
Mar 30 10:23:41 <cary>	If anyone else would like to pose a question, feel free to PM to me.
Mar 30 10:23:45 <benmoskowitz>	we're looking to city government for support
Mar 30 10:23:54 <cary>	(besides the Jury)
Mar 30 10:23:56 <benmoskowitz>	and early signs are good
Mar 30 10:23:57 <jowen>	It would be nice if you could add more details about the logistics of such an event (wiki world fair) and your vision for events and programs to the bid.
Mar 30 10:24:04 <Austin>	ben: can you elaborate a bit?
Mar 30 10:24:08 <Austin>	(How good?)
Mar 30 10:24:21 <Austin>	Don't need specifics, just a general idea of how far that's progressed.  :)
Mar 30 10:24:31 <Pharos>	we just got a letter from the brooklyn borough president
Mar 30 10:24:37 <benmoskowitz>	the city wants to cultivate and retain high tech and web activity
Mar 30 10:24:48 <benmoskowitz>	also working on city council
Mar 30 10:24:55 <benmoskowitz>	the tech meetup ny is 10k strong
Mar 30 10:25:05 <Pharos>	the borough president's office has quite broad responsibility for street fairs
Mar 30 10:25:07 <benmoskowitz>	and part of our planning team includes folks who are part of that effort
Mar 30 10:25:19 <jowen>	One last question for me.  It is often difficult for some countries to receive travel visas to the US, how is your bidding team planning to work to get as many countries to participate? It is also expensive to obtain these visas form my understanding.
Mar 30 10:26:02 <benmoskowitz>	we're preparing letters and will be speaking to the state department to see what we can do ahead of time
Mar 30 10:26:17 <benmoskowitz>	in terms of classifying the event properly, and doing diligence ahead of time
Mar 30 10:26:29 <benmoskowitz>	we're aware that some folks have concerns about it
Mar 30 10:26:35 <jowen>	In your past experience with conferences how did you deal with these issues?
Mar 30 10:26:50 <benmoskowitz>	it hasn't been an issue with conferences like OVC
Mar 30 10:27:02 <benmoskowitz>	for OVC, we had 100% success rate for people who asked for letters
Mar 30 10:27:05 <benmoskowitz>	and for VIPS
Mar 30 10:27:25 <benmoskowitz>	including guests from nigeria, egypt, et etc
Mar 30 10:27:37 <benmoskowitz>	the key is leaving enough time
Mar 30 10:27:45 <benmoskowitz>	because securing a visa can take a few weeks
Mar 30 10:27:56 <benmoskowitz>	one thing we will do is ensure our communications with attendees stress this fact
Mar 30 10:28:01 <jowen>	great.. I am glad that you have thought about this.  And look forward to reading the additional details you will be adding about your vision.  Thank you for putting together such a complete and competitive bid.
Mar 30 10:28:03 <benmoskowitz>	we will be available and supportive
Mar 30 10:28:08 <benmoskowitz>	thanks
Mar 30 10:28:11 <benmoskowitz>	if i may
Mar 30 10:28:22 <benmoskowitz>	the one thing i'd like to stress is that our team is very diverse
Mar 30 10:28:45 <benmoskowitz>	and that we have folks from all different sectors; edu, non-profit, commercial, et etc
Mar 30 10:28:55 <benmoskowitz>	cumulatively we bring a lot to bear
Mar 30 10:30:00 <cary>	Okay!
Mar 30 10:30:06 <cary>	thank you ben and Pharos


Mar 30 10:30:26 <cary>	Hi Deror
Mar 30 10:30:33 <cary>	who else is representing the Haifa team?
Mar 30 10:30:37 <Deror>	Hi
Mar 30 10:31:02 <Deror>	Also here is Dror Kamir, Liron Dorfman and Tomer A
Mar 30 10:31:55 <cary>	Okay, could you start us off?
Mar 30 10:31:59 <TomerA-il>	Hello
Mar 30 10:32:16 <Deror>	Sure.
Mar 30 10:32:45 <Deror>	As you know, Israel has a very active Wikipedian community, and for a few years, also a growing local chapter. Wikimiedia Israel, the local chapter in Israel has held several local wiki meets and conferences, as well as the Wiki academy which was held in Tel Aviv last spring and attracted about 250 – 300 attendees and a large media interest (it was broadcasted live on one of Israel's leading news websites).
Mar 30 10:33:14 <Deror>	Wikimedia Israel also organized the main event celebrating 100,000 articles in Hebrew Wikipedia. The event took place in the Tel Aviv University Law School, was attended by 100 wikipedians, and attracted, through the work of Wikimedia Israel, a wide media coverage.
Mar 30 10:33:25 <Deror>	Wikimedia Israel organizes and financially assists the Elef Milim image gathering
Mar 30 10:33:26 <Deror>	Project (a wikimeet held monthly), the Israeli Wikimedia Loves Art project, and wiki meetings throughout the year. Every year, between two to three wikimeets take place in Israel, attended by about 75 - 100 wikipedians.
Mar 30 10:33:45 <Deror>	We believe that we can organize a wonderful convention, on a relatively low budget and we think that the city of Haifa, with its universities and many high tech companies, its Mediterranean beachfront location, and its friendly residents is the ideal location.
Mar 30 10:33:50 <Ldorfman-IL>	Hi everybody
Mar 30 10:34:08 <Deror>	2011 is also Haifa's jubilee - 250 years since the establishment of the new city.
Mar 30 10:34:19 <Deror>	The idea to hold Wikimania 2011 in Haifa was welcomed with a lot of enthusiasm on behalf of the local community. We have letters of support from the Municipality of Haifa and the University of Haifa.
Mar 30 10:34:35 <Deror>	Furthermore, there are a lot of interesting speakers in Israel. In fact, Israeli researchers talked on all Wikimania, and now there is a chance to bring even more interesting speakers from Israeli institutes.
Mar 30 10:34:56 <jowen>	Can you tell us a little more about the venue
Mar 30 10:35:07 <Deror>	Sure
Mar 30 10:35:45 <cary>	 /Aside, I've not yet heard from anyone in Toronto.  If you are here, please PM me./
Mar 30 10:36:24 <Ldorfman-IL>	Haifa is the 3rd biggest city in Israel.
Mar 30 10:37:13 <Deror>	The Haifa Auditorium is located in the Haifa, in the Carmel Centre Neighborhood
Mar 30 10:38:06 <Deror>	The Carmel Centre is the city's entertainment and shopping district.
Mar 30 10:38:50 <Deror>	The Auditorium has hosted international conventions and is the location of the Haifa International Film Festival for the past 26 years.
Mar 30 10:39:36 <jowen>	at one given time how many available rooms would you have open for presentations?
Mar 30 10:39:39 <Deror>	As detailed in the bid - it has three main buildings, and three large conference halls as well as some smaller halls
Mar 30 10:40:46 <MarianoC1>	How far apart are they?
Mar 30 10:42:39 <cary>	<Jeromyu> little worried about the security in Israel actually :P
Mar 30 10:42:40 <Deror>	The main hall, which hosts more than 1000 people is available for the first day, the secondary hall (600 people) and the cinemateque is available throught the convention (seating about 500 and 150) four more halls of 120, 60, 60, 60 are also availbale throught. They are about 10 meters apart (buildings are connected)
Mar 30 10:43:08 <jowen>	very good
Mar 30 10:43:31 <jowen>	How large is your chapter?
Mar 30 10:44:14 <cary>	Also, this is from Tango42: "Cary, I have a question re. security too, so I'll ask it now: When Wikimania was held in Alexandria, Egypt professional security consultants produced a report on the security situation to put people's minds at ease. Will you do the same if your bid is successful?"
Mar 30 10:44:16 <jowen>	Will the WM israel be supporting this bid financially and will the finances for the conference be organized under the chapter?
Mar 30 10:44:16 <Deror>	The Chapter has 25 members
Mar 30 10:44:39 <Austin>	Just to clarify, I believe that report was commissioned by WMF Inc.
Mar 30 10:44:45 <Austin>	Not the local team.
Mar 30 10:45:08 <Deror>	Jowen - yes - Wikimedia Israel will support the conference and will work to find sponsors
Mar 30 10:45:16 <cary>	I also believe it was commissioned after Alexandria was chosen.
Mar 30 10:45:29 <Austin>	Indeed.
Mar 30 10:46:33 <Deror>	As far as security goes, it is taken for granted in Israel that every building is guarded. In case of international conferences, security is enhanced in the venue. The venue and hotels provide security, the budget includes additional security.
Mar 30 10:47:39 <Deror>	Haifa is a very safe city, with crime rates, and is away from politcal flash points. It is a symbol of peaceful coexistance in Israel.
Mar 30 10:48:27 <Deror>	MarianoC1 - as for the distance between the buildings - there is a chart in our bid page
Mar 30 10:48:32 <cary>	Domas would like me to ask the Israelis about the climate in Summer.
Mar 30 10:48:39 <cary>	which is unfair because nobody asked NYC :)  
Mar 30 10:49:06 <jowen>	Can you also take sometime to discuss some of the difficulties that might occur for some travelers to attend the conference.  How will you work to allow as many participants to attend from countries who can not travel to Israel.
Mar 30 10:49:20 <DrorK-IL>	May I add a few words about security and visas?
Mar 30 10:49:28 <jowen>	please
Mar 30 10:49:30 <DrorK-IL>	With Deror and cary's permission
Mar 30 10:50:22 <Deror>	Wonderful climate - best for beaches. Warm, sunny, no chance of rain - all buildings are airconditioned, and at night the cocktail parties and beach parties may be held outside in the warm weather.
Mar 30 10:50:22 <DrorK-IL>	I think the Alexandria experience taught us that security should be taken seriously,
Mar 30 10:50:28 <cary>	certainly.  You are voiced, aren't you? :)
Mar 30 10:50:33 <DrorK-IL>	and yet not let it hinder any plans
Mar 30 10:51:02 <Deror>	as for visas - Visas are not required for nationals of most countries in Europe and the Americas And despite a common false notion - it is fairly easy to get a visa for nationals of most Asian and African countries.
Mar 30 10:51:10 <Deror>	It is more difficult to get visas for people of certain Arab and Muslim countries that do not recognize Israel
Mar 30 10:51:28 <Deror>	People do enter Israel with Iranian passports (for example). It should be arranged in advance, and Wikimedia Israel will take care of that.
Mar 30 10:51:38 <cary>	Deror, that is good news.
Mar 30 10:51:55 <Seddon>	Why is so much being spent on VIP's accomodation and parties and tours? over $100000 is projected to be spent on such things
Mar 30 10:52:14 <MarianoC1>	that's almost half of the budget
Mar 30 10:52:21 <jowen>	Could you please add this information into your bid.  I know your chapters has a lot of political ties and it would be nice to know if there is a way the country could support their travel.
Mar 30 10:52:39 <Deror>	Israeli border control does not stamp such passports.
Mar 30 10:53:30 <cary>	Okay fellows, in about 7 minutes we should move on to Montreal.  Remember, we still have next Saturday to do this all over again :)
Mar 30 10:53:32 <jowen>	As with the NYC bid, I would like to see more details about your vision for the program.  Do you see this as a social, educational, or outreach conference.
Mar 30 10:53:41 <Seddon>	hang on jowen :P
Mar 30 10:53:46 <jowen>	sorry
Mar 30 10:53:50 <Seddon>	am waiting for my question to be answered :P
Mar 30 10:53:58 <Deror>	OK - one at a time
Mar 30 10:54:40 <Seddon>	 /side note i guess montreal are here/
Mar 30 10:54:43 <Seddon>	:)
Mar 30 10:55:12 *	MarianoC1 agrees
Mar 30 10:55:21 <Deror>	We see this as both a social, educational and outreach conference. We believe that we should attempt to provide the participants with as much services at the lowest costs. We wish to provide participants who can not afford with full board and accomodations.
Mar 30 10:56:07 <Deror>	We have arranged dorms sponsored in full by Wikimedia Israel, and the budget includes lunch for all conference days as well as dinners (the three parties are actually the three dinners).
Mar 30 10:57:01 <Deror>	We have also arranged with three hotels in Haifa low cost accomodations at an amount of $50 per night which includes full breakfast and access to all facilities.
Mar 30 10:57:21 <jowen>	I understand some of the projected cost for the train tickets and such so I enjoy that you factored this in.  But as with seddon concern who is a VIP for this context?
Mar 30 10:57:36 <Deror>	We see the dinner parties as a crucial social enabler creating connections between wikipedians.
Mar 30 10:57:47 <Deror>	Just a sec jowen
Mar 30 10:58:35 <Deror>	The tours themselves are not expensive - $11,000 which is rental for 10 busses and lunces for everybody (we will atempt to lower costs)
Mar 30 10:58:46 <cary>	Deror, just so we can wrap it up shortly.
Mar 30 10:59:56 <Deror>	sure - the budget includes residence and travels for 20 VIP's of the foundation - i.e. foundation personal and guests
Mar 30 11:00:13 <Deror>	Was there a question i missed?
Mar 30 11:00:18 <cary>	No, that's it.
Mar 30 11:00:33 <jowen>	WMF will pay for their own staff and Board to attend
Mar 30 11:00:42 <cary>	Okay
Mar 30 11:00:45 <cary>	let's move on to Canada
Mar 30 11:00:46 <cary>	I mean
Mar 30 11:00:48 <cary>	Montreal
Mar 30 11:00:54 <jowen>	can we have two more minutes?
Mar 30 11:01:13 <cary>	I thought Deror answered the question
Mar 30 11:01:48 <jowen>	I just wanted to thank the WM Israel for putting together this bid.  It is a very nice bid and we thank you for your time.  Please add to your bid your general vision or your program and the type of conference you want to hold.
Mar 30 11:01:51 <cary>	Questions can be answered on the wiki.  There is also Saturday.
Mar 30 11:02:05 <jowen>	Also please add more detail about attendance and visas.
Mar 30 11:02:07 <jowen>	Thank you


Mar 30 11:02:13 <Coren>	Hi all.  Thanks for attending!
Mar 30 11:02:26 <Coren>	I think I'll start with some emphasis on what we percieve to be Montreal's
Mar 30 11:02:30 <cary>	Coren, Montreal (aka User:Fail) are there anyone else here who needs to be voiced?
Mar 30 11:02:44 <Coren>	Nope, Cary.  Middle of the day.
Mar 30 11:02:56 <cary>	Nihiltres sends his regrets.
Mar 30 11:03:09 <Coren>	Montreal's greatest asset for hosting Wikimania: it's above all a crossroad city.  It
Mar 30 11:03:51 <Coren>	sits at the intersection of Francophonie, American and Commonwealth cultures,
Mar 30 11:04:09 <Coren>	and draws from each.  We think that Buenos Aires gave us a strong lead to
Mar 30 11:04:26 <Coren>	follow about inclusiveness of editing communities other than English, and
Mar 30 11:04:42 <Coren>	we're ideally situated - culturally and geographically - to repeat the
Mar 30 11:05:04 <Coren>	exploit with the French wikipedians.  Our bid is built around the idea that
Mar 30 11:05:31 <Coren>	the conference is made to be accessible in French and English from the
Mar 30 11:05:32 <Coren>	the conference is made to be accessible in French and English from the
Mar 30 11:05:59 <Coren>	opening banquet to the closing talks.  And we have planned for the capacity
Mar 30 11:06:11 <Coren>	to add a third language if we have the translators.
Mar 30 11:06:22 <Coren>	It's also worth nothing that we have the bid that, by far, has the biggest
Mar 30 11:06:28 <Coren>	noting!  Worth noting!  :-)
Mar 30 11:06:44 <Coren>	biggest budget.  This is a consequence of our concious decision to delegate more
Mar 30 11:07:03 <Coren>	of the actual "conference-fu" to professional teams; we felt that the very high
Mar 30 11:07:16 <Coren>	expected quality of the proceeding *and* the fact that this frees the
Mar 30 11:07:27 <Coren>	volunteers to concentrate on the program, contents and social aspects rather
Mar 30 11:07:43 <Coren>	than working to make sure we have enough plugs to put laptops in, far outweigh
Mar 30 11:07:47 <jowen>	What is your experience creating and facilitating events to this scale?
Mar 30 11:07:50 <Coren>	the downside of having to secure bigger or more numerous sponsorhips.
Mar 30 11:08:19 <Coren>	Myself, not on the "top level" organization.  I've quite a bit of experience in organizing event schedules and talks
Mar 30 11:08:22 <Coren>	though (LISA)
Mar 30 11:08:41 <jowen>	Can you tell me more about those events, their size, number of days, types of attendees....
Mar 30 11:08:45 <Coren>	But one of the member of our board is a VP at Tourisme Montreal; he actually makes his living doing this and has been our biggest adviser.
Mar 30 11:09:24 <Coren>	I've been part of selection and organization committee at LISA (Large Installation System Administration); that's a 5 day event with 3000 attendees or so.
Mar 30 11:09:48 <Coren>	I've also done symposions on a smaller scale (200-300) in Montreal, with the CRIM
Mar 30 11:09:53 <Coren>	symposiums.
Mar 30 11:10:11 <Coren>	As far as the team is concerned, we are still a relatively small and
Mar 30 11:10:18 <Coren>	centered around the board of the nonprofit we created for the conference.
Mar 30 11:10:19 <jowen>	For those events how large was the organizing team?
Mar 30 11:10:32 <Coren>	But we rely on pros to support us.
Mar 30 11:11:02 <Coren>	LISA is almost 30 people organizing.  The smaller ones usually had small teams of 4-5
Mar 30 11:11:16 <jowen>	I am not too familiar with the location WM community in Montreal can you tell us how many volunteers you think your team has access too.
Mar 30 11:11:39 <Coren>	The Free Knowledge movement isn't very developped yet in Quebec or Montreal.
Mar 30 11:11:53 <Coren>	None of us made any secret that we intend to use the "buzz" around Wikimania to help the foundation of a local chapter.
Mar 30 11:12:16 <Coren>	But I have no doubt that 20-30 people can be found; there is a great deal of willingness to help on frwp, for instance.
Mar 30 11:12:37 <jowen>	I am a little concerned that there is no large venue for keynote speeches I would like to see a space that could hold 700-900 people for these events.
Mar 30 11:12:44 <Coren>	And one of our corporate sponsors actually wants to give staff (they look for volunteering opportunities)
Mar 30 11:13:06 <Coren>	Jowen: We have a large hall that can hold 1200
Mar 30 11:13:17 <Coren>	The one marked in bright yellow on the plan.  :-)
Mar 30 11:13:36 <MarianoC1>	are there any other compatible organizations, say for free software, that would like to join you in the organization of the event?
Mar 30 11:13:43 <Montreal>
Mar 30 11:13:45 <jowen>	oh sorry I must have missed that in the detail
Mar 30 11:13:54 <cary>	I will note that Montreal has a rather large wikimedian community, which seems smaller because people either contribute to fr or en, but not generally both.
Mar 30 11:14:08 <Montreal>	and Canonical if i may add too.
Mar 30 11:14:26 <Coren>	Cary: That's a good point, and one of the reasons why we place so much emphasis on a bilinguial conference.
Mar 30 11:14:39 <jowen>	I might have missed this too what are your proposed dates.
Mar 30 11:15:05 <Coren>	You have.  July 28-31, 2011
Mar 30 11:15:12 <Montreal>	and tikiwiki!
Mar 30 11:15:33 <Coren>	Jowen:  Look at the pretty colors on the bid page.  :-)
Mar 30 11:15:47 <jowen>	I like that you are planning so much techincial support and live video but the cost is rather high.  over 100k just for this service.  can you go into more detail.
Mar 30 11:15:54 <Coren>	Sure.
Mar 30 11:16:28 <Coren>	Mostly, the cost is high because we delegate this to a pro team rather than expend volunteer time.  This gives us two big advantages:
Mar 30 11:16:52 <Coren>	(a) cameramen, pro gear, and pro mixing / post production
Mar 30 11:17:20 <Coren>	(b) The volunteers can concentrate on the people rather than the wiring.  One of the biggest negative Feedback in past WMs is that the org
Mar 30 11:17:34 <Coren>	team was so busy they were not able to help people meet and mingle.
Mar 30 11:18:49 <jowen>	Although I understand the costs for creating a conference in North America are high. Your projections are almost double that of NYC.  Do you feel you can get enough sponsors to fund at this level?
Mar 30 11:19:01 <jowen>	What is your past expereince working with sponsors?
Mar 30 11:19:32 <Montreal>	jowen, we have no problem finding sponsors, i have contacted a few and they're willing.
Mar 30 11:19:56 <Coren>	I'm good at sucking up.  I have been raised in a very political family.  :-)  I already have offious support for about 200K
Mar 30 11:20:13 <Coren>	Mind you, hard numbers are hard to come by until the event becomes concrete
Mar 30 11:20:35 <Coren>	But the big budget not as big a disadvantage as might appear at first.  The economy
Mar 30 11:21:00 <Coren>	in Quebec is rather healthy, and I've got two of the big telcos duking it out for exclusivity.  :-)
Mar 30 11:21:18 *	cary reminds everyone these are *canadian* dollars.
Mar 30 11:21:30 <Seddon>	better than american atm :P
Mar 30 11:21:43 <jowen>	I am concerned about your costs.  In your bid can you please provide more details.
Mar 30 11:21:43 <Seddon>	or is it
Mar 30 11:21:44 <Coren>	I wouldn't if i were you, Cary, the way things are at the moment they tend to get bigger than USian dollars.  :-)
Mar 30 11:22:22 <jowen>	Also I would like the bid as with all the bids to include more information about your vision for the conference.
Mar 30 11:22:29 <Montreal>	cary, with the upcoming parity, it might be a good thing :)
Mar 30 11:22:29 <cary>	Generally right before I plan a trip to Canada
Mar 30 11:22:32 <jowen>	And your vision for the programs.
Mar 30 11:22:53 <Coren>	jowen: When you say more detail, you mean a more granular breakdown?
Mar 30 11:22:57 <cary>	Okay, Montreal, in about 9 minutes I'm going to demoderate the channel.  The moderated portion of the meeting will be over.
Mar 30 11:23:24 <Coren>	Well, I have only one bit to add maybe unless there are more questions.
Mar 30 11:23:43 <jowen>	Yes, or more evaluation, I want to be able to know why the cost is so much higher than other bids.
Mar 30 11:24:21 <Seddon>	Coren and  pharos and DrorK-Il , ould you able to send a report on what potential sponsors have expressed a clear interest in supporting your bids including what type of company/organisation they are and the amounts of sponsorship discussed with them
Mar 30 11:24:30 <jowen>	Also how do you plan to work with visas for our travelers.
Mar 30 11:24:44 <jowen>	oh sorry Seddon
Mar 30 11:24:49 <Coren>	Accessibility is not a worry.  While post-911 Canada isn't quite as
Mar 30 11:24:50 <Seddon>	 no worries jowen :)
Mar 30 11:24:59 <Seddon>	 send it to the jury mailing lis
Mar 30 11:25:00 <Coren>	open as it used to be, much out of posturing rather than real worry,
Mar 30 11:25:02 <Seddon>	list*
Mar 30 11:25:09 <Coren>	visas are easy to obtain and relatively inexpensive, and the Palais
Mar 30 11:25:17 <Coren>	des Congres team has experience assisting in the matter; they will take
Mar 30 11:25:26 <Coren>	care of the confirmation letters and such to make it easy to get visas.
Mar 30 11:25:45 <jowen>	Maybe some more details in your bid about how you plan to work with our travelers to elevate visa concerns would be helpful too.
Mar 30 11:25:48 <Coren>	Seddon: I can do to the jury, but much of it is under NDA until finalized, so I can't make those public.
Mar 30 11:26:08 <Austin>	That's not a problem; we've done that many times in the past.
Mar 30 11:26:22 <cary>	Canada, US and Israel all have similar Visa issues, although Canada is marginally the easiest.
Mar 30 11:26:35 <Montreal>	Plus, the location is close to many consulates or high commissions
Mar 30 11:27:02 <Coren>	Montreal: That's also true of NYC.
Mar 30 11:27:12 <MarianoC1>	more important is for Canada to have embassies everywhere.
Mar 30 11:27:26 <cary>	Whichever of the four teams is awarded the conference will have to work with their government to alleviate Visa concerns.
Mar 30 11:27:28 <Montreal>	And the closest one to the venue is the USA one.
Mar 30 11:27:34 <jowen>	actually israel is easier for African and South American nations from my understanding.
Mar 30 11:27:53 <cary>	jowen, overall, Canada is the easiest.
Mar 30 11:27:59 <MarianoC1>	that is correct; I can comfirm that
Mar 30 11:28:01 <Coren>	I don't think visas is a deciding factor, really.
Mar 30 11:28:13 <jowen>	No it is not but something all the teams need to think about.
Mar 30 11:28:16 <Coren>	That can be worked around by all teams.
Mar 30 11:28:16 <cary>	Although the difference is Marginal.
Mar 30 11:28:47 <Coren>	Thanks for the attention guys.  We'll add the details requested.  Fail, anything to add?
Mar 30 11:29:01 <Montreal>	yes, i'd like to add that the transportation in Montreal is easy.
Mar 30 11:29:31 <jowen>	I was very happy to see your detail on transportation
Mar 30 11:29:42 <Montreal>	There's a direct shuttle from the airport to downtown, the subway is easy  to understand...
Mar 30 11:29:53 <Coren>	And Bixi are just sooooo cool.  :-)
Mar 30 11:29:59 <Montreal>	I agree!
Mar 30 11:30:06 <jowen>	Thank you to your team for a nice bid.  Please expand about your vision for programs, the conference, and travel visas
Mar 30 11:30:13 <Montreal>	Bixi is a public bike rental system in Montréal :)
Mar 30 11:30:32 <Coren>	Will do, jowen.
Mar 30 11:30:32 <Seddon>	no questions for the time being
Mar 30 11:30:50 <Montreal>	I'm open to Q&A in channel or private.
Mar 30 11:30:55 <cary>	okay, if that's all right, I'm going to close the logged part of the meeting and take the channel off Moderation.


Mar 30 11:31:03 <jowen>	If there is no one from Toronto I suggest we end..
Mar 30 11:31:29 <cary>	There is no one from Toronto.
Mar 30 11:31:48 <Rayson>	i'm from toronto
Mar 30 11:31:56 <cary>	Rayson, are you here for the team?
Mar 30 11:32:00 <Rayson>	yes
Mar 30 11:33:35 <cary>	Rayson, would you like to talk about bid first before we start with questions?
Mar 30 11:35:09 <Rayson>	sure, our main focus is affordability and fun -- 1) we get support by KDMI of U of Toronto
Mar 30 11:35:44 <Rayson>	2) we are able to visit places that are not generally accessible to the general public and tourists
Mar 30 11:37:34 <Rayson>	and lastly, many companies would like to sponsor free giveaways, and we have some companies that we have under NDAs that if Toronto is hosting the conference in 2010, then they will sponsor  us money
Mar 30 11:38:11 <Rayson>	and our goal is to have the company-sponsored money go into the expense of the venue and misc costs
Mar 30 11:38:49 <Rayson>	while the registration fees pay for food and other free giveaways
Mar 30 11:39:27 <cary>	Rayson, if, during the course of this, another team member arrives, please let me know and I will voice them.
Mar 30 11:39:37 <Rayson>	alright
Mar 30 11:40:40 <jowen>	what would the registration fee be?
Mar 30 11:40:46 <jowen>	projected numbers are fine
Mar 30 11:41:03 <Rayson>	should be something like $25 to $40 Canadian
Mar 30 11:41:11 <Rayson>	it's mainly the cost of food
Mar 30 11:41:22 <jowen>	that is very fair.
Mar 30 11:41:28 <Rayson>	in fact, if we want to go "cheap", we can get pizza for all 3 days
Mar 30 11:41:33 <jowen>	Can you tell me more about your local team and their expereince.
Mar 30 11:41:44 <Rayson>	but i think people are not going to like pizza everyday :D
Mar 30 11:42:00 <Rayson>	so the core team is Andrew + me
Mar 30 11:42:20 <Rayson>	i have experience with organzing a local 1-day conference in toronto
Mar 30 11:42:32 <jowen>	how large was that conference?
Mar 30 11:42:33 <Rayson>	and the conference have 8 tracks
Mar 30 11:43:00 <Rayson>	last year, there were over 500 registered, and over 350 showed up for the conference
Mar 30 11:43:11 <jowen>	What is your experience with sponsorships?
Mar 30 11:43:59 <Rayson>	i worked with sponsors this year, since i am in the IT industry for 10 years, i have many friends working for IT companies in the Greater Toronto Area
Mar 30 11:44:41 <Rayson>	also want to mention that the Toronto conference that I co-organized is free, with free lunch, and everything is paid by our sponsors
Mar 30 11:46:03 <Rayson>	we also have free books and other stuff sponsored for the pre/post conference events, but of course they are not real money
Mar 30 11:46:16 <jowen>	Can you please add a detailed budget to your bid.
Mar 30 11:47:02 <Rayson>	and lastly, as i put down in the bid, companies don't want to give us an actual dollar amount unless they are sure that the conference will be held in toronto
Mar 30 11:47:05 <jowen>	Also as I asked with the other teams can you also include a vision for the program and conference.
Mar 30 11:47:44 <Rayson>	yes, i will put down the info in the bid
Mar 30 11:48:58 <jowen>	How do you plan to deal with the conference finances?
Mar 30 11:50:11 <Rayson>	this part will be handled by andrew and other members, but they are not here today -- i am mainly in charge of the venue, technology, and the pre/post events
Mar 30 11:51:03 <MarianoC1>	What about volunteers. How many volunteers do you think you can gather, and where from?
Mar 30 11:51:48 <Rayson>	yes, i have experience hiring paid student workers and volunters for the 300-attendee conference
Mar 30 11:52:27 <Rayson>	when we sent our the hiring notification at a local college...
Mar 30 11:52:40 <Rayson>	we got over 10 replies
Mar 30 11:54:01 <Rayson>	so, if we have a conference in downtown toronto, which has 2 universities that are way bigger than a college, i expect that we will get way more replies
Mar 30 11:54:56 <MarianoC1>	a detail on this would be nice in the bid. as well as possible connections and collaborations with other free-knowledge organizations or alike
Mar 30 11:54:58 <Rayson>	i hope i could also use some of the sponsored dollars to hire 1 or 2 students who know AV
Mar 30 11:55:41 <Rayson>	for my 300-attendee event, we hired 1 AV person just to handle the filming of the event
Mar 30 11:56:52 <Rayson>	 KDMI is a knowlege organization that research on free media, i will if i can add more info about KDMI
Mar 30 11:57:34 <Rayson>	and besides KDMI, which is U of Toronto, i have talked to the VP of York
Mar 30 11:57:45 <Rayson>	and they are interested in working with us as well
Mar 30 12:00:11 <Rayson>	while York's focus is less on technology and more on arts, i have worked with a York Professor who is working on Saving Endangered Archives
Mar 30 12:00:50 <Rayson>	i met with a number of his grad. students, and presented a workshop session
Mar 30 12:01:27 <Seddon>	i think thats time
Mar 30 12:01:29 <cary>	Okay, I'm going to take moderation off the channel