Help talk:Getting started
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1900+ sentences for ... getting started?
Used an online utility to scan readability of what should be an introduction:
Indication of the number of years of formal education that a person requires in order to easily understand the text on the first reading
Gunning Fog index: 20.45
Approximate representation of the U.S. grade level needed to comprehend the text:
29.80 Coleman Liau index
22.91 Flesch Kincaid Grade level
26.81 ARI (Automated Readability Index)
17.19 SMOG:
-31.27 Flesch Reading Ease:
Number of characters (without spaces): 324,404.00
Number of words: 40,646.00
Number of sentences: 1,909.00
Lexical Density: 92.64
... and so on.
Suggestion: Might a better approach include a search box for "How do I ...?" related inquiries? Jasonbrown1965 (talk) 10:14, 21 May 2022 (UTC)
- Seeing no response I must conclude that, for getting started as an editor, Wikipedia is dysfunctional.
- Nineteen hundred sentences!
- 1900 ^
- 1.9k ^ Jasonbrown1965 (talk) 06:15, 22 October 2022 (UTC)
- @Jasonbrown1965, I'm very much not a fan of this page either. It should be formatted more as a back-end list of different attempts at making a starting page than an actual starting page itself, and it should never be the place we send newcomers. I think Help:Introduction does a somewhat better job, although it's still longer than it ought to be. Overall, Wikipedia has an inherent amount of complexity that'll never fully be simplifyable, but we can do a lot better. Regarding your search box idea, the present search box at the top of each page is capable of location help pages if you just prefix your query with "WP:" or "Help:". Of course, that's only useful if people actually know to do it... {{u|Sdkb}} talk 06:43, 22 October 2022 (UTC)
- Had a quick look at Help:Introduction and yes much better job.
- Suggestion: Could an interim answer be as simple (ha!) as beginner/advanced toggles?
- And/or, more appropriately, simple, well-flagged wikipedia pages.
- Suggestion: legacy wordhacks suggest simple draft text, and,
- hand-off to more technically competent editors?
- Further suggestion: drafting process NOT take place on "Talk" pages.
- Why? The full-screen text format 'might' be comfortable for coders,
- but information overload for anyone else.
- Query: is there an app for ^ that?*
- Agreed: "Of course, that's only useful if people actually know to do it"
- Exactly. Thanks for the prompt, from whence come suggestions.
- Comment: Emphathise with any and all editors/admins/techs,
- having to make Wikipedia aircraft carrier turn like a gunboat. I'm
- grateful to get feedback.
- ps: late reply, still getting over a double-concussion.
- Sometime brain work. Sometime nah.
- Excuse line breaks,
- easier for brain
- e.g. an app that turns a hideous wall of text into something mobile-friendly, responsive Jasonbrown1965 (talk) 08:14, 6 July 2023 (UTC)
- @Jasonbrown1965, re the toggle suggestion, we have {{beginner version}} for pairing more advanced and less advanced help pages.
- For your second suggestion, if I understand it correctly, you're looking for better collaboration between writers and technical editors. Is that correct? mw:Growth/Article creation for new editors is a project that seeks to eliminate some of the technical obstacles to article creation.
- Article drafting should ideally take place in sandboxes, either in draftspace or userspace, not on talk pages, which are really more for discussion about e.g. what should or should not go in an article. {{u|Sdkb}} talk 20:30, 6 July 2023 (UTC)
- @Jasonbrown1965, I'm very much not a fan of this page either. It should be formatted more as a back-end list of different attempts at making a starting page than an actual starting page itself, and it should never be the place we send newcomers. I think Help:Introduction does a somewhat better job, although it's still longer than it ought to be. Overall, Wikipedia has an inherent amount of complexity that'll never fully be simplifyable, but we can do a lot better. Regarding your search box idea, the present search box at the top of each page is capable of location help pages if you just prefix your query with "WP:" or "Help:". Of course, that's only useful if people actually know to do it... {{u|Sdkb}} talk 06:43, 22 October 2022 (UTC)