Fundraising meeting, September 2005/Log
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Session Start: Sat Sep 17 08:42:39 2005 Session Ident: #wikimedia-meeting
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<dannyisme> hello <Angela> Hi. <dannyisme> invite terry <Angela> It's not invite-only. He can just come here.
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<TerryFoote> Hello. <TimShell> howdy
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<MikeSnow> None for me, thanks
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<TimShell> mav is allegedly coming <TimShell> I did not go to sleep last night <TimShell> So I am a bit frazzled
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<Snowdog> hi everybody
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<MikeSnow> Now that mav is here, are we waiting for anyone else in particular? <TimShell> No <TimShell> Let me preface by saying <dannyisme> Anthere? <TimShell> the purpose of this meeting is not to make decisions <TimShell> but to think about what we could do in the next drive <TimShell> Throughout the most recent fund drive <TimShell> people were complaining about many things we were doing wrong <TerryFoote> the most recent fund drive was a great success. <dannyisme> such as <TimShell> or stuff we should have been doing but weren't <TimShell> I tried to keep a list of problems on the url listed there in the topic <dannyisme> what were complaints <TimShell> Michael Davis, for example, thought it was not clear that we could accept donations from credit cards but not through PayPal <dannyisme> opposite <TimShell> The donate link said PayPal <TimShell> Michael thought it was confusing for people who did not use PayPal <dannyisme> ok <TimShell> They perhaps didn't realize they could donate <dannyisme> we have to set up credit card donations better <TimShell> So as Terry said this last drive was a great success <TimShell> and we should all be pleased <MikeSnow> If we have direct credit card payment processing it's pretty easy to say you can also use credit cards via PayPal <TimShell> Why don't we have that already ?
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<dannyisme> takes some time to set up <dannyisme> so we have to set that up <Angela> I thought we did have that now.
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<Angela> It was used for Wikimania. <MikeSnow> Does anybody know what we need to do to set it up? <MikeSnow> Angela: How was it used for Wikimania? <MikeSnow> Was that through the European chapters' accounts? <Angela> People paid for their accommodation and entrance with credit cards. I think this was to the main Foundation account. <MikeSnow> Paid online or in person? <Angela> Online. <TerryFoote> We have a third party credit card processor. <TerryFoote> We took quite a few payments for Wikimania that way. <TerryFoote> But as far as I can tell, there were none from the recent fundraiser, so Michael Davis is right. <TerryFoote> Something must not have been clear. <TerryFoote> Every time someone makes a credit card donation, I get an email with all the information. <dannyisme> but we can do that next fundraiser <TimShell> That would be a priority <MikeSnow> It was never added to the donations page as far as I know. <dannyisme> yes <TerryFoote> I haven't gotten one since Wikimania time. <dannyisme> ok, then we have to improve the donation page to reflect mail-in gifts, other payment forms, etc <Angela> Talk to Austin. I think he was the one who set it up for Wikimania, so he'd know about it. <TimShell> Another related objection was that the funddrive started shortly after we decided when to have it, so there was not a lot of time to prepare <dannyisme> ok <TimShell> If we planned at least a month in advance we could get all this set up in a timely manner <dannyisme> so we should schedule our bext funddrive better <TimShell> So I would say we decide soon when the next drive will be <dannyisme> how many a year <TimShell> We can't decide that now <MikeSnow> I would pick January or February, assuming current funds can be expected to last that long <dannyisme> we should think about it <TimShell> 2 or 3 or 4 times a year? <dannyisme> 2 <Angela> Every 3 months seems too much. <TimShell> Should there be a perpetual donate link? <MikeSnow> Overall, roughly 2 times a year, but not necessarily on a strict schedule <MikeSnow> Absolutely a donations link should always be there <Angela> There should be a perpetual donate link, but not in the sitenotice. <innocence> i would like to see a more prominant donation link all the time
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<innocence> i don't think it's obvious that you can donate <Angela> Simple English has always had one at the end of each article - http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clerc.
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<TimShell> (My wikimania charge was to the Wikimedia Foundation, St Pete) <innocence> Ang: yes, something like that <TimShell> Good, something we all agree on <Angela> It needs to wrap properly though. It stretches the page on simple and I don't know why. <dannyisme> i think we should always have one in december (except this year) <dannyisme> it is christmas season, and right before tax season <dannyisme> people are more likely to give for tax purposes <Angela> December seems a bad time. Isn't everyone going to be broke from buying Christmas presents? <dannyisme> no, that is when people end their tax year <MikeSnow> Taxes is a plus, but holidays are a minus because of the competition for people's pocketbooks <TimShell> We could hit up corporations in December <dannyisme> god idea tim <dannyisme> good <Angela> before April would be better tax-wise in the UK. I don't know about other countries, but it's not always going to be December. <dannyisme> when does the fiscal year end in each country <dannyisme> we have to find that out <MikeSnow> Most small donators do not actively schedule how to donate for tax purposes anyway <TimShell> It depends on the company <TerryFoote> In any given 501(c)3, the great majority of their donations come from small individual donations. <TerryFoote> $25-50. <TerryFoote> Repeated thousands of times. <TimShell> Fiscal year for companies are listed here: http://finance.yahoo.com/q/ks?s=MSFT <TimShell> replace MSFT with company ticker <TimShell> Mostly in December, apparently <MikeSnow> It might be useful if we can get ourselves added to corporate charity rosters for payroll deductions <MikeSnow> like United Way, Red Cross, etc. <TerryFoote> MikeSnow: I think that's an excellent idea. <dannyisme> yes <dannyisme> someone emailed me about a similar arrangement with the US army <TimShell> United Way and Red Cross are huge <TimShell> Would it be something a small org. like WMF could do ? <TerryFoote> From what I can tell looking over our snail mail.... <MikeSnow> TimShell: Well, that's how big we plan to be, right? <TimShell> eventually <TimShell> maybe
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<dannyisme> main page of each project <innocence> donors sounds so morbid. "i donated my liver to wikipedia" <dannyisme> so people can see their names <TerryFoote> Maybe we can use the example of the brick and mortar world. <dannyisme> what do you mean? <TerryFoote> Plenty of great works of architecture have been funded by donars. <dannyisme> yeah, we have signs all over the museum <dannyisme> one guy actually donated a bathroom in honor of his brother <TerryFoote> So they have plagues with names of all the donars, arranged in order of generousity. <dannyisme> as a joke <TerryFoote> It's not advertising. <dannyisme> but he gave 100k for it <TerryFoote> You're not seeing say at the Kennedy Center in DC " <TerryFoote> "buy the new Ford Taurus NOW" <TerryFoote> You see though the name of the Ford Foundation. <TerryFoote> Very different. <TerryFoote> If we have a benefactors page.... <TerryFoote> Corporations can get the recognition for their generousity... <MikeSnow> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Benefactors <TimShell> Will that entice people to donate ? <dannyisme> we can have ranks <dannyisme> patrons <dannyisme> benefactors <dannyisme> friends <dannyisme> cheapskates <MikeSnow> They can also issue press releases, there was one this week from Lexico Publishing <TerryFoote> If this page on Wikipedia has a link on the homepage... <TerryFoote> Which is guaranteed to get a lot of traffic... <TerryFoote> Something as simple as "benefactors" <TerryFoote> I think corporate donars would be pleased by that.
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<Angela> We're not taking advantage of donations that have already been offered by companies who don't even want a logo or anything in return. <TimShell> I think the question of what we are willing to give to sponsors in terms of exposure should be brought up at the meeting tomorrow <Angela> It would be better to follow up on those before approaching anyone else. <Angela> Google, for example. <mav> it would just say that Day X of the fund drive is going to have matchintg funds from company y
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<dannyisme> we can do something like this <dannyisme> http://www.ecologyfund.com/ecology/totals_honor_roll.html <TerryFoote> If we had a page where individual donars could see their names, that would be cool too.
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<TimShell> That would be cool but would it entice more people to donate ? <dannyisme> that is what i am showing you <dannyisme> the honor roll of the ecology fund <TerryFoote> Sure, and it would entice people who have donated already to keep donating. <mav> http://wikimediafoundation.org/funddrive/index.php/day1/detail/ <mav> that is created automatically <dannyisme> and we can even add up people who onate more than once <dannyisme> so if you give 10 bucks a month <dannyisme> you are listed at 120 <dannyisme> for a yearf <TerryFoote> People love to see their name in print. <mav> how do you get all the data? <mav> we have somethig set-up for PayPal, but... <TerryFoote> I have all the names of snail mail donars. <TerryFoote> All the names of credit card donars too. <TimShell> It sounds like it could be a nightmare keeping it all straight <mav> those would need to be entered in by hand <TerryFoote> NOt if we find a system for organizing it all. <mav> we need to automate as much as possible <Angela> Snail mail donors were never asked if they wanted their donation kept anonymous, so we can't use their names on anything public. <TerryFoote> Angela: you have a point there. <mav> angela ; we can still assign them unigue IDs, like Anonymous1577 <TerryFoote> For all future donations... <TerryFoote> We perhaps should have something for on the site for snail mail donations saying "please be sure to tell us if you want your name on our benefactors list" <mav> we can also ask on the donation page for people to say in the note field of the check if they want to have their name published <mav> by defaul they will be anyonmous <mav> just like PayPal <Angela> cheques have a note field? <dannyisme> yes, of course <mav> in the U.S. they do <Angela> I don't think they do in the UK. <TerryFoote> Some people tell you they want to remain anonymous. <TerryFoote> If that's what they want. <TimShell> I think this is a minor issue <TerryFoote> NOt really. <TerryFoote> It could be a major issue if someone chose to make it one. <mav> Terry ; if they put nothing, then we assume they want to be anon <innocence> Ang: i never saw a note field <innocence> Ang: you can write on the back though <TerryFoote> Mav: I don't know what to assume really. <TimShell> A benefactors page would be nice but it won't change the scale of donations <mav> only if they say they want their name listed, will we list it <TimShell> Matching corporate donations would <TerryFoote> TimShell: I disagree with that entirely. <TimShell> You think listing donors would double are donations ? <TerryFoote> TimShell: The brick and mortar world has been using benefactor pages to great success. <dannyisme> actually, listing names would increase donations <dannyisme> yup <TerryFoote> TimShell: It would be a lot better than what we're doing now, which is esentially nothing. <dannyisme> we can even think of ways to parallel that <dannyisme> for instance, we can name a server after a donor <mav> TerryFoote ; we already list PayPal donations ; donors seem to like it <TerryFoote> AND.... <TerryFoote> Mav: Yeah, I'm talking about other forms of donations. <mav> Of course <TerryFoote> The most donations in any given non-profit, from what I've read, are from repeat donars. <mav> we just need to figure out a sustainable way to get that to work <dannyisme> to get repeat donors, we have to acknowledge donors <dannyisme> a thank you card is a nice way <TerryFoote> dannyisme: YES! <mav> before we approache past donors, we *must* make sure we are a registered non-profit in that state/nation <TerryFoote> dannyisme: a thank you card is a beginning. <dannyisme> it is step one <innocence> mav: we're alreayd breaking the law by soliciting donations <innocence> i doubt it makes much difference :) <mav> kate ; we are in a gray area <Angela> Most donors don't give an address, so we can't send cards. <innocence> mav: yes <TerryFoote> Angela: snail mail donars do. <TimShell> How about a contest: The top 10 largest private donors will have servers named after them <dannyisme> and that will save us stamps <Angela> TerryFoote: that is a tiny percentage of donors. <innocence> Tim: please no :( <Angela> And I don't think we should start collecting addresses without giving people assurance about what we're going to do with those addresses. <mav> and snail mail donors are where some of our biggest single donations come from <TerryFoote> Angela: in the short run yes. <mav> angela ; of course <Angela> aren't the servers called things like yaseo9834624 now? <TimShell> why not innocence ? <innocence> Ang: not the important ones <dannyisme> actually, i think we should have a huge database of donors <dannyisme> as many as we can get <innocence> Tim: i don't think you'll get anyone to agree that donators should dictate sysadmin practices <innocence> it's a really bad trend to start. <mav> it's just a name
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<mav> yann! <innocence> "okay, this server foodonator is going to be renamed srv46" <innocence> "no, we're not allowed to do that" <yannf> hi mav & others <jeronim`> we can just alias it to srv46 <jeronim`> then we win and they win <jeronim`> :)
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<dammit> oy <mav> yes - alias <MikeSnow> Agree with jeronim <TimShell> howdy dammit <dammit> hello <innocence> i am absolutely against this idea <innocence> i refuse to implement it. :) <MikeSnow> Servers can be named after somebody on a foundation page and the sysadmins can call it whatever they want <TerryFoote> dammit: Yo! <mav> but this would only be for real big donors - basically the donation amount would need to pay for the server <TimShell> Would having a server named after you make you want to donate more ? <dannyisme> we can do what the Jewish National Fund used to do with trees: they got people to donate teh same forest, and then just kept changing the plaque when the donors came to visit ;-) <innocence> me personally? no, i hate vanity <innocence> if i donated anything, it'd be anonymous <dannyisme> but, innocence, many people donate for reasons of vanity <TimShell> People are weird. <innocence> sure. but it's not worth the problems it'll cause. <TerryFoote> It would be about like having General Motors naming an engine part after you. <dammit> it is not that great, knowing how we curse servers sometimes. <dammit> I HATE YOU ANDERSEN! ;-) <dannyisme> next time you go to a museum or a theater, check out how everything is named after someone <innocence> danny: yes, because the names have no meaning <dannyisme> or a university for taht matter <TimShell> Ok, in conclusion, we all agree we should find some way to acknowledge donors <dannyisme> it does to the people who gave teh money <TimShell> And we can decide later the best way(s) to do this <dannyisme> yes, i agree <dannyisme> and we have to thank them <TimShell> There is one other thing I think is important <dannyisme> very important <TerryFoote> Thanking them is a great start. <dammit> this is what 'thank you' pages are for. <MikeSnow> We can also find sponsors for staff <dannyisme> more than thank you pages <cimon> innocence, put a sticker with the donors name on the physical server. <TimShell> We did a piss poor job of publicizing the fund drive <innocence> name the desks in the office after them, or something :) <TimShell> We basically relied on internal promotion <MikeSnow> Or split-work arrangements like some of Mozilla's people <TimShell> There was no media blitz <mav> danny :) <mav> a great many do - esp big donors <mav> that is why so many libraries and museums have wings name after big donors <dannyisme> how do we change taht <mav> and so many other buildings have bricks with donor names on them <TimShell> No interviews set up with CNN or whomever <mav> what Danny said <mav> agreed <mav> lists on the foundation wiki at the very least <mav> TimShell ; we put banners up on every page on the 50th most popular website on the Internet <cimon> TimShell, no mediablitz before we are impervious to criticism <mav> but yeah, we could have done more <dannyisme> 40th <TimShell> I think PR in a fund drive could change the scale of our total donations <mav> yikes <TimShell> Double the total maybe <dannyisme> i agree with that <dammit> well, if we ask for one million <cimon> TimShell, our modesty is our shield against journalistic axe-jobs. <dammit> that's already news-worthy <dammit> or 10 millions. <dammit> ;-D <TimShell> Fuck journalistic axe jobs <mav> we can't ask for money we have no plan to spend <mav> we at least need a 5 year plan <dannyisme> we need a 2 year budget minimum <TimShell> This is probably the last year we will spend less than $1 million <mav> dannyisme ; you are insame <TimShell> We need to start thinking bigger <mav> insane <dannyisme> insane? <dannyisme> i have been called worse <mav> we ahve no idea what our costs will be even 2 quarters in the future <dannyisme> we definitely need a long term budget <mav> esp in regards to hardware purches <dannyisme> we cant do a quarterly budget <mav> purchases <TimShell> We should make publicizing the next fund drive a major priority <dannyisme> especially when donors want to know what we are doing <dannyisme> for instance, terry has been working with hp <mav> danny ; a 5 year plan <dannyisme> he has done some amazing work <cimon> mav you need to budget lay-away funds for emergencies <dannyisme> and they want us to propose something for two years <mav> cimon ; we have a reserve fund <dannyisme> that means we need a budget for two years <mav> dannyisme ; we can do that, but it will be hand waving <TerryFoote> dannyisme: I have part of that figured out how to pitch to them. <dannyisme> we cannot afford to handwave <cimon> mav, the reserve fund has to scale with the general growth <TerryFoote> But they will want a very clear itemization of how their money was spent. <dannyisme> at work, i put together budgets all the time for a year in advance <MikeSnow> Actually, we should start thinking about developing a real endowment <dannyisme> at the museum they are planning 2006-2007 now <mav> cimon ; 10% per quarter ; soon to be 20% per quarter if I have my way <TimShell> Are they growing 300% a year ? <dammit> dannyisme: at the museum they have done that for years? <dannyisme> yes, they have <dammit> dannyisme: is museum growing that fast? :) <cimon> MikeSnow, in the long term, we need a fund that will support wikimedias activities purely on the interest it generates... <mav> dannyisme ; they museum is not growing 500% per year <dannyisme> no, but we are planning exhibitions in 2007 2008 2009 <dannyisme> they are planning <MikeSnow> cimon: Yes, that's what I meant <dannyisme> i no longer work there <mav> planning is one thing, bugeting that far ahead is another <dannyisme> they are budgeting <TimShell> This is not a budget meeting <dannyisme> and we have to do the same <dannyisme> no <dannyisme> but fundraising relates directly to budgets <dannyisme> we have to explain why we need money <mav> danny ; for us it not possible to budget that far ahead - we are growing way too fast <dannyisme> we can get sponsorship for sectioons of the budget <TimShell> We need the money because we can only afford to do 1% of the things we would like to do <dannyisme> then we have to do the best we can <dannyisme> and adjust accordingly <mav> danny ; I can make *draft* budgets that far ahead and we can adjust and make them offical a quarter or two ahead of time <TimShell> Our budget needs for the next funddrive will likely be much the same as this one, except times 4 <dannyisme> that is not acceptable <TimShell> So let's focus on that <dannyisme> we need a real budget for 2006 <dannyisme> all of 2006 <mav> danny ; that's not possible <dannyisme> mav, every company in the world does it <mav> my error cone for hardare purchaes is huge ; anywhere between 2 million and 4 million dollars <dannyisme> good, then make it 3 million and move on to the next item <mav> dannyisme ; what other company is growiing as exponentially as fast as we are? <dannyisme> that is not a reason to avoid doing things properly <dannyisme> we cant wait till we grow to decide what we need <mav> the further in the future we try to predict things, the larger the uncertainly <dannyisme> that is fine <dannyisme> we can adjust <TerryFoote> Mav: The thing is if we want corporate donations, they are going to demand this of us. <dannyisme> but we have to have an outline at least <TimShell> Does anyone want to talk about publicizing the next fund drive ? <dannyisme> yes <cimon> mav, hence the need for a big buffer <dammit> we can ask for lots. <innocence> mav, just lie <mav> Terry ; I have nothing against creating draft budgets that far ahead <dammit> really lots. <innocence> no-one expects it to be accurate anyway <TerryFoote> It doesn't have to be perfect. <TerryFoote> And I personally have no idea how to go about budgeting what we need. <TerryFoote> BUT... <mav> in fact I planned to do so already <cimon> mav just make a point of allocating funds for stuff even further in the future then the span of the budget. As the foundation is non-profit, it can afford to accrue capita. <TerryFoote> We're going to have a hard time getting money from deep pockets if we don't have some type of financial blue print.
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<jwales> hi <dannyisme> hi jimbo <jwales> there's a meeting now? <dannyisme> we definitely need draft budgets for all of 2006 <mav> draft budgets, yes <dannyisme> and a good idea of what we will need in 2007 and 2008 <TimShell> We were discussing fundraising <TimShell> And what we learned from the recent drive <TimShell> and what we can do differently next time to make it better <jwales> this is an announced meeting? <Angela> Yes. <mav> yep <jwales> geez <dannyisme> if terry goes to hp and asks for half a million dollars over two years, he is gonna have to tell them why we need that and not 450,000 <jwales> I have a board meeting on my schedule for tomorrow <TimShell> I wanted to arrive at some conclusions today <Angela> that's a chapter meeting isn't it? <mav> meetings, meetings, meetings <TimShell> and bring those to the meeting tomorrow <TerryFoote> Well the good thing is that it's HP that recommended the 500K figure... <jwales> where was this announced? <TimShell> see topic
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<mav> 500K is a nice start <innocence> where am i not looking for these things? <TerryFoote> But we'll need to tell them beforehand where the 500K is going. <mav> jawales ; on the ml list 3 weeks ago <Angela> Innocence: I don't think it's public knowledge. I hadn't heard of it before today either. <innocence> Ang: oh. well, it is now :) <mav> Terry ; absolutely ; hardware is always a safe bet <jwales> HP is not the right terminology <jwales> It is the Hewlett Foundation <jwales> which is totally separate from the company <dannyisme> HF <TerryFoote> Yes, yes. the William and Flora Hewlett Foundation.
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<Angela> The only thing I knew about HP before now was regarding potential Wikiversity development that Anthere was going to follow up on this month.
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<Angela> I thought the Hewlett Foundation just wanted a proposal from us? <dannyisme> i sent a proposal <jwales> Terry met with some people when he was in California. <dannyisme> for 350k <mav> I can create draft budgets for all of 2006 - but would like to know if I can do so on meta? <TerryFoote> They told me they're ready to give us money. <jwales> They invited him to come and speak in Utah. <jwales> They seem enthusiastic. <mav> Utah? Tim can drive :) <TimShell> Or not <mav> walking is not a great option in that part of the country <mav> so - budgeting ; can I do that in public? <Angela> I don't see why not. <mav> cool <Angela> this was meant to be a short meeting, and since it's 75 minutes gone already, is there anything urgent we still need to cover? <TimShell> Does anyone care about publicizing the next fund drive ? <TerryFoote> Wow 75 minutes already? <dammit> if we make it big, we need it to be public <Angela> Publicizing it how? We could make a press release.
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<TimShell> Getting Jimmy on Larry King <jwales> I apologize for missing this meeting. I put all meetings on my calendar, but this one is not there, so I assume I never heard about it. <TimShell> Getting all the blogs to mention it <TerryFoote> A link on the 50th largest website in the world is pretty good publicity. <dannyisme> it will be there next week <MikeSnow> Dan Gillmor mentioned it <TimShell> Off site publicity reaches a whole new set of people <jwales> I have one primary comment about fundraising ideas before I have to go...
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<jwales> And this is that we need to brainstorm about how to achieve two things, two things which are somewhat in tension... <jwales> 1. Being able to declare victory no matter what happens <jwales> 2. Not giving people the feeling that it is ok to not give because we already achieved success <jwales> I think Mav has some great ideas about that... <jwales> We should listen to him. <TimShell> How important is #1 ? <jwales> I think #1 is quite important for morale within the community, for positive press, etc. <jwales> People always ask: "Can you get enough money?" <jwales> And I'm always able to confidently say that the public has responded with much love every time we have to ask. <jwales> I think that's valuable. <TimShell> Id rather fall just short of a $500,000 goal then to sneak past a $200,000 goal <jwales> If we ask for $1,000,000 and end up with $250,000 people will start to talk about us having jumped the shark, or gotten too greedy, or some nonsense like that I think. <jwales> Tim: yes <jwales> But I'd rather be able to fall just short of $500,000 and be able to say "We aimed for $200,000 for basic needs plus more for exciting projects, and we got $473k" <TimShell> (hi ausir) <jwales> I think it's just a matter of carefully setting things up. <MikeSnow> A drive is going to peter out after the target is reached anyway <TimShell> We can have a Maslow's hierarchy of Wikipedia needs <MikeSnow> You'll never approach 500K if your goal is 200K <Angela> That's why we need multiple goals. <mav> we need to coordinate contacting various large companies about matching programs <mav> press release <mav> jwales ; I forgot about it as well ; don't feel bad :) <mav> a set of people less likely to donate, but I see your point <mav> meeting the current quarters budget <- minimal victory <mav> what we need is long term planning ; a 3 year plan and draft budgets for each of those five years <mav> have special projects be part of our planning <mav> 5 year plan <mav> we can have tiers instead of just one goal <mav> what agela said <mav> but those goals need to be backed up with a plan to use that money <mav> jwales ; yep <mav> so far all we have been asking for is for donors to cover basic needs ; I think we can start asking for more ; but again, we need a plan <innocence> we're hardly covering basic needs at the moment <mav> innocence ; please help me with the hardware items of the next few budgets then <innocence> mav, did you see the wishlist? <TimShell> Maybe instead of some 5 year plan, we can compile a list of the various things we would like to do in the future <innocence> http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_servers/hardware_orders/wishlist <innocence> people will write stuff here we want <mav> if my projections are too conservative, then I need to know <dannyisme> Tim, the two arent exclusive <TimShell> Saying we want at some point to get free encyclopedias to Africa is good <TimShell> Trying to put that in a plan and budget for it would be silly <innocence> the money we're spending now, from the last fund drive, should have been spent 3 months ago, to keep the site working properly <mav> tim ; that would be part of the 5 year plan <dannyisme> Terry did something very wise with HF <dannyisme> he divided our needs into 3 <jwales> ok I have to go <dannyisme> Hardware, Staffing, Philanthropy <TimShell> bye jimmy <jwales> I want to budget for experiments in Africa, though. To see what we can do with a little money to promote the growth of African languages, for example. <Angela> can't the money be spent on servers earlier this time (like now) so we don't have this problem of the site dying every time we're trying to have a fundraising drive? <innocence> j, i really don't think we're ready for that <innocence> Angela> no, because we don't _have_ the money <jwales> Even a mailing to every professor we can find, a paper mailing, who knows English or French and some African language, might produce amazing results. <Angela> innocence: why not? <jwales> Well, we have quite a pile of money at the moment. <innocence> i mean, we do now, but we didn't when we needed it <jwales> Right. <innocence> we are spending it now, but it's too late <dammit> we do now. <dammit> and we will try to spend some more <jwales> Let's spend it all now. :-) <TimShell> We need the fundraising to get the money for the servers to make the site work well during the fundraising <dammit> and do fundraiser before we run out of it <dammit> we're not a bank <dammit> we don't earn money by keeping it ;-) <Angela> innocence: we have $200,000 in the paypal account for a start. Is all that going to be spent by the end of September (which is when this budget was meant to last until)? <dammit> well, banks don't either.. <innocence> Angela> sure, if you can promise we'll have more :) <dammit> Angela: I hope that we will spend that money. <Angela> and can't the Google servers be got now? <dannyisme> dammit, can you give a maximum budget for 2006 hardware? <innocence> danny: $5,000,000 <dammit> 5m$ <dammit> haha <innocence> :) <dammit> innocence: ;-) <jwales> "maximum budget" - yummy! <jwales> dammit, why don't we order those 30 application server boxes on Monday? <TimShell> Next week we can have a budget meeting, and talk about fundraising <jwales> and the switches <jwales> ok bye all <Angela> Bye. <dannyisme> bye <dammit> jwales: I want to figure out
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<dammit> all other needs... <dannyisme> dammit, sir, i think that was an order :-) <dammit> so that we don't end up without something we really need <innocence> if we spend $200k now, and we need something else next month, we have problems. <innocence> so, how soon are we _sure- more money will be available?
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<dammit> it does not mean though <dammit> that we have to keep 200k$ until next month <Angela> considering the offers from Google, Sun, etc, surely we will have the money available. What is stopping us taking those offers? <innocence> i know <innocence> i think we should spend some :) <innocence> ang: j just said to me that we're waiting for both google and the other people <innocence> (i nagged him in private about it) <Angela> we're waiting for them? <innocence> yes <Angela> I thought it was the other way round. <innocence> shocking, isn't it :-) <innocence> so did i. <innocence> no-one tells us anything <brion> has anything stopped us from accepting hardware from sun? cause if so we should unstop it :D <brion> where "we" is "whoever is talking to them, since it's not us" <innocence> j: we're waiting on them too <mav> innocence : I agree <mav> bye jimmy <mav> staffing will never be a big enough item to be on its own <mav> Overhead would be <mav> Angela ; I agree <innocence> er. <mav> TimShell ; I agree <innocence> brion: --^ that was for you <mav> Angela ; yep, current quarter ends 30 Sep <mav> yikes ; my max was 4 million <mav> based on current grouth rate <brion> boohoo <mav> a minimal budget would be ~2 million <mav> but the max is more likely <mav> TimShell ; yes - we need a budget meeting ASAP <mav> I have a draft budget for next quarter that I need to update <mav> brion! <mav> kate ; depends on corp donations of money and servers <dannyisme> do not do a minimal budget <mav> I say, exhaust the hardware budget before the end of the month <mav> we have enough offers in the pipeline to carry us to the next fund drive - be it i December or January\ <innocence> mav: that isn't good enough :) <mav> a minimal budget is just a start <mav> well, we can't have another fund drive for at least a month <dannyisme> we cant have another fund drive for at least 5 months <TimShell> That's an opinion Danny <mav> that's wrong Danny <dannyisme> that is a fact <dannyisme> people will get fed up <MikeSnow> four months, try January <dannyisme> there were already grumblings about this fundraiser <dannyisme> february <mav> we had a drive late last year and early this year <TimShell> If we install new servers and have twice the traffic in 2-3 months, then we can afford to hit people up, because they will be new people <dannyisme> two a year <mav> both were smash successes <innocence> no-one's going to donate until the site is fast again <mav> TimShell ; exactly <mav> buy servers now <innocence> so you'll need to wait until then, at least :) <innocence> we have, some <mav> our traffic doubles every 4 to 5 months <mav> compounded <TimShell> In 12 years every human on earth will spend every waking hour at wikipedia <mav> there will be many new eyeballs enven in a couple months <mav> :) <brion> aaahhhh <brion> my servers... melting... <mav> I'd like us to have a two week long fund drive the first half of december ; offer gift cards and remind people about tax deductions <TimShell> We already talked about December <TimShell> We were going to focus on corporate giving <innocence> what is a gift card? <dannyisme> a gft to the wikimedia foundation has been made in your honor <innocence> ah <mav> "A donation in the name of X" that people could buy for one another <innocence> how vain :) <brion> hahaha <dannyisme> actually, innocence, very popular <innocence> yeah, it is a common vice <brion> you can edit this donation right now <dannyisme> when my dad died, we asked people to donate to the canadian cancer society instead of sending flowers <dannyisme> they sent gift cards <Angela> I was thinking gift cards were like Christmas cards with Wikimedia adverts on them. Maybe CafePress could do those :) <dannyisme> a donation has been made in his honor <TimShell> Are we done then ? <dannyisme> we can do things like graduation gift cards <TimShell> I'll post a summary of conclusions and inconclusions on meta <dannyisme> in honor of your graduation, a gift has been made to the wikimedia foundation <TimShell> Hopefully prior to the meeting tomorrow <MikeSnow> Summary: Get credit card processing set up <MikeSnow> Plan for next fundraiser (publicity <MikeSnow> and BUY SERVERS <brion> wheeee <TimShell> schedule fund drive well in advance <TimShell> In December hit up US corporations for tax-incentivized donations <innocence> how much money do we have left? <TimShell> Get on corporate charity rosters <TimShell> Terry will approach coroprations about sponsoring the next fund drive <TimShell> Find some good way to acknowledge donors <innocence> (we need to know how many servers to buy :) <mav> kids love to get those :) <mav> we can have a contest for the design of the card <TimShell> Publicize fund drive so it is brought to attention of wider audience <mav> I think so <mav> several card types - yes <TerryFoote> TimShell: BUT.... <mav> but we need somebody in the office to handle sending out the card <dannyisme> kira will design the card <mav> s <mav> when is the meeting tomorrow? <TerryFoote> We need some type of concensus on what my pitch to them will be. <dannyisme> that is me, mav <mav> press release <mav> lots of servers <mav> early December <dannyisme> i do mailings <Angela> TerryFoote: that can be drafted on meta. <TerryFoote> On what's in it for them <mav> Innocence ; I dunno - MDavis is keeping the books atm <TimShell> Terry: we can discuss that tomorrow <TerryFoote> Angela: beautiful <mav> dannyisme ; you'll need help - that is a rather menial task ; perfect for interns <dannyisme> i like menial tasks and the clash <dannyisme> dsandanista will be perfect for that <TerryFoote> TimShell: Cool. I won't be around tomorrow, so if you can email me the gist of the conclusion, I'd be most appreciative. <Angela> 2 hours is too long for an IRC meeting. <TimShell> No kidding <TimShell> Terry can you crash to officers meeting ? <TimShell> Would anyone object ? <Angela> as long as the meeting is less than 2 hours, I shan't object ;) <mav> I don't - he should be in the meeting <TimShell> Come to the meeting Terry <TerryFoote> When is it? <dannyisme> terry should be there <dannyisme> if he can <TimShell> 16:00 UTC <TerryFoote> Tomorrow? <TimShell> Which I think is 9 AM Las Vegas time <TimShell> yes tomorrow <TerryFoote> OK, I can do that. <cimon> dannyisme, I would never have figured you for a clash fan <TimShell> Mention my name and you get in for half price <TerryFoote> Is Las Vegas Pacific time? <TimShell> yes <Angela> I thought it was 18 UTC. <TimShell> Today's was 18 <mav> what is the meeting about? <TerryFoote> Sooooo....shall we have a pre-arranged time limit? <TimShell> Jimmy is chairint <dannyisme> btw, we have 90k in paypal right now <TimShell> chairing <cimon> dannyisme, beastie boys are much more legit imo <TimShell> so whatever he wants it to be about I guess <TimShell> But see the agenda here: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Board_agenda <Angela> I thought Anthere couldn't do meetings that early. <TimShell> It has said 16:00 UTC for weeks <TimShell> Anthere didn't say anything to me about it <mav> the meeting will still likely be going on and on by the time she gets there :)\ <Angela> TimShell: did you see the talk page? <TimShell> which talk page ? <Angela> Http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikimedia_meeting_agendas. <mav> we need to set a time for a budget meeting tomorrow <Angela> There can't be a budget meeting tomorrow. <Angela> There's already the chapter meeting then. <mav> I'd like to have a Q4 budget ready before Q4 starts <mav> I'll also create drafts for all of 2006 <TimShell> Angela - the organizaion of meetings part ? <Angela> Yes, probably. <TimShell> Yes I saw that <mav> aside : quarter naming will be weird next year ; the first quarter of 2006 will be called Fiscal 2006 Q3 <TimShell> Are we changing our fiscal year ? <mav> aleady did <TimShell> What is next quarter ? <mav> June 30 is the last day of our fiscal year now <mav> I'm still calling it Q4, but it really is Fiscal 2006 Q2 <TimShell> We have the same fiscal year as Microsoft then <mav> lovely :) <TimShell> I suggest everyone leave now <mav> k
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Session Close: Sat Sep 17 13:02:16 2005