Movement roles project/Initial Questions II/Mahmoud

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[2010-12-7 8:45:00] Abbas Mahmoud: hi

[2010-12-7 8:45:12] Jon Huggett: Hi Abbas

[2010-12-7 8:45:59] Abbas Mahmoud: How are you doing?

[2010-12-7 8:46:12] Jon Huggett: Very well, thanks. And you?

[2010-12-7 8:46:34] Abbas Mahmoud: Never been better:-)

[2010-12-7 8:47:15] Jon Huggett: Good to hear. I am warm inside here, while it is freezing outside!

[2010-12-7 8:48:42] Abbas Mahmoud: Owh...I'm aware of the snow over there...Sue Gardner's flight was cancelled from LHR due to the snow...Luckily she managed to get one from Gatwick

[2010-12-7 8:49:08] Jon Huggett: And then Gatwick was snowed under, too

[2010-12-7 8:49:16] Jon Huggett: Is now still a good time for you to talk?

[2010-12-7 8:49:23] Abbas Mahmoud: Yeah

[2010-12-7 8:49:58] Jon Huggett: shall we voice? video?

[2010-12-7 8:50:07] Abbas Mahmoud: I've checked: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Movement_roles_project/Initial_Questions. Thee are some questions I can answer; and some I can't

[2010-12-7 8:50:29] Jon Huggett: No problem. Let's just talk about the ones you can answer

[2010-12-7 8:51:43] Abbas Mahmoud: I wish I could use voice or video but I'm using an internet modem and they charge me very heftily; so I have to restrict myself to reducung the MBs i use...

[2010-12-7 8:52:23] Abbas Mahmoud: Internet is Africa is expensive; especially for students who are on a tight budget:-(

[2010-12-7 8:52:31] Jon Huggett: Understand. Shall we stay on chat?

[2010-12-7 8:52:40] Abbas Mahmoud: Yeah

[2010-12-7 8:53:53] Jon Huggett: OK. I'm really interested to hear the perspective on these questions from someone working with Wikimedia in Africa

[2010-12-7 8:54:25] Jon Huggett: Would it be easiest to go down the questions one by one? How would you like to go?

[2010-12-7 8:55:13] Abbas Mahmoud: I'm OK with whichever mode of Q&A you'd like to use

[2010-12-7 8:55:28] Jon Huggett: Let's start at the top

[2010-12-7 8:55:52] Jon Huggett: Are you familiar and comfortable with the vision and mission of the Wikimedia Foundation?

[2010-12-7 8:57:13] Abbas Mahmoud: I'm comfortable with Imagine a world.." --I'm not sure whether that's the mission or vision, though

[2010-12-7 8:57:59] Jon Huggett: It's a bit of both, really.

[2010-12-7 8:58:07] Abbas Mahmoud: Oh, ok

[2010-12-7 8:58:13] Jon Huggett: Does "Wikimedia Kenya" share the goals?

[2010-12-7 8:58:22] Jon Huggett: Sorry, mission/vision?

[2010-12-7 8:58:26] Abbas Mahmoud: Oh yeah

[2010-12-7 8:58:32] Jon Huggett: Great

[2010-12-7 8:58:38] Jon Huggett: Let's talk about the strategic goals

[2010-12-7 8:58:57] Abbas Mahmoud: I think you can't be a chapter without sharing the same goals with WMF

[2010-12-7 8:59:16] Jon Huggett: I think so, too. But just wanted to be sure.  :-)

[2010-12-7 8:59:45] Jon Huggett: Are you familiar with the strategic goals that came out of the planning process?

[2010-12-7 8:59:53] Abbas Mahmoud: yeah

[2010-12-7 9:00:12] Jon Huggett: How do these goals relate to what you are doing in Kenya?

[2010-12-7 9:00:59] Abbas Mahmoud: 'Coming fom Africa, the ones that may have an impact on us are:-increase global participation; improve quality and expand reach

[2010-12-7 9:01:42] Jon Huggett: Makes sense to me. How can the Wikimedia movement best increase participation, improve quality, and expand reach?

[2010-12-7 9:02:50] Abbas Mahmoud: I think that AWARENESS should come before PARTICIPATION

[2010-12-7 9:03:18] Abbas Mahmoud: Some people don't even know what Wikipedia is in the first place

[2010-12-7 9:03:20] Jon Huggett: OK. How can the Wikimedia movement best increase awareness?

[2010-12-7 9:03:54] Abbas Mahmoud: By creating a presence in Africa

[2010-12-7 9:04:03] Abbas Mahmoud: like what they are doing in India

[2010-12-7 9:04:17] Jon Huggett: What sorts of things are they doing in India that they could do in Africa?

[2010-12-7 9:04:39] Abbas Mahmoud: Opening an office

[2010-12-7 9:05:03] Abbas Mahmoud: Regular visits by the high level staff/Jimmy Wales

[2010-12-7 9:05:35] Jon Huggett: Where should the office(s) go? Nairobi, Johannesburg, Lagos?

[2010-12-7 9:05:56] Abbas Mahmoud: Nairobi and/or Jo'burg

[2010-12-7 9:06:31] Abbas Mahmoud: But i would prioritize an office in Kenya first before South Africa

[2010-12-7 9:06:53] Abbas Mahmoud: since the Swahili Wikipedia is more established than the Afrikaans

[2010-12-7 9:07:03] Jon Huggett: OK.

[2010-12-7 9:07:13] Jon Huggett: Is the Swahili Wikipedia the largest one in an African language?

[2010-12-7 9:07:20] Abbas Mahmoud: Yeah

[2010-12-7 9:07:38] Abbas Mahmoud: the swahili wiki has more than 20,000 articles

[2010-12-7 9:07:58] Jon Huggett: OK. So you would go Nairobi, then Johannesburg, then Lagos?

[2010-12-7 9:08:05] Abbas Mahmoud: Yeah

[2010-12-7 9:08:27] Jon Huggett: OK. What would the office in Nairobi do?

[2010-12-7 9:09:22] Abbas Mahmoud: form local partnerships with educational institutions as well as NGO's

[2010-12-7 9:09:50] Abbas Mahmoud: For instance, I just realised that Google Kenya had partnered with Strathmore University

[2010-12-7 9:10:05] Jon Huggett: Interesting. What are they doing together?

[2010-12-7 9:11:18] Abbas Mahmoud: I'm not really sure...but Google holds a number of events at Strathmore University; for instance, it recently held a 3-day G-Kenya event

[2010-12-7 9:11:42] Abbas Mahmoud: Prior to the G-Kenya event, they had held a G-Uganda event

[2010-12-7 9:12:10] Jon Huggett: So they are building awareness and participation

[2010-12-7 9:12:24] Jon Huggett: So we could do the same?

[2010-12-7 9:12:28] Abbas Mahmoud: Exactly

[2010-12-7 9:12:48] Abbas Mahmoud: Increase community engagement

[2010-12-7 9:13:30] Abbas Mahmoud: Accoording to Wikimedia Foundation's report, Wikipedia usership in Africa is less than 16%

[2010-12-7 9:13:30] Jon Huggett: How would you enage the community to participate in Wikimedia?

[2010-12-7 9:13:50] Jon Huggett: So lift usership first?

[2010-12-7 9:13:57] Abbas Mahmoud: yeah

[2010-12-7 9:14:00] Jon Huggett: Is that the same as lifting reach?

[2010-12-7 9:14:14] Abbas Mahmoud: yap

[2010-12-7 9:14:50] Abbas Mahmoud: a person must have to have used Wikipedia before telling him/her to edit

[2010-12-7 9:15:08] Jon Huggett: exactly

[2010-12-7 9:15:25] Jon Huggett: are the barriers to usership similar in Kenya as in Africa?

[2010-12-7 9:15:27] Abbas Mahmoud: regarding how to engage the community...hmmm..that's the hardest part

[2010-12-7 9:15:49] Jon Huggett: could we learn from WMF in India or Google in Kenya?

[2010-12-7 9:16:10] Abbas Mahmoud: that's a good idea

[2010-12-7 9:16:50] Abbas Mahmoud: there is a digital divide in Kenya. So the barriers are as a result of where you come from

[2010-12-7 9:17:23] Jon Huggett: can we help bridge the digital divide, or do we have to engage those who already have access?

[2010-12-7 9:18:58] Abbas Mahmoud: bridging the digital divide...I don't know whether that's possible...but i heard that fibre optic had arrived in Mombasa, so i don't know whether that will change things

[2010-12-7 9:19:29] Abbas Mahmoud: capitalising on the one's that have internet access might work

[2010-12-7 9:19:46] Jon Huggett: it probably will. I guess, the question for us is where to start

[2010-12-7 9:20:11] Jon Huggett: working with those already on line is probably the right place

[2010-12-7 9:20:20] Jon Huggett: what role do you see for Wikimedia Kenya in that?

[2010-12-7 9:21:23] Abbas Mahmoud: but again, I have internet access using my modem, but I don't use it very often. I only edit Wikipedia at the University where there's free wifi (which is not that fast)

[2010-12-7 9:21:58] Jon Huggett: aha. which points again to building partnerships with educational institutions

[2010-12-7 9:23:38] Abbas Mahmoud: Wikimedia Kenya is currently concentrating on the offline Wikipedia at the moment. this is because those who don't have/cant afford internet are so many -- so this offline project is likely to have a high impact

[2010-12-7 9:24:07] Jon Huggett: great. how would WM Kenya work with a WMF office in Nairobi?

[2010-12-7 9:25:04] Abbas Mahmoud: i don't know

[2010-12-7 9:25:24] Jon Huggett: would you see the office as a branch of WMF, while the chapter worked alongside?

[2010-12-7 9:26:00] Abbas Mahmoud: by the way, Wikimedia Kenya is not yet an official chapter as of now

[2010-12-7 9:26:22] Jon Huggett: are you trying to achieve official recognition?

[2010-12-7 9:26:55] Abbas Mahmoud: yeah, it's been six months now

[2010-12-7 9:27:34] Jon Huggett: what do you need to do for WM Kenya to be recognized officially?

[2010-12-7 9:28:08] Abbas Mahmoud: 1. Gather the mass

[2010-12-7 9:28:28] Abbas Mahmoud: 2. Create the bylaws and submit them to the Chapters Committee

[2010-12-7 9:28:57] Abbas Mahmoud: 3. Satisfy Chapters Committee that you will be sustainable in the long run

[2010-12-7 9:29:04] Jon Huggett: You already have a list of members on meta. Is that not enough mass?

[2010-12-7 9:29:49] Abbas Mahmoud: I think the biggest challenge is convincing chapcom that we are going to be sustainable in the foreseeable future

[2010-12-7 9:30:08] Jon Huggett: what do you have to do to convince them that you will be sustainable?

[2010-12-7 9:31:59] Abbas Mahmoud: the quality of discussions that we have on the mailing list; organising events; members' commitment -- this is my definition of sustainability

[2010-12-7 9:32:36] Abbas Mahmoud: But i think that by mid january, ChapCom would have approved us

[2010-12-7 9:32:59] Jon Huggett: does ChapCom share your definition of sustainability?

[2010-12-7 9:34:05] Abbas Mahmoud: I'm not sure. But i've been in contact with ChapCom some weeks ago, and by the look of things, they are already satisfied that we can be a chapter

[2010-12-7 9:34:29] Jon Huggett: sounds great.

[2010-12-7 9:34:36] Jon Huggett: do you have your bylaws sorted?

[2010-12-7 9:34:49] Abbas Mahmoud: what's left is for us to seal the remaining loopholes on the bylaws and submit a final draft for approval

[2010-12-7 9:35:12] Jon Huggett: sounds like you are very close

[2010-12-7 9:35:33] Jon Huggett: I hope it all goes throug hin January

[2010-12-7 9:35:37] Abbas Mahmoud: yeah

[2010-12-7 9:36:00] Abbas Mahmoud: I hope we become the 1st chapter (before South Africa)

[2010-12-7 9:36:12] Jon Huggett: :-) You might!

[2010-12-7 9:36:33] Jon Huggett: if WMF were to open an office in Nairobi, like it has done in Inda, how would it work with the chapter?

[2010-12-7 9:37:49] Jon Huggett: Are there any other groups within the Wikimedia movement that might help build awareness, reach, usership, and participation in Wikimedia in Kenya?

[2010-12-7 9:38:19] Jon Huggett: Would the office and chapter work alongside each other, or would one run or fund the other, do you think?

[2010-12-7 9:38:35] Abbas Mahmoud: most of us in the chapter can not commit ourselves fully; so an employee would be able to do much more and faster than we can

[2010-12-7 9:38:49] Jon Huggett: yes

[2010-12-7 9:40:02] Abbas Mahmoud: the office in Nrb could delegate some responsibility to us, since we come from different cities all over Kenya. So, for instance, if there's an event in Msa, it could capitalise on our team members from Mombasa

[2010-12-7 9:40:17] Jon Huggett: OK. Is that where you are?

[2010-12-7 9:40:59] Abbas Mahmoud: and the office would be more suited to liaise with the press and publicity issues

[2010-12-7 9:41:09] Jon Huggett: Understand. What does WM Kenya most need from the rest of the movement?

[2010-12-7 9:41:15] Abbas Mahmoud: I come from Mombasa, but I am in nairobi

[2010-12-7 9:41:40] Jon Huggett: Great. So you know each city

[2010-12-7 9:42:26] Abbas Mahmoud: No, I don't. But i have members coming from Kisumu, Nyeri, Kakamega, etc

[2010-12-7 9:43:28] Abbas Mahmoud: What does the movement have to offer WM Kenya?

[2010-12-7 9:44:23] Jon Huggett: Yes. For WM Kenya to flourish, what help can the rest of the movement offer? For example, you mentioned opening an office in Nairobi, like in India. What else could help you WM Kenya prosper?

[2010-12-7 9:45:55] Abbas Mahmoud: Oh, erm getting us registered (although that's being sorted out). We could have received local suport, financial or otherwise, from local institutions were we a legally-recognised entity

[2010-12-7 9:46:25] Abbas Mahmoud: Ford Foundation, for instance, can't give us a grant at the moment

[2010-12-7 9:46:58] Abbas Mahmoud: Google Kenya could not give us their support as well, for the dame reason

[2010-12-7 9:47:09] Abbas Mahmoud: *same

[2010-12-7 9:47:11] Jon Huggett: Got it. But once you are legally incorporated, you can receive money?

[2010-12-7 9:47:17] Abbas Mahmoud: yeah

[2010-12-7 9:48:09] Jon Huggett: OK. Talking about the rest of the movement, what do you see the core tasks and roles of the chapters committee to be?

[2010-12-7 9:48:20] Abbas Mahmoud: my opinion is that many organisations will be willing to support us if we are a legal entity. Especially youth driven entities attract much attention

[2010-12-7 9:48:56] Jon Huggett: makes sense. would that support be both monetary and otherwise?

[2010-12-7 9:49:38] Abbas Mahmoud: yeah financial or otherwise. though what does the term otherwise stand for you?

[2010-12-7 9:50:06] Jon Huggett: offer in-kind support, promote us, all that sort of thing

[2010-12-7 9:50:14] Abbas Mahmoud: Ooh, ok

[2010-12-7 9:50:26] Jon Huggett: things that do not require legal entity, but where a legal entity might lend us credibility

[2010-12-7 9:50:55] Abbas Mahmoud: ok

[2010-12-7 9:51:36] Jon Huggett: do you think having a legal entity helps even when there is no money involved?

[2010-12-7 9:52:09] Abbas Mahmoud: yeah, for identity purposes

[2010-12-7 9:52:25] Jon Huggett: makes good sense.

[2010-12-7 9:53:15] Jon Huggett: Can you give me Kenyan perspective on the rest of the movement? For example, what do you see the core tasks and roles of the chapters committee to be?

[2010-12-7 9:54:48] Abbas Mahmoud: just a moment, i'll be right back

[2010-12-7 9:55:17] Jon Huggett: no prob

[2010-12-7 9:56:57] Abbas Mahmoud: I'm back

[2010-12-7 9:57:08] Jon Huggett: great

[2010-12-7 9:57:26] Abbas Mahmoud: let me check chapcom's current roles first

[2010-12-7 9:57:42] Abbas Mahmoud: but i think i'm comfortable with them

[2010-12-7 9:58:34] Jon Huggett: OK. What should be the minimum standards of transparency among Wikimedia entities – the Wikimedia Foundation, chapters, etc.?

[2010-12-7 9:59:23] Abbas Mahmoud: Reporting

[2010-12-7 9:59:43] Jon Huggett: Yes. What should be open to other parts of the movement?

[2010-12-7 9:59:56] Abbas Mahmoud: financial reports

[2010-12-7 10:00:04] Abbas Mahmoud: board elections

[2010-12-7 10:00:08] Jon Huggett: OK

[2010-12-7 10:00:12] Abbas Mahmoud: partnerships

[2010-12-7 10:00:26] Jon Huggett: minutes of meetings?

[2010-12-7 10:00:26] Abbas Mahmoud: events, etc

[2010-12-7 10:00:57] Abbas Mahmoud: minutes, nop. resolutions yes

[2010-12-7 10:01:21] Jon Huggett: Why not minutes?

[2010-12-7 10:01:23] Abbas Mahmoud: i think that some of the things that we discuss are semi-private

[2010-12-7 10:01:46] Jon Huggett: OK. What sort of things would you not want to share?

[2010-12-7 10:02:38] Abbas Mahmoud: discussions of budget

[2010-12-7 10:02:54] Abbas Mahmoud: though the final budget should be posted

[2010-12-7 10:03:47] Jon Huggett: OK. Would revealing the contents of discussions on the budget make it hard to work?

[2010-12-7 10:04:34] Abbas Mahmoud: coming to think of i, yes

[2010-12-7 10:04:42] Abbas Mahmoud: 8*it

[2010-12-7 10:04:49] Abbas Mahmoud: *it

[2010-12-7 10:04:56] Jon Huggett: got it

[2010-12-7 10:05:42] Jon Huggett: Another question from the list ... to whom are Wikimedia entities accountable?

[2010-12-7 10:06:54] Abbas Mahmoud: the wikimedia community as well as it's donors

[2010-12-7 10:07:33] Jon Huggett: how will that work for Wikimedia Kenya?

[2010-12-7 10:09:42] Abbas Mahmoud: WM Kenya's report should be targeted to the Wikipedians in Kenya and abroad; our partners; our fellow chapters; as well as the Foundation.

[2010-12-7 10:10:44] Jon Huggett: That's good. Who will elect the board of WM Kenya?

[2010-12-7 10:10:48] Abbas Mahmoud: all stakeholders have the right to know what's happening

[2010-12-7 10:11:12] Abbas Mahmoud: the current members will vote for the board

[2010-12-7 10:11:43] Jon Huggett: How big do you expect the board and membership to be?

[2010-12-7 10:12:26] Abbas Mahmoud: and since we've been working together for quite awhile now, all the members know who is best suited to be a board member

[2010-12-7 10:13:23] Jon Huggett: I can see 18 members on your meta page. Is that the total now?

[2010-12-7 10:13:41] Abbas Mahmoud: the board will consist of a chairman, vice chair, secretary and treasurer

[2010-12-7 10:13:57] Abbas Mahmoud: no, we're more than that.

[2010-12-7 10:14:01] Jon Huggett: sounds like a good, small, tight board

[2010-12-7 10:14:10] Abbas Mahmoud: the mailing list has 35 members

[2010-12-7 10:14:37] Jon Huggett: wow. and will all 35 become 'members' of the legal entity?

[2010-12-7 10:15:32] Abbas Mahmoud: probably 25 are current members; while 10 of them consist of WMF staff, board members, chapcom members, as well as folks from other chapters

[2010-12-7 10:16:06] Jon Huggett: how big do you want to the membership to be?

[2010-12-7 10:16:43] Abbas Mahmoud: I don't know; but i want it to consist of committed people.

[2010-12-7 10:17:05] Abbas Mahmoud: you could be 5 members only and doing much more than a chapter with 50 members

[2010-12-7 10:17:36] Jon Huggett: that's true. is the membership formal ... e.g. membership of the legal entity ... or informal .. e.g. signed up to a mailing list?

[2010-12-7 10:18:07] Abbas Mahmoud: it's the quality (not the quantity) that matters the most. Though too many members could be unmanageable

[2010-12-7 10:18:36] Jon Huggett: Unmanageable is not good

[2010-12-7 10:18:37] Abbas Mahmoud: at the moment, membership is informal

[2010-12-7 10:19:05] Jon Huggett: so, in the bylaws, once the first board is elected, who appoints new people to the board?

[2010-12-7 10:19:19] Jon Huggett: does it coopt its own members, or is there an election among members at that time?

[2010-12-7 10:19:38] Abbas Mahmoud: there is an election

[2010-12-7 10:20:14] Abbas Mahmoud: candidates choose for a position; and the members vote

[2010-12-7 10:21:19] Jon Huggett: ... say this happens in 2013 ... will that be the members of the board at that time, or the informal members of Wikimedia Kenya at that time?

[2010-12-7 10:22:53] Abbas Mahmoud: what one of my team members was suggesting was having a probation policy and only the committed persons become formal members

[2010-12-7 10:23:39] Jon Huggett: if you have formal members, you have to have some process by which people join, even if it is very simple, I reckon

[2010-12-7 10:23:55] Abbas Mahmoud: yeah

[2010-12-7 10:24:07] Jon Huggett: Another big question from the list ... to support the growth and sustainability of the Wikimedia movement, what is the one, most important change we need to make?

[2010-12-7 10:24:40] Abbas Mahmoud: we need a board member as well as staff members from AFRICA

[2010-12-7 10:25:08] Jon Huggett: right now are there any at all?

[2010-12-7 10:25:14] Abbas Mahmoud: When i went to Wikimania 2010, i was the only black guy there!

[2010-12-7 10:25:17] Abbas Mahmoud: nop

[2010-12-7 10:25:26] Jon Huggett: how did that feel?

[2010-12-7 10:25:42] Abbas Mahmoud: there's not even a single African in the board of trustees

[2010-12-7 10:25:56] Abbas Mahmoud: and not a single staff member

[2010-12-7 10:26:15] Jon Huggett: right. the board is mostly white with some Asian people

[2010-12-7 10:26:35] Jon Huggett: how could some African folks on the board and staff help you?

[2010-12-7 10:26:53] Abbas Mahmoud: it felt weird; though i wasn't discriminated. The Wikimedia community is very hospitable

[2010-12-7 10:27:43] Jon Huggett: that's good to hear. what would be do to open up the next Wikimania?

[2010-12-7 10:27:43] Abbas Mahmoud: I was also the centre of attention...what with the press wanting to interview me; as well as an interview by Jimmy Wales

[2010-12-7 10:27:58] Jon Huggett: did you enjoy the attention?

[2010-12-7 10:29:58] Abbas Mahmoud: giving out more travel scholarships to africans. there were so many indians at wikimania, so i guess a big chunk of the scholarships went to them. Lots of the resources are going to india at the moment -- as part of the strategy plan

[2010-12-7 10:30:24] Abbas Mahmoud: yeah, at least it put me on the map:-)

[2010-12-7 10:30:35] Jon Huggett: good for you :-)

[2010-12-7 10:30:44] Jon Huggett: and you are putting Africa on the Wikimedia map

[2010-12-7 10:31:10] Abbas Mahmoud: yeah

[2010-12-7 10:31:13] Jon Huggett: India is getting a lot of attention now. perhaps we can learn from what works there what we can do in Africa

[2010-12-7 10:31:25] Abbas Mahmoud: yap

[2010-12-7 10:32:40] Jon Huggett: Is there anything else that the WMF could be doing now to build up Wikimedia in Africa?

[2010-12-7 10:33:52] Abbas Mahmoud: I'm also encouraging my team to get involved in the wikimedia universe. for instance, I am on the Wikimania 2012 jury. I mean, we can't just relax and wait for wikimedia to mollycoddle us into being active...

[2010-12-7 10:34:49] Jon Huggett: mollycoddling does not usually make people active ... :-)

[2010-12-7 10:34:55] Abbas Mahmoud: i don't think there's anything else

[2010-12-7 10:35:03] Jon Huggett: so will you be helping pick where Wikimania will be in 2012?

[2010-12-7 10:35:44] Abbas Mahmoud: yeah:-)

[2010-12-7 10:35:57] Jon Huggett: where would you like it to be?  ;-)

[2010-12-7 10:36:25] Abbas Mahmoud: probably Sydney or Sanford?

[2010-12-7 10:36:50] Jon Huggett: Sanford? Do you mean Stanford in the USA?

[2010-12-7 10:37:02] Abbas Mahmoud: There's also a bid for Barcelona and Istanbul

[2010-12-7 10:37:13] Abbas Mahmoud: Yeah, Stanford

[2010-12-7 10:37:25] Jon Huggett: Barcelona and Istanbul are both great ... very handy for Europe

[2010-12-7 10:37:33] Jon Huggett: Stanford is right by the WMF in SF

[2010-12-7 10:37:52] Jon Huggett: Sydney is glorious, but a long way away. I was there for two weeks in last month

[2010-12-7 10:38:05] Abbas Mahmoud: Spain is really difficult in terms of getting visa

[2010-12-7 10:38:24] Abbas Mahmoud: I'd love to go to Sydney...

[2010-12-7 10:38:28] Jon Huggett: Aha. Interesting.

[2010-12-7 10:38:36] Jon Huggett: Sydney is a wonderful city

[2010-12-7 10:39:04] Abbas Mahmoud: where's the best place you've been to in the world?

[2010-12-7 10:40:07] Jon Huggett: Malawi was magical. Sydney is beautiful. NY has an energy all of its own.

[2010-12-7 10:40:19] Abbas Mahmoud: OK

[2010-12-7 10:40:33] Jon Huggett: SF is a special place for me. I loved living in Johannesburg. And there is no place like home, which for me now is London

[2010-12-7 10:40:47] Jon Huggett: So I have given you six places, not one, which probably shows my indecision!

[2010-12-7 10:40:55] Abbas Mahmoud: I love the peace and rich atmosphere in Abu Dhabi

[2010-12-7 10:41:13] Abbas Mahmoud: haha

[2010-12-7 10:41:21] Jon Huggett: I've only been there once ... I had a stopover there on my way to India once

[2010-12-7 10:41:47] Abbas Mahmoud: it is lovely...not like the busy and hectic Dubai

[2010-12-7 10:42:08] Jon Huggett: I've not been to Dubai, but heard all about it

[2010-12-7 10:42:29] Abbas Mahmoud: Dubai's the Las Vegas of the Middle East

[2010-12-7 10:42:43] Jon Huggett: LOL. Have you been to Las Vegas?

[2010-12-7 10:42:58] Abbas Mahmoud: nop. that's what they say:-)

[2010-12-7 10:43:27] Jon Huggett: well, I have been to Las Vegas, and it is quite a trip. you have to go there once, but I am not sure I ever want to go back!

[2010-12-7 10:43:48] Abbas Mahmoud: my mum works at Boots. though i don't know which branch

[2010-12-7 10:43:55] Abbas Mahmoud: OK

[2010-12-7 10:44:06] Jon Huggett: do you ever come to London to visit?

[2010-12-7 10:44:45] Abbas Mahmoud: maybe, sometime soon. when she gets permanent residence. But getting a UK visa is another nightmare

[2010-12-7 10:45:16] Abbas Mahmoud: that's the price we have to pay for being born in a developing country.

[2010-12-7 10:45:36] Jon Huggett: It can be a pain. But did you get a Schengen visa when you came to Gdansk?

[2010-12-7 10:45:56] Abbas Mahmoud: Yeah, I got Schengen. I managed to visit Paris

[2010-12-7 10:46:29] Jon Huggett: Great. If you've had a Schengen visa once, it is usually easier to get it the second time. How did you find Paris?

[2010-12-7 10:46:40] Abbas Mahmoud: I wanted to explore the Schengen area more; but i only had a one-week visa

[2010-12-7 10:46:49] Abbas Mahmoud: Paris is awesome:-)

[2010-12-7 10:47:00] Jon Huggett: It is quite amazing

[2010-12-7 10:47:08] Abbas Mahmoud: The food...the artefacts...the sites

[2010-12-7 10:47:24] Jon Huggett: And for a man that loves literature ...

[2010-12-7 10:47:32] Abbas Mahmoud: hahaha

[2010-12-7 10:48:05] Jon Huggett: It's very easy from here now, too, with Eurostar. I went to visit a friend there in May

[2010-12-7 10:48:59] Abbas Mahmoud: my mum wanted to come to me in Paris; but her passport was with Home Office, so she was locked

[2010-12-7 10:49:41] Jon Huggett: that is a pity. I have an American friend living in London whose passport is now with the Home Office, so he is locked, too. the Home Office is a mess

[2010-12-7 10:50:12] Abbas Mahmoud: So are you paid by Wikimedia Foundation to do this movement stuff?

[2010-12-7 10:50:22] Jon Huggett: yes, as a contractor

[2010-12-7 10:50:28] Abbas Mahmoud: ok

[2010-12-7 10:51:02] Jon Huggett: I've worked with other NGOs, and used to be a partner in the same consulting firm that worked with Wikimedia to develop the strategy - Bridgespan

[2010-12-7 10:51:19] Abbas Mahmoud: yeah, i read your CV

[2010-12-7 10:52:01] Jon Huggett: I really enjoy the work, as I am a big fan and user of Wikipedia.

[2010-12-7 10:52:12] Jon Huggett: I even do editing every so often, too.  :-)

[2010-12-7 10:54:28] Jon Huggett: I think that we covered all of the issues that I wanted to cover. Are there any questions that you have left that you would like to ask?

[2010-12-7 10:54:49] Abbas Mahmoud: good to hear

[2010-12-7 10:55:11] Abbas Mahmoud: no, i think that's all

[2010-12-7 10:55:33] Jon Huggett: great. Abbas, many thanks. this has been a fascinating two hours

[2010-12-7 10:55:49] Abbas Mahmoud: yeah

[2010-12-7 10:55:53] Abbas Mahmoud: it was a pleasure

[2010-12-7 10:56:02] Jon Huggett: I wish you all the best in getting Wikimedia Kenya recognized and flourishing

[2010-12-7 10:56:13] Abbas Mahmoud: thank you so much

[2010-12-7 10:56:16] Jon Huggett: and I hope to meet you some time, perhaps at Wikimania in Haifa?

[2010-12-7 10:56:28] Abbas Mahmoud: Sure:-)

[2010-12-7 10:56:44] Jon Huggett: Looking forward to it

[2010-12-7 10:56:53] Jon Huggett: and thanks again

[2010-12-7 10:56:54] Abbas Mahmoud: Or the chapters meeting in Berlin?

[2010-12-7 10:57:04] Jon Huggett: I will be there, too. See you in Berlin and then in Haifa!

[2010-12-7 10:57:11] Abbas Mahmoud: Great

[2010-12-7 10:57:16] Jon Huggett: TTFN

[2010-12-7 10:57:24] Abbas Mahmoud: Bye

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