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Communication Projects Group/Meetings/2008-05-14/Log

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[21:33] <markie> DanielB jayansonvv Snow_White12 Platonides markie HOTR winter Snow_White11 millosh Martinp24 brianmc CraigSpurrier_aw Martinp23 Az1568_ Danny_B |Danny_B| seanw @ChanServ
[21:33] <markie> ==STARTING==
[21:33] * CraigSpurrier_aw is now known as CraigSpurrier
[21:33] <markie> jayansonvv: good from me :-p
[21:33] <jayansonvv> right then
[21:33] * brianmc_ (n=brianmc@20.73-136-217.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) has joined #wikimedia-cpg
[21:33] <jayansonvv> So hi all, I'll chair in kibble's absence, I know he'd like to be here
[21:33] <jayansonvv> I haven't got a lot to start with, so when brian's ready we'll go there
[21:34] <jayansonvv> except to say that the most significant development since we last met is the unveiling of the Wikimedia blog - which I hope everyone's seen
[21:34] <jayansonvv> And the success of which can be attributed to Cary, Alex, David Gerard and kibble and other folks here
[21:35] <jayansonvv> i bet i forgot some... we're somewhat regular in posts, aiming for about 5 a week, but i want to ratchet that up.  Some stuff has been, as expected, urgenty, others are just 'neat check it out'
[21:35] <jayansonvv> any thoughts or reflections on it so far?  from your esteemed positions?
[21:36] * jayansonvv taps the mic
[21:36] * NonvocalScream (n=scream@unaffiliated/scream) has joined #wikimedia-cpg
[21:37] <brianmc_> Steal stuff from the signpost before they publish?
[21:37] <jayansonvv> That's a good point actually
[21:37] <jayansonvv> I have no regular relationship with the signpost
[21:37] * ZvD (n=chatzill@d90-128-187-33.cust.tele2.nl) has joined #wikimedia-cpg
[21:37] <winter> I think the blog is great. I think it will keep everyone a lot more informed. I mean, at least we'll all have some knowledge in common with one another. I always feel like I don't know anything compared to everyone else
[21:37] <jayansonvv> does anyone here write for them?
[21:37] * brianmc (n=brianmc@wikinews/brianmc) Quit (Nick collision from services.�)
[21:38] <jayansonvv> good - and that really is the clearinghouse for 'what we're saying' - it's my job to make sure anything important mentioned on a list etc gets into the blog as well
[21:38] * brianmc_ is now known as brianmc
[21:38] <jayansonvv> so i'd like to think it removes that 'but i didn't know' scenario down the road
[21:39] * Snow_White11 (n=Erkan_Yi@krlh-4dbc05b1.pool.einsundeins.de) Quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)�)
[21:40] <winter> it will definitely help. the whole wikipedia/media/versity/etc/etc thing is so huge that its hard to keep tabs on what's going on. Like i didn't even know about the recent changes camp thing
[21:40] <jayansonvv> right right
[21:40] <jayansonvv> so essentially what you're seeing is what we're actually doing
[21:40] <winter> mhm
[21:40] <jayansonvv> what's on our minds, what we're aware of.  And it might be surprising to see what isn't covered, but it doesn't mean we don't know, might just mean we're not the people to necessarily speak about it
[21:41] <jayansonvv> but one of the things I'd love comproj to do is to have feelers out and send, on the list would be fine, ideas for posts or things you've seen
[21:41] <HOTR> jayansonvv: I'll point out that various WMF projects have their own islands of communication ... it should be our job to try and bridge these.
[21:41] <HOTR> That said, I think that one central spot is a step in the right direction.
[21:41] <jayansonvv> exactly, yes
[21:42] <jayansonvv> And we're getting there - it's amazing how quickly things move on every project
[21:42] <Danny_B> may i have few questions about the blog, actually about its organization?
[21:42] <jayansonvv> and i see signpost as a venue that tracks that
[21:42] <jayansonvv> sure - go for it
[21:43] <Danny_B> 1) how much is it open? it says it's an official blog and i wonder if anybody can register and publish that could cause issues. (if i missed anything, pardon me for that, please)
[21:44] <brianmc> It isn't that open
[21:44] <jayansonvv> No, it's not
[21:44] <jayansonvv> it's staff-only right now
[21:44] <jayansonvv> with the opportunity to share other posts from board members, other community figures
[21:45] <jayansonvv> but the intent is to narrow the output so people know what to expect - in short, officialish sort of responses
[21:45] <jayansonvv> in that sense, it's all wordpress, not mediawiki
[21:45] <HOTR> A better place for "ad hoc" stuff is an aggregator, like Planet Wikimedia
[21:45] <NonvocalScream> Which has been good I think.
[21:45] <jayansonvv> yes it has
[21:46] <jayansonvv> it's a great source for information, and I repost stuff I see on there as well
[21:46] <jayansonvv> And it's nice to see those bloggers comment on our blog
[21:46] <NonvocalScream> OVerall, I think its been successful.
[21:46] <ZvD> is the blog a kind of press communications, or do I find that anywhere else? (I am Ziko, btw)
[21:46] <jayansonvv> and again, part of what gets me excited about comproj is that this group can also spread the word, cross post, advise on posts - or post on your own blogs
[21:46] <NonvocalScream> Jay correct me... press communications, and other things the foundaiton or commumunity may find of interest.
[21:46] <jayansonvv> Hey Ziko, it's not specifically intended for the press, but I expect they're subscribing to the feed
[21:47] <jayansonvv> yes - it's a broad audience appeal.  That's blogging right, and when an organization like ours, with a broad mandate (work that applies to lots of people) then we should expect our blog to go there too
[21:47] <ZvD> but is there a different place where press communications are placed?
[21:47] <jayansonvv> yes, on the foundation wiki
[21:47] <jayansonvv> wikimediafoundation.org
[21:47] <NonvocalScream> or a p[ress release
[21:47] <ZvD> ok, thanks
[21:48] <jayansonvv> but the lines are getting blurred - which isn't a bad thing (overall in corporate communications)
[21:48] <NonvocalScream> Incidentally, the blog has a special spot where you can see recent blog posts on the home page.
[21:48] <ZvD> the blog is the first one i have put on the feed in my firefox
[21:48] <NonvocalScream> on the wmf home page
[21:48] <Danny_B> 2) ok say i (or whoever pretty known to community) would like to post something - what to do?
[21:48] <NonvocalScream> i think I have a link for that on meta...
[21:48] <jayansonvv> You could circulate an idea for a topic on the comproj list
[21:48] <NonvocalScream> http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Blog
[21:49] <jayansonvv> or use the meta link, yes
[21:49] <NonvocalScream> rather
[21:49] <NonvocalScream> http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Blog#Suggest_a_topic
[21:49] <jayansonvv> which the blog folks are keeping an eye on
[21:49] <brianmc> I may only be able to read and not post much. SWMBO just came in the door and wants to talk.
[21:49] <winter> the meta  would be faster right? the list takes a day b4 it's mailed out
[21:49] <NonvocalScream> meta would be faster
[21:49] <jayansonvv> or you can email me
[21:49] <ZvD> i am not sure how many wikipedians are reached by the blog. it may be a small group, especially among the non English natives
[21:49] <NonvocalScream> jay is fastest :)
[21:49] <jayansonvv> sure, it is probably small right now
[21:50] <jayansonvv> 'traction' takes a while, that's okay
[21:50] <winter> that's what "word of mouth" is for!
[21:50] <ZvD> then there is this wikizine?
[21:50] <jayansonvv> that we -have- it is what matters
[21:50] <jayansonvv> But consider floating topics for posts, or post something to your own blog and send it our way - if it's the right fit I'll probably make a note in our blog about it
[21:50] <jayansonvv> it should be fairly general appeal for a wide readership
[21:50] <NonvocalScream> I have detected some incoming links to the blog, that is to say, I can tell you that some other bloggers are blogging about our blog.
[21:51] <jayansonvv> its growing, it takes time
[21:51] <jayansonvv> Note that cbc.ca, the canadian broadcaster used quotes from Kul in a post he did a few weeks ago
[21:51] <jayansonvv> that's a big deal
[21:53] <jayansonvv> any other thoughts all?
[21:54] <jayansonvv> I'd like to move on to Brian's item
[21:54] <jayansonvv> then HOTR
[21:55] <ZvD> wikinews and office communication, i see
[21:55] <jayansonvv> you ready brian?
[21:56] <markie> brianmc: poke :-p
[21:56] <jayansonvv> yes, thanks
[21:58] <jayansonvv> I've got some IRL meetings in a few minutes - not much more time, so if Brian's not ready we're going to have to try for next time
[21:58] <ZvD> by the way, what's HOTR?
[21:58] <HOTR> Mine is quick :)
[21:58] <markie> maybe go to HOTR, then back to brianmc
[21:58] <jayansonvv> I'm seeing a lot of me text here, not much others
[21:58] * HOTR is that ;)
[21:58] <jayansonvv> okay, hit it hotr
[21:58] <ZvD> sorry
[21:59] <HOTR> So, I'm speaking on delegated invite at a conference upcoming ...
[21:59] <HOTR> for the WMF
[21:59] <jayansonvv> oh yes? what's that?
[22:00] <HOTR> The conference organizers want to use "Wikipedia" in my title for the conference, but I'm not an admin or anything there
[22:00] <HOTR> It's a Gov't social media thing
[22:00] <jayansonvv> okay, what would you like them to call you?
[22:00] <jayansonvv> oh, the one in Ottawa?
[22:00] <HOTR> bingo :)
[22:01] <jayansonvv> what title are they suggesting
[22:01] <HOTR> Well, I told them I was an "administrator at Wikiversity"... but they want buzz from Wikipedia to sell the talk.
[22:01] <jayansonvv> I see
[22:01] <brianmc> How many edits on WP? >50 makes you a WP contributor
[22:02] <ZvD> i would not complain about you if there is a "from Wikipedia" behind your name :-) but it is a familiar behavior from such organisers...
[22:02] <brianmc> or editor if you want a cooler word
[22:02] <jayansonvv> You could also propose "prominent Wikimedia volunteer editor"
[22:02] <HOTR> Administrator , Wikiversity & Project Collaborator for Wikipedia <-- I originally thought it was "co ordinator", so maybe that isn't so bad
[22:02] <winter> that sounds really good
[22:02] <jayansonvv> I'd go with Wikimedia projects
[22:03] <jayansonvv> They want Wikipedia in there, for sure, and prominently i imagine
[22:03] <jayansonvv> you can expect the majority of people's questions will be about that, and you will get a lot
[22:03] <HOTR> I suggested back "part of the Wikimedia Foundation projects of which Wikipedia is the best known" ... but said I'd ask at this meeting :)
[22:03] <jayansonvv> that's a long titile
[22:03] <jayansonvv> I would try 'Wikimedia community contributor'
[22:03] <HOTR> jayansonvv: nod
[22:03] <ZvD> as wp is the "flagship", it is not that uncommon to appear with this name, but I understand you don't like it because you want to promote Wikiversity?
[22:03] <jayansonvv> or Wikimedia project editor
[22:04] <HOTR> ZvD: Not that ... but I want to be truthful :)
[22:04] <jayansonvv> Just understand that it isn't just them wanting to push WP, they're reaching out to the audience volunteers
[22:04] <jayansonvv> rather, the audience
[22:04] <HOTR> I'm just a mere contrib on WP ... not an admin or anyone famous :)
[22:04] <jayansonvv> You know about a variety of Wikimedia projects - you are a prominent contributor to the projects, of which WP is the most popular
[22:04] <jayansonvv> You don't have to claim to be admin
[22:05] <jayansonvv> Tell them you're a prominent volunteer contributor and editor with the Wikimedia Projects
[22:05] <HOTR> jayansonvv: I get them wanting it in there ... I just want it to be ok with WMF, and feel good about what they are putting on the printed stuff.
[22:05] <ZvD> keep it easy, be a "Wikipedia collaborator"
[22:05] <brianmc> Good one
[22:05] <jayansonvv> Collaborator isn't very specific
[22:06] <brianmc> How many edits do you have on WP?
[22:06] <jayansonvv> Wikimedia is the second most recognized wiki word in most people's lexicon
[22:06] <HOTR> jayansonvv: If you are ok with that, from a WMF perspective, I'll tell them it's ok to use that.
[22:06] <jayansonvv> Actually, HOTR - you should give me a call offline before the event so we can discuss how those conferences go
[22:06] <jayansonvv> if you've never been to one before
[22:06] <jayansonvv> yes - that's fine
[22:06] <ZvD> jay, it does not has to be. but i am not sure what this english word means. maybe editor is better. i usually say that i am with wikipedia
[22:07] <brianmc> You could be described as a "Wikipedia contributor, but with a special interest is sister project X"
[22:07] <ZvD> what will you do at the conference, hotr?
[22:07] <HOTR> brianmc: Credited? I probably have less then 100. But I've done all kinds of typo edits annonymously before I signed up at WV
[22:07] <brianmc> *in
[22:07] <jayansonvv> Yeah, editor is better.  collaborator generally describes someone who can lend the resources of their effort etc
[22:07] <brianmc> I probably have ~200 max on en.WP
[22:07] <HOTR> jayansonvv: If you still have my e-mail, send me your number. I'm still prepping what I want to say, if you have any suggestions :)
[22:08] <jayansonvv> anyway, i'd like to talk about it
[22:08] <winter> (I have a question, after this)
[22:08] <jayansonvv> jwalsh@wikimedia.org
[22:08] <ZvD> as people mostly know only wp, it would not make much sence to call oneself wikimedia something, unless one really is an employee of wmf
[22:08] <jayansonvv> drop me a note with a good time to call
[22:08] <jayansonvv> Wikimedia projects is a perfectly fine way to describe the family of projects
[22:08] <brianmc> But...
[22:08] <HOTR> ZvD: I'll be talking about wikis, not too much about WP specifically ... it's about promotion of Wiki tech really.
[22:09] <jayansonvv> if you want to allign with one project, that's fine too. but for the purposes of this event they'll probably appreciate a broad knowledge/experience
[22:09] <brianmc> Sometimes you need to go, "meet my friend Wikipedia, he's an 800lb gorilla"
[22:09] <jayansonvv> yes - you've got it exactly
[22:09] <jayansonvv> it's the 'idea' of wiki that will be of interest, and you can lead discussion that way
[22:09] <ZvD> hotr, okay, than it's fine to refer to WP on your card but talk about other projects like wikiversity.
[22:09] <jayansonvv> okay - so winter, your question
[22:09] <ZvD> than - then
[22:09] <jayansonvv> then over to Brian
[22:10] <jayansonvv> cuz i have to wrap v soon
[22:10] <winter> okay, so suppose you want to inform ppl abt wiki, say at a meeting at a university
[22:10] <HOTR> Thanks all for the discussion :)
[22:10] <winter> is there a page where you can brief urself
[22:10] <winter> so you can be in a better situation to answer ppls questions?
[22:11] <HOTR> winter: I can do up some stuff when I've got my talk prepped. I might even youtube the talk.
[22:11] <jayansonvv> about wiki in general?
[22:11] * DanielB (n=Daniel@wikipedia/Daniel.Bryant) Quit ("Leaving"�)
[22:11] <winter> abt wikipedia and its various projects. Professors in my uni really seem to dislike it
[22:11] <jayansonvv> I would say a) familiarize yourself with the overall nature of the WMF projects
[22:11] <jayansonvv> at wikimediafoundation.org
[22:11] <winter> "unreliable, etc"
[22:11] <winter> ok
[22:11] <jayansonvv> then I would be well-briefed on how wiki tech works
[22:12] <winter> hotr: that would be really cool
[22:12] <winter> k
[22:12] <brianmc> Jay, I think he means a crib sheet for each project and a single page summary with answers to common questions like unreliable. A not unreasonable goal to provide
[22:12] <jayansonvv> then I would go to some of the recent studies (many fo which are referenced in the press section)
[22:12] <ZvD> winter, you remind me that i want to improve the "answers to criticisim" page at de.wp :-)
[22:12] <winter> winter is a she
[22:12] <winter> :P
[22:12] <jayansonvv> heh
[22:12] <jayansonvv> i'm not familiar with a one-sheet on each project
[22:12] <brianmc> my apologies
[22:12] <winter> one sheet proj..
[22:13] <winter> that would be something i could look into
[22:13] <HOTR> winter: I'm Gerald, aka [[v:User:Historybuff]]
[22:13] <jayansonvv> and I'm working on a better overall press experience
[22:13] <winter> doing
[22:13] <winter> i only have one class this summer....:D
[22:13] <winter> nice to meet you gerald
[22:13] <jayansonvv> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Press_room
[22:13] <HOTR> winter: Nice to meet you to :)
[22:13] <jayansonvv> The press kit is a great resource as well
[22:13] <jayansonvv> lots of general information
[22:13] <winter> okay
[22:14] <jayansonvv> in terms of reliability, cite the hewlett study
[22:14] <winter> k
[22:14] <jayansonvv> nature, and some of the media studies
[22:14] <winter> ok
[22:14] <brianmc> I think Jay knows I'm working on another one with a Medical professor
[22:14] <jayansonvv> and I would say an overall trend in editors focussing on quality edits rather than huge growth
[22:14] <ZvD>  do you know this rosenzweig article?
[22:15] <jayansonvv> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Press_releases/10M_articles
[22:15] <jayansonvv> Link to the HP study and the Stern study here
[22:15] <jayansonvv> those are both great starting pints
[22:15] <jayansonvv> points
[22:15] <winter> ok
[22:16] <brianmc> Can I throw in the 2k featured on WN?
[22:16] <ZvD> http://chnm.gmu.edu/resources/essays/d/42
[22:16] <winter> but about the crib sheet type thing that brian mentioned; would you want something like that created?
[22:16] <jayansonvv> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_reliability
[22:16] <jayansonvv> I'd hold off winter
[22:16] <winter> ok
[22:16] <jayansonvv> i'm still trying to determine what will work best to accomplish that
[22:16] <brianmc> http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/Wikinews_interviews_team_behind_the_2%2C000th_featured_Wikipedia_article
[22:17] <winter> i see
[22:17] <jayansonvv> but always feel free to write
[22:17] <winter> ok
[22:17] <brianmc> The link I posted is useful in demonstrating that not only can academics contribute, but that they can do so in a noticeable way.
[22:18] <ZvD> the last weeks i was busy with a study about small wikipedias, with some results about their (failing) communications
[22:18] <jayansonvv> okay - so last order of biz
[22:18] <jayansonvv> brian?
[22:19] <HOTR> brianmc: poke :)
[22:20] <winter> probably browsing on another tab! :P j/k
[22:20] <brianmc> Wikinews professionalisation, and what ComProj can do with it.
[22:21] <jayansonvv> ah, right on
[22:21] <brianmc> In the past week I've had to delete two articles... I am not Mr Popular for that.
[22:21] <brianmc> We've now (today) got a third one up on [[WN:DR]]
[22:21] <jayansonvv> mm hmm
[22:22] <jayansonvv> is that delete requests?
[22:22] <brianmc> yup
[22:22] <jayansonvv> what's the actual liknk?
[22:22] <ZvD> you talk about this one? http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/Wikinews:Don%27t_disrupt_Wikinews_to_illustrate_a_point
[22:22] <brianmc> No, moment
[22:23] <brianmc> http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/WN:DR
[22:23] <ZvD> thanks
[22:23] <ZvD> so, what's comproj deal about it?
[22:24] <brianmc> I think it is "growing pains"... Wikinews getting to a situation where the project is in 'adolescence'
[22:24] <brianmc> ComProj can help in a few ways...
[22:24] <brianmc> Keeping aware of coverage of WMF stuff on Wikinews
[22:25] <brianmc> Participating in discussions of potential deletion of WMF stuff
[22:25] <brianmc> *Knowing that Wikinews coverage might not be flattering
[22:25] <ZvD> well shoud'nt that be a discussion among wikinews users?
[22:26] <jayansonvv> are you perhaps thinking there might be some new capacity in comproj, brian?
[22:27] <brianmc> I'm not sure, as much as anything I think comproj needs to keep an eye on Wikinews and know at any minute it could (like now) end up on the front of slashdot.
[22:27] <jayansonvv> mm hmm
[22:27] <brianmc> Its a two-way street. People here may have stuff for Wikinews to cover.
[22:27] <jayansonvv> yup, true
[22:28] <jayansonvv> considering some of these topics deal with Foundation topics I have to recuse myself from too much commen
[22:28] <jayansonvv> though I do have hopes that WN can take in more capacity and journalistic experience - it's not quite the same as encyclopedic work
[22:29] <brianmc> It is difficult
[22:29] <jayansonvv> i fully recognize that, and considering there are few folks willing to talk about it as you do,  it can't be easier
[22:29] <brianmc> The project would likely welcome data on people from here doing promotional stuff
[22:30] * baa (n=cbass@wikimedia/Bastique) has joined #wikimedia-cpg
[22:30] <jayansonvv> at least in the more open and fluid communication systems
[22:30] <baa> hey
[22:30] <baa> sorry, I had a meeting
[22:30] <brianmc> I hope he wasn't painted blue
[22:31] <winter> jay, what do you mean, "promotional stuff"?
[22:31] <winter> could you clarify?
[22:31] <winter> pls
[22:31] <jayansonvv> that was brian acksh
[22:31] <winter> sorry
[22:31] <winter> brain
[22:31] <brianmc> Not jay that said that, me
[22:31] <winter> sry
[22:31] <jayansonvv> heh
[22:32] <brianmc> Promotional stuff. Let's say you're asked to sit on a panel at a university discussion... That's perhaps the most obvious case
[22:32] <winter> mhm
[22:33] <jayansonvv> yes - goings-on
[22:33] <brianmc> Wikinews is both global and local, we could announce the event and if there is a close enough reporter cover it
[22:33] <ZvD> (i'd like to discuss a communications problem i recently met when making a flyer, if possible)
[22:36] <jayansonvv> Does anyone else have contributions to the wikinews discussion?
[22:36] <baa> I haven't heard most of it
[22:36] <jayansonvv> I agree there's a need - brian, maybe a ping to Kibble and the comproj list after the fact
[22:37] * HOTR nods at jay's suggestion ... post to the list
[22:37] <brianmc> I will be about tomorrow, but now is late for me
[22:37] <jayansonvv> sure sure
[22:37] <brianmc> There are several issues
[22:37] <brianmc> One is more content, and sharing things helps with that
[22:38] <brianmc> Two is knowing what content Wikinews has for demonstrating WMF isn't a one-trick pony
[22:39] <brianmc> Three is coverage of WMF issues, and this has been a #$^*ing headache recently, I had Mike Godwin on the phone after 11:30pm about that.
[22:39] <jayansonvv> yeah, famil
[22:40] <brianmc> Mike is charming, so he gets away with it. :P
[22:40] <jayansonvv> I'm not the chair, but i get the sense comproj might be better suited to provide some good labour an story angles via the list
[22:41] <brianmc> We have no chair today. Anarchy in Cyberspace!
[22:41] <jayansonvv> well, i stepped in for a spell
[22:41] <jayansonvv> I have to go though, I'm afraid I've got to get ready for another meeting
[22:42] <jayansonvv> ZvD send your question on-list, that okay?
[22:42] <brianmc> lucky you :P
[22:42] <ZvD> i try to if the technique lets me
[22:43] <brianmc> Are we sort-of closing off here? Or do we want to ramble on about the Wikinews stuff?
[22:43] <jayansonvv> i have to ditch, but you guys are free to discuss
[22:43] <jayansonvv> I'm just going to disappear :)
[22:43] <HOTR> I think we can call the formal meeting to an end
[22:43] <HOTR> and then ramble on :)
[22:43] <brianmc> Good call
[22:44] <ZvD> bye folks, nice to meet you
[22:44] <baa> brianmc: ramble on to me in private too if you like
[22:44] <HOTR> Another other really important stuff?
[22:44] <winter> bye ZvD
[22:44] <jayansonvv> ciao yall
[22:44] * jayansonvv (n=jayanson@dsl017-048-227.sfo4.dsl.speakeasy.net) Quit
[22:44] <winter> bye
[22:44] * HOTR bangs the gavel