User talk:Mdennis (WMF)

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Maggie, Congratulations on your new role. May I take the opportunity to repeat to you some suggestions I made to your predecessor -- I frankly admit that they did not find favour with him. Perhaps you may be more interested. This says it all, I think. I hope you find them useful. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 22:25, 11 February 2016 (UTC)

Hi, Rogol Domedonfors. Thanks for your good wishes. Just to be sure it's clear, my role is interim. :) I realize you didn't imply otherwise, but it's something I like to be explicit. :D I'm here while we get somebody permanent in place, whereupon I plan to head back into my Support & Safety neighborhood.
I think those are good ideas. One of them Luis already put in the planning process - we are hoping at some point soon to create a hub/portal/title-yet-determined where information is available and where staff are available to talk. We are fairly far along in the process of hiring an additional community advocate and hope that after the hire is made and they're brought up to speed that we'll be able to staff this. Even if that takes longer than anticipated to get that hire up to speed, I hope we'll have more staffing capacity anyway once strategy/annual planning settles down. --Maggie Dennis (WMF) (talk) 22:39, 11 February 2016 (UTC)
Just for the record, Maggie, while you may lack a background in grants, I think that your good attitude is a wonderful fit for the Senior Director role. Especially while there are so many questions about the governance of the organization, your steady and positive personality is a wonderful asset, and it's generous of you to take on an additional hat at this time. --Pine 05:47, 12 February 2016 (UTC)
Maggie, thanks for your positive response. I quite understand your position, and that you would not wish to make major strategic decisions that would inhibit the freedom of action of your successor. Nonetheless, I would urge you to do all you can to make progress in building a better engagement with the community. To be blunt, your words "we are hoping at some point" are not as definite as I would have wished: I was hoping for something more like "we will definitely do this by [date]". If we have to wait for your successor to be appointed before the "hope" can turn into "plan", let alone "do", then I am afraid that it will be too late. The gap between community and foundation is widening and the longer that is allowed to continue the harder it will be to bridge. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 07:30, 12 February 2016 (UTC)
Thank you, @Pine:. :) Rogol Domedonfors , one of the things that seems to concern you in the link you left above is lack of follow-through. That's a concern I share. I would like to be more definite, but I really can't at this stage. I wouldn't make a commitment I don't feel pretty sure I can keep, and any exact date would be speculation on my part.
For more context, last quarter Support and Safety put together a plan for a hub that we could deploy, experimentally, to see if it would serve the communication need, but deployment was put on hold as we were assigned to support the strategy and annual plan consultations while also maintaining other commitments (our core work - including trust & safety functions - and our ongoing harassment consultation). While we have been working towards a hire to increase our capacity, the concept of the hub has been expanded a bit, with other teams and departments who have been considering hubs of their own looking towards how to make it even more useful as a single portal of information. My hope is that we will have resources to put the hub on our goals for quarter four (April-June), but that's always going to depend on what other work needs to be done, the prioritization of that work (which is not all "me" dependent), and the people we have to do it. What I think is very important is that we not release the hub if we cannot staff it. Right now, we could not staff it. Having a poorly staffed hub would not improve anything. :/
The 2016 Strategy/Community consultation lists as a potential focus for next year (beginning in July) increased communication and transparency, including from the WMF. Right now, that consultation is still open, with people weighing in on what they think we should be prioritizing. There is also an open question about community health and free fields for suggesting your ideas. It would be great if you added your thoughts there. Our strategy consultant will be reporting out trends and priorities suggested by that consultation, which closes Monday. --Maggie Dennis (WMF) (talk) 11:35, 12 February 2016 (UTC)
I have been asking for improved communication and transparency and for clear and effective dialogue for so long that I am sorry that it is still only a "potential focus". It seems odd that the WMF is unable to resource it when it has nearly 300 staff and nearly a hundred million dollars. I suppose it is because the WMF mindset is that communication with the community is an overhead: that is is entirely a cost with no benefit. I think that's quite wrong and that effective engagement would more than pay for itself in added value to the projects. I do urge you to try it! Thank you for offering me the opportunity to ask for it again in yet another forum but I am sure you will understand why I find that suggestion a little underwhelming. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 18:03, 12 February 2016 (UTC)
Hi, Rogol Domedonfors. I really understand that perception. :) However, there's a couple of points that need to be considered. First, the staff we have are not generalists who can be repurposed to any area with equal facility. The admin team is probably not best positioned to manage the hub, for instance. :) The community engagement department - which would seem best positioned to do this work - is slightly over 40, I think. Those ~40 people support grants and product releases and help triage bugs and support the international education programs and support affiliate organizations and process DMCA takedowns and support the OTRS admins and the stewards and the Ombudsman Commission. Among other workflows. These people are communicating constantly with community - every day. Other departments, too, are frequently communicating with community - on MediaWiki and Phabricator, for instance. So, the important second point is that what we're talking about here is not "community conversation" versus "no community conversation." Community conversations happen all the time, as so they should. It's about optimizing the ways and places that those conversations happen in a sustainable, sensible way and opening it up transparently for easier access. --Maggie Dennis (WMF) (talk) 18:27, 12 February 2016 (UTC)
The WMF surely controls its own recruitment and the balance of skills on its staff. There has been plenty of time to recruit the people needed for this work if it had been decided to do so: although I see that in the short term it's not so easy. As I see it, those members of the community looking for a more effective mode of dialogue with WMF, especially about planning,have the opportunity to respond to a survey which might result in a strategy consultant making a recommendation which might be decided on, which might result in a plan which might be resourced, which might result in action. Meanwhile the gap between community and WMF widens, WMF embarks on software projects that the community neither wants nor can use,and the expertise of volunteers who are trying to cooperate goes to waste. I don't see how I, for one, can help you to fix that. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 23:08, 12 February 2016 (UTC)

To an extent, definitely. Like many organizations (and especially nonprofits), WMF hiring is pre-planned by its annual budget, which is tied to its annual plan, and submitted to the Board of Trustees towards the end of each fiscal year. (Sorry for being inexact; I'm traveling and have limited tech.) The priorities of hiring are determined by the WMF and the Board, with an emphasis on meeting annual strategic goals. --Maggie Dennis (WMF) (talk) 01:09, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

A member of staff pointed me to phab:T124022 which seems relevant. Let us hope that moves us all in the right direction. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 05:20, 1 March 2016 (UTC)
I thought I would ask whether you see any progress on the issues we discussed here back in February? Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 17:02, 29 May 2016 (UTC)
Maggie, I see that the Phabricator task I was pointed to back in February has now been abandoned. I think there may be further action in this direction underway but really, nearly six months later, this is a very disappointing situation to be in. If indeed this initiative has been restarted then I suppose that's better than being abandoned completely, but this is not a picture of an organisation that is giving priority to its relationship with the community of volunteers. At best this initiative has been under-resourced for years, at worst this is deliberate procrastination. I ask to to give this question your consideration and make a statement to the community with explicit commitment to goals and time-scales. The position that the WMF cannot afford to get this right is no longer sustainable. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 17:17, 5 August 2016 (UTC)
@Rogol Domedonfors: hi there, I'm the owner of the previous task. It was closed as it was dissolved and rescoped - when initially set up, the goals were unclear, as was the methodology with which it would work with Product teams. You can find the relevant goal here: T138339, a part of which is the Technical Collaboration Guideline but also includes facilitating the adoption and use of the guidelines within the WMF and communities. The TCG is high priority - it's in the annual plan - and will provide advice and recommendations for communicating and collaborating with communities. It's not the end-all solution, but a part of work in adjusting product development to the environment of working with our communities and community members as well, often, and practically as possible. Hope this helps clarify that the WMF has more than not abandoned the goal, we've rescoped it to make it more useful and relevant and raised its priority up to Annual Plan level. Keegan (WMF) (talk) 18:15, 5 August 2016 (UTC)
Thank you, that is indeed the "further action" I referred to. But there is a dismal pattern here: initiatives for involving the community start up, community members spend time and energy on them, then they seem to run into the ground, and another similar initiative starts up. I refer to such previous projects as Community Liaisons/Process ideas and Community Liaisons/Product Surveys, which occupied the community's attention in mid-14 to mid-15. As far as I can see neither of these had any lasting legacy. Then we had phab:T124022. Now we have phab:T138339. Can you be explicit about what went wrong with the previous iterations and why this time you're going to get it right? Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 18:28, 5 August 2016 (UTC)
Excellent question. Keep in mind I'm going to be speaking in a broad generality - the issues, like everything in life, is far more complicated. But in a nutshell: the first two links that you point to were efforts from the CL team, on our own initiative, to integrate community ideas and feedback into product development. I think the efforts were laudable, but they missed something in their development: collaboration with the actual product teams in developing the pages/systems. We were working in a vacuum and as such the reality of product development at the time did not match the plans that we had for community engagement. For the Phabricator task that brought this up, that kind of had the opposite problem: the draft mw:Wikimedia Product Development Process was written with minimal input from our team in regards to community engagement, and so the plans would look good on paper but won't actually work.
To get it right this time, product teams and the CLs (now part of the Technical Collaboration teams) are working on developing a better way together, both internally and externally. We're developing a sense of shared responsibility to work with communities and community members, and attempting to break down the silos that were causing miscommunications, which lead to mistakes, which lead to problems. I'm not going to pretend it's an easy thing, or something that will and can be done with any speed. Getting large groups of humans on the same page is a hard task, following it up with proactive results, even harder. I'm optimistic, though - the pains of previous years have not been enjoyed by anyone, nor are they wished to be repeated. Keegan (WMF) (talk) 18:51, 5 August 2016 (UTC)
That is frank, thank you. In the same spirit, I'll say that the current process does not yet seem to have reached very far into the community: you may want to cast your net a lot wider -- here at Meta, for example -- that is, assuming you want community input, which I think you should. At this point, I'll only say: plan for success. In other words, once we collectively come up with the processes and structures we all want, be sure that you can get them implemented and resourced. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 19:13, 5 August 2016 (UTC)

Inviting WMF staff to WikiConference USA in San Diego[edit]

Hi Maggie, if WikiConference USA happens in San Diego this year, I hope that you will encourage as many WMF staff as possible to attend, especially the San Francisco office staff who don't usually go to conferences or Wikimania. What do you think about the concept of having a charter bus from San Francisco to San Diego, for both WMF staff and community members? (Also pinging DrMel who is the conference coordinator, since she may have ideas as well.) --Pine 19:15, 25 May 2016 (UTC)

Hi, User:Pine. :) I am aware! I'm planning to attend myself, even though it's moving to the opposite coast. Knock wood. I know word is spreading among staff, but there's always a bit of a balance there. Sometimes community members aren't happy when staff vastly overwhelm volunteers at events. We try to be conscious of that when scheduling participation at any event, and also to make sure that everyone we pay to send anywhere is a good use of donor dollars. :) Don't know about the charter bus idea - I can ask about it. --Maggie Dennis (WMF) (talk) 18:19, 26 May 2016 (UTC)
Hi again Maggie. I was thinking more about staff attendance rather than staff presentations. I agree that WMF staff presentations should be kept to a modest percentage of the total presentations offered. With regards to participation as conference attendees, I think that this would be a wonderful opportunity for back-office staff like HR, finance, legal, admin, and tech infrastructure to mingle with a substantial number of content contributors, researchers, GLAM+STEM activists, educators, and community organizers. I think that the staff would enjoy the experience and it would give them a broad vision of Wikimedia, far broader than they might get from reviewing trademark contracts, purchase orders, or hiring reqs. I also am hopeful that the experience at the conference would inspire increased pride in their work and better understanding of how their workflows affect the big picture. (: So please consider encouraging staff to attend and mingle with the community, especially back-office staff. Thanks, --Pine 23:30, 26 May 2016 (UTC)

Thanks Pine! This Con is going to be unique - San Diego wants it very very much, and is such a beautiful place to host it in. The more WMF staffers that can join us, the better - a great chance to get away on a group outing. Amtrak has a great route down here from SF if you want to travel together. Talk soon? DrMel (talk) 04:39, 27 May 2016 (UTC)

Code of Conduct[edit]

Maggie, when you have a moment please review the progress that has been made at mw:Code of Conduct/Draft. I invite you to consider whether that progress is satisfactory, or whether, as has been suggested at mw:Talk:Code of Conduct/Draft#Nine months and mw:Talk:Code of Conduct/Draft#What happens next?, it is now time for your staff to move this project on to its next stage. In any case, this is another area in which I do not see any way to help you. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 19:07, 30 May 2016 (UTC)

We discussed this at another page in June. Are you still satisfied with the progress being made on this code? Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 17:25, 5 August 2016 (UTC)
I'm told it's going well and is probably not far from completion. --Maggie Dennis (WMF) (talk) 12:11, 6 August 2016 (UTC)
I do not know who has told you that, but if you had asked me I would have given you a different answer. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 15:35, 6 August 2016 (UTC)
Let me just follow up on that. I note you didn't answer my question as to whether you regarded progress as satisfactory. Let me give you some reasons to believe that it is not. It is now over a year since this project was started, and it is not yet finished. That is in itself quite deplorable. The ultimate object of this and indeed any other such code must surely be to reduce the level of misconduct in Wikimedia technical spaces and make those spaces more civilised, more pleasant, more fulfilling and more productive to work in. You know better than most of us what some people are suffering from in those spaces, and unnecessary delay in promulgating a code of conduct is unacceptable for that reason alone. The management of the drafting of this code, and indeed almost all the drafting work, has been in the hands of WMF staff. This may be inevitable in that paid staff probably have more time to devote to this task than volunteers, but speaking as a volunteer attempting to contribute, I felt excluded by actions of staff. One, not quite trivial example: in September I raised a legal question which I felt need attention from WMF Legal. Quite by chance I discsovered some months later that a member of staff had taken on themselves to tell Legal (through some other channel that I was not privy to) that the question did not need to be answered. The conduct of the discussion has been managed, even micro-managed, by members of staff who have taken it on themselves to declare whether and when consensus has been reached. The rather few non-staff participants left have on several occasions posted comments to the effect that they do not recognise this as a community consensus. I agree with that position.
Well, let us suppose that you regard it as satisfactory that this code should be drafted by your staff and promulgated on the authority of the WMF. This is a tenable position, just not what was initially envisaged or hoped for. Let me now address whether this project is being effectively delivered on those terms. There has explicitly never been a timeline or schedule for delivery, even though I have asked for one. There is no published stakeholder mapping or communications plan. There is no sense of pace or any of the other positive outcomes one might expect from such a closely managed process. This is quite unsatisfactory, and the result is that after more than a year there is no code and no plausible date for the delivery of a code. This is not what I would recognise as success.
Having said which, let me suggest some positive actions that you may wish to consider. There needs to be an actionable plan for delivery to the community and generation of consensus; there needs to be a set of metrics for the success or otherwise of this code that you can use to determine whether or not it is succeeding once it is in place; and there needs to be a timetable. I am sure you agree with me that this project is capable of being effectively delivered and being of benefit to the community as a whole. I ask you to take steps to make that happen. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 11:09, 7 August 2016 (UTC)
Am I satisfied? Based on my understanding, yes. Am I delighted? No.
I would have been delighted to have a quick and effective solution, with universal agreement, that would ensure that people could feel safe working in technical spaces with the knowledge that, if they were mistreated, they would have willing assistance from others. That said, this would never have been my expectation. Through my years as a volunteer and staff I've watched (or lightly participated) in conversations trying to figure out how to solve this problem in another space, English Wikipedia (my Wikimedia birthplace as it were :)). There, the Personal Attack Noticeboard of 2005 lasted less than two years before it was closed due to the contentiousness of the board and its perceived ineffectiveness. In 2012, the Wikiquette assistance program went down for similar reasons, with a consensus to find another alternative. (Transparency: I opposed. I thought we needed to fix it.) So far as I'm aware, no alternative was ever created, and in 2014 en:Wikipedia:Requests for comment/User conduct was also shut down for inefficiency. What this all comes down to, I guess, is that I'm sadly aware how difficult it is to create effective processes for dealing with misconduct and to reach agreement on those, and as delighted as I would have been, I'd have never expected it to be swift or easy. Behavioral policy and enforcement is arguably the most complex and challenging topic our communities have to navigate. I'd rather see a slowly hammered out code that will work and will last, and I hope that the time and effort that have gone into this one will be so rewarded.
My experience as a Wikimedian - overall, not specifically as a WMF employee - is actually that volunteers can drive projects quite ably. Volunteers’ energy and ability to achieve is pretty spectacular; it's the base on which this whole thing was created, after all. :) Because of that, even given the complexity of responding to behavioral issues, I don't think it's inevitable that staff lead drafting the code, but I can see many reasons why staff may wind up doing so. In relation to this, staff are a large component of the technical spaces and so are deeply impacted by behavior there themselves. And it’s particularly likely that staff may lead if there's not any particular group of volunteers who are able under the circumstances to hammer down on solving a difficult situation. I know from Support and Safety's exploration of harassment last year that some in community are afraid of becoming too visible in this area, because they've become targets after doing so. (For that matter, so have some staff.) I am sorry to hear that you feel the process hasn't been as collaborative as you'd like - I don't know what question it is you felt legal needed to answer or who decided on what basis that it may not have been necessary to consult them. If you still have unresolved questions there, I'm happy to ask somebody to look into it, but I can't promise that legal will be able to specifically answer the question (they can only give legal advice to the WMF).
I imagine you know that this plan was not born in my team or even in my department, but that rather it came out of those staff and volunteers who worked in the technical spaces themselves. My awareness of it has accordingly risen as it has grown and as my own role has evolved. What I've been told by both staff and volunteers who've discussed this with me is that progress on the Code of Conduct work has been slow, but steady, with consensus reached on each section as it is complete. (I don't imagine consensus will mean unanimity, and I do hear that you don't necessary agree that consensus has been reached at points.) I am told that it is approaching the final stages, which would seem quite satisfactory to me. I'm not sure that I agree with you that a timetable is essential when it comes to collaboratively agreeing on an approach to a problem that has been demonstrably so difficult to handle. Such conversations shouldn't go on forever, of course. But building the right approach may be time-consuming, and - if it is the right approach - will be worth it in the end.
In terms of metrics to evaluate its effectiveness, we are building review of community health in our Community Engagement Insights surveys, which I hope will deliver regular data on people's sense of safety in the various spaces of our projects and also in the effectiveness of techniques and policies to handle issues. This should allow us to assess what our effectiveness is and to adjust as we go. --Maggie Dennis (WMF) (talk) 14:57, 9 August 2016 (UTC)
If you are satisfied, then all I can do is wait for the process currently underway to complete at some point in the indefinite future. I am increasingly disappointed with how hard it is to help the WMF. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 16:53, 9 August 2016 (UTC)
  • Maggie, I just want to say thanks for that summary. My mind is too full of other issues to keep on top of the TCOC as well, but I am hopeful that we will make some progress on the broad issue of civility in the community, particularly in regards to how it affects contributor diversity and attrition. I'm not sure that a COC is the tool that I would choose to invest so much time in; I think that some of the themes and projects being developed in the anti-harassment campaign may be more fruitful. But I am glad that people are viewing the problem of incivility with enough seriousness that they are trying to make it better.
  • Rogol Domedonfors I appreciate your asking questions about the progress of this matter. I've communicated occasionally with Maggie for years, and I'm confident in her ability to do as well as anyone could reasonably be expected to do in her position. On a personal level, in some ways I don't have much choice but to trust WMF people to do the right thing because I'm too stretched -- and the organization is now simply too big -- for me to try to keep track of numerous important initiatives while also trying to make progress on my own projects both on and off of Wikimedia. While I have some vivid memories of WMF doing things in ways that were harmful, I'd like to suggest to you that you choose your priorities carefully. Of the issues that I see as the biggest risks and those with the highest potential benefit to the community, I might suggest that this is one which none of us should lose sleep over. If you'd like to help WMF, I'm sure Maggie could offer some good suggestions about areas in which your input could be particularly helpful. I like that you are trying to do the right thing. (: --Pine 07:38, 11 August 2016 (UTC)
Thank you for that. Unfortunately the overlap seems to be narrowing between those areas where I believe the WMF needs help; where the WMF is ready, willing and able to accept help; and what I personally can do. Incidentally, it is not a question of wanting "to help WMF", it is a question of wanting to support the mission. The WMF and the volunteer community are or ought to be working together to that end. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 21:26, 11 August 2016 (UTC)

This "hub" thing[edit]


Please ping me when responding. I was wondering if any progress has been made on the "hub"-idea, and when we can expect to see it in action. TBH I think it is very very important. The Quixotic Potato (talk) 22:48, 10 August 2016 (UTC)

Hello, User:The Quixotic Potato. Progress is being made, yes. This year, the “central Wikimedia resource center” (as it’s currently titled) is part of the annual plan, as a series of quarterly goals being lead by the Learning & Evaluation team. It is in early testing phase, and I hope will be rolled out before too much longer. I expect to be hearing the results of the testing by the end of this quarter. :) --Maggie Dennis (WMF) (talk) 14:55, 16 August 2016 (UTC)
The objective appears to be "Develop a Wikimedia Resource Center that allows community leaders to design, deliver and evaluate core programs more efficiently – through semi-automated tools and infrastructure". Please tell us who those community leaders are, and how they were involved in the planning stage. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 21:23, 16 August 2016 (UTC)
It would also be helpful to have someone explain the difference, if any, between this new Wikimedia Resource Center and the Communications/Resource center. The latter seems to be a revival of the (presumed defunct) Communication Projects Group, and overlaps somewhat with the Communications committee. Please consider whether there ought to be a single locus that explains the remit and status of all these activities, groups, centres, programmes, and how to interact with them. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 09:27, 21 August 2016 (UTC)
Hi Rogol Domedonfors, I'm responding to your questions below:
1. Who these community leaders are and how they were involved in the planning stage. We refer to program leaders here - those Wikimedians who develop and manage programs, like editathons, photo contests, writing workshops, educations programs, etc. We consulted with many of them in different one on one conversations through November last year. After that, we had an online conversation about our Program Capacity and Learning strategy, which was drafted based on these ideas. You can see the plan on Program Capacity and Learning page, and the conversation on the the talk page. Although that team has split into the Learning and Evaluation and Programs teams, we are still working on the same shared strategy and projects. Consultations were also conducted at various pre-conference Learning Days amongst programs groups by L&E (and, formerly, PC&L). These consultations, however, are not over. As we launch and develop the Wikimedia Resource Center, we will continue to gather feedback as Wikimedians begin to interact with it in order to also improve its usability.
2. Differences with other resource centers and comment on committees' roles. The Wikimedia Resource Center is an umbrella that includes the Communications Resource Center. We aim to connect from the WRC all resources available for Wikimedians. One of them is the Communications Resource Center. There are other resources, as well, for example: Program Toolkits for Wikimedia movement leaders, Technical Collaborations Guidelines for Mediawiki volunteers, Support and Safety public question posting system, just to name a few. As you state, the Communications Committee is expected to oversee, contribute and promote to the Communications Resource Center, and this will continue to be the case. As a a group of people with expert skills and the capacity to mentor others on diverse communication topics, we will continue to connect people to them and we hope to do this through the Wikimedia Resource Center, as well. So there will be two types of content linked from the Wikimedia Resource Center: (1) guides like toolkits and FAQs, and (2) people that can give direct support. We will also explain in which ways Wikimedians can contribute.
I hope this gives more clarity about the project. Please let me know if you have any other questions or comments. María (WMF) (talk) 17:01, 22 August 2016 (UTC)
Thank you for that information. To my mind, "community leaders" is different from "program leaders" and in particular I would have hoped to see a wider consultation than direct personal approaches to those already benefitting from the current system. You might have taken the opportunity to capture the views of those who do not participate in these programmes already, and find out why not, for example. Your comments on the Wikimedia Resource Center are most interesting. The multiplicity of resources available underline, I think, the suggestion that I made above to Maggie, which I reiterate for clarity here, that she "consider whether there ought to be a single locus that explains the remit and status of all these activities, groups, centres, programmes, and how to interact with them". I do not believe the Resource Centre is intended to be that locus. I look forward to hearing Maggie's response to my suggestion at some point. Rogol Domedonfors (talk) 17:34, 22 August 2016 (UTC)

Concerns about Foundation grant[edit]

I left some concerns regarding a grant that was approved on its talk page. Would you be willing to respond?--The Devil's Advocate (talk) 23:12, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

Hello, The Devil's Advocate . I have full confidence in our grants team and in the organizers of that conference to make sound decisions about attendees and events. --Maggie Dennis (WMF) (talk) 14:56, 16 August 2016 (UTC)