WikiConference India 2020: Initial conversations/IRC Log (20 Oct 2019)

From Meta, a Wikimedia project coordination wiki
Jump to navigation Jump to search
Note: This page may be wearisome to read due to lack of formatting. You may proceed with this, or here is a PDF version which is more easy to follow.
Though the IRC was supposed to be logged from 18:00, unfortunately we were unable to retrieve the chat before this message. During that time, Pavan Santhosh gave the attendees a general update about the conversations till now, support from individuals and communities, and state of the discussions.


START OF THE CONVERSATION


@KCVelaga

18:21:10

Thanks Pavan, before I talk about the next steps involved, if anyone has any questions or comments, let us discuss them

→ Suswetha has joined

Tan61

18:21:51

Squiggletrotter, had a question

Saroj

18:22:02

Is Nepali Wikipedia a part of Indic Wikimedia?

Squiggletrotter

18:22:13

Which is about the next steps itself.

@KCVelaga

18:22:31

Yes, Nepali Wikimedians are welcome to participate in the conference. Yes, they are a part of Indic Wikimedia

Saroj

18:22:45

Thanks KCVelaga

@KCVelaga

18:23:03

Squiggletrotter We will first answer other questions, and then go to next steps.

@KCVelaga

18:24:13

OK, we can answer questions along-way. So the next immediate step is to do the Community Engagement Survey

→ Harika has joined

@KCVelaga

18:25:08

It includes what would communities/Wikimedians like to learn at the conference, their expectations and stuff like that. The survey results will be the base for the grant proposal

← Harika has left (Remote host closed the connection)

→ Harika has joined

Pavanaja

18:25:46

Before starting the initial discussions, I suggest to go through the lessons learnt from WCI 2016 Chandigarh

@KCVelaga

18:26:09

We will mostly start this in the first week of November and keep it open until the third week. The survey will be done online, and also if there any major event, we can do the consultation there as well, with the help of organisers.

@KCVelaga

18:27:32

Pavanaja Thank you, yes. We should definitely. We went through the report, and also we have had several conversations with WCI2016 organisers to make sure the mistakes are not repeated.

← Harika has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Pavanaja

18:28:02

I don't think the report has documented many things, especially the lapses

→ Harika has joined

@KCVelaga

18:28:34

Ravi from his previous experience has also been giving heads-up on certain important things on the talk page.

Anant

18:28:39

Please discuss it here what mistake they made in 2016

← Suswetha has left (Remote host closed the connection)

← gnoeee has left (Remote host closed the connection)

@KCVelaga

18:30:20

Pavanaja Yes, we also spoke in-person to learn from them. Like for example, one major lapse was having accommodation and conference venue at different places. For a big conference, this can problematic. We will make sure that they are at one place this time

→ Gramesam has joined

→ Jagseer has joined

@KCVelaga

18:31:59

According the WMF grants current timeline, we should propose the grant by 2 February 2020

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:Conference

We will work on the proposal during December, and put it up for community review in January, and keep changing it according the suggestions before finalising

Jayprakash

18:32:42

KCVelaga How many participates will come? Any round number

@KCVelaga

18:33:28

Participants may be around 500, scholarships will be 100-150, exact number will decided according the budget

Pavanaja

18:35:03

Accommodation was big issue during WCI 2016. Till 10pm, we were not knowing what is going on. Finally we were taken to some hotel. Ladies were accommodated in ladies hostel. That was clearly a bit of partyiality as the hostel accommodation given to ladies was not at all on par with the hotel accommodation given to men

I hope such mistakes wont happen

Suyash_Dwivedi

18:36:03

Yes accommodation was an issue

→ Satpal has joined

@KCVelaga

18:36:22

Yes definitely we will take care of this issue. Thanks for bringing it up. Accommodation and venue will be at the same place, and everyone will be given at the same place (mostly a hotel)

← Shypoetess has left (#wci)

Squiggletrotter

18:36:39

To clarify, it was a mishap from behalf of the partner institution. The learning from this is that accomodations in University hostels and guesthouses can be tricky so hotel can be arranged for participants instead.

→ Shypoetess has joined

Saroj

18:36:44

What is the maximum number of scholarships for a community?

@KCVelaga

18:37:32

That is variable, there is no fixed number for now. It also depends on the community size, a large community may have more, and so

← Gramesam has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Rajasekhar1961

18:38:43

Accommodation near the venue will solve the problem of communication and for a useful participation of the participants.

→ Gramesam has joined

Gramesam

18:39:09

Hello

Rajasekhar1961

18:39:49

In Hyderabad, we can get accommodation and venue, depending on the budget allocation.

→ Ash16 has joined

@KCVelaga

18:40:03

Rajasekhar1961 Yes, it will mostly be the same place. Because these days, in many places, including Hyderabad, if rooms and food are booked with hotel, banquet are given at free of charge. We will such facilities

We will use such facilities**

Suyash_Dwivedi

18:40:51

KCVelaga good option

→ AshLin has joined

AshLin

18:41:01

Hi

@KCVelaga

18:42:04

Hello sir, we have been mainly talking about the accommodation which had been problematic during WCI2016.

So for 2020, we will be having the accommodation and the venue at the same place.

Satdeep

18:43:06

That was one big learning from WCI 2016. Don't organize such a big conference at an educational institution. They are not as professional and there is a lot of unnecessary hierarchy. Hotels is the best option, it's less stressful for organizers (who are mostly volunteers).

← Gramesam has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Squiggletrotter

18:43:21

Agreed

← Jagseer has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Squiggletrotter

18:43:48

To save expense a lot of unprecedented issues come up which may or may not be solved on the spot.

I guess this can be kept in mind while devising the conference budget itself

← Ash16 has left (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

→ Gramesam has joined

Squiggletrotter

18:45:19

It is better to have bigger budget than to have issues in the conference later

← Sukeerti has left (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

@KCVelaga

18:45:39

Yes, we will take think of contingencies while framing the budget. Also it will be open for community members to comment (for 2 weeks) before finalising

Pavanaja

18:45:41

If Nepal is included, what about Bhutan, Bangladesh, Maldives, Sri lanka, Pakistan (SAARC countries)?

Pranayraj

18:45:52

thank you Satdeep

← AshLin has left (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

Gramesam

18:46:17

Hyderabad is a place where you have accommodation

With excellent facilities

@KCVelaga

18:47:28

Not all SAARC countries are included, but we will have a few scholarships for Nepal, Bangladesh, and Sri Lanka. We are not sure of Bhutan yet.

Pavanaja

18:48:36

If Nepal, etc., included, which is really very good, then make sure about visa formalities

How will you justify excluding Pakistan?

← Tan61 has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Pavanaja

18:49:28

Then you will have to rename it as SAARC Conference not as Wikiconference India

Gramesam

18:49:45

How will you justify including Pakistan?

Pavanaja

18:49:59

Pakistan is part of SAARC

@KCVelaga

18:50:06

Maldives will not fit in our budget. We are not able to support Pakistan because of the several legal complications involved. Though it is unfortunate, we currently don't have the resources to deal the legalities.

Gramesam

18:50:31

Very correct

Pavanaja

18:50:41

I agree about hassles of including Pakistan. But people may question

Pavan-Santhosh

18:50:55

Pavanaja Main focus for these conference is Indian Wikimedia communities, and clearly not SAARC. Every regional specific conference will have some spill overs, as we work on languages and not regions.

@KCVelaga

18:51:19

This is India conference only, we are having Nepal, Bangladesh and Sri Lanka, because their visa policies are a bit liberal, for example, Nepalis don't need visa for India

Gramesam

18:51:21

Absolutely right

Pavanaja

18:51:33

Pavan-Santhosh Then also you can't explain fully

Pavan-Santhosh

18:51:51

We did!

Thank you

Pavanaja

18:51:54

I am not at all supporting including Pakistan, but how will you explain that?

mahir256

18:52:42

So are you expecting reduced turnout from the Bengali- and Urdu-speaking communities?

← Gopala has left (Remote host closed the connection)

mahir256

18:52:54

(despite the large Wikimedia communities of their speakers present in India)

@KCVelaga

18:53:39

It purely because we don't the organisational capacity to include Pakistan. MHA has imposed serious restrictions on this. I can't speak for CIS, but in an informal conversation one of them mentioned, it is tough for them to support Pakistan for now.

Pavanaja

18:54:19

I fully agree on the legal hurdles

→ Gopala has joined

@KCVelaga

18:54:56

mahir256 Bangladesh is included. Urdu yes, it might only be limited to people within the country. This is unfortunate, but that is the reality.

Gramesam

18:55:10

We ourselves have good number of Bengali wiki medians in India

→ gnoeee has joined

Rajasekhar1961

18:57:08

What is restricting the Bengali wikipedians from participating in this Conference.

→ Jagseer has joined

@KCVelaga

18:58:44

There no restriction on Bengali

Pavan-Santhosh

18:58:48

To make things clear: Bengali Wikipedians from both West Bengal and Bangladesh are very part of this conference. Unfortunately we can not afford to make whole Urdu community part of this due to legal and administrative issues.

@KCVelaga

19:00:06

The issue with other countries is variable and can't say anything for sure, we will try out best

@KCVelaga

19:01:33

any other questions/concerns? About the further steps, the conference in general etc.

mahir256

19:01:36

Then I'm hoping for their sake that thorough arrangements will be made for the most stable and comprehensive remote experience possible

← Suyash_Dwivedi has left (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

← Pranayraj has left (Quit: Ping timeout (120 seconds))

← Jagseer has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Pavanaja

19:02:44

No of days?

Any pre-conf tutorial or learning days?

Rajasekhar1961

19:03:19

It is Not the Language per se; but their domiciliary status is the problem; whether they are living in India or other countries.

→ Saroj53 has joined

@KCVelaga

19:03:46

mahir256 Yes, remote participation will be made highly accessible, as you mentioned, stable and comprehensive. We will try to live relay all the tracks, if not at least 60%, but everything will be recorded and uploaded to WCommons later

Rajasekhar1961 Yes, exactly, thank you.

← Saroj has left (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

← Satpal has left (Remote host closed the connection)

@KCVelaga

19:04:50

Pavanaja The main conference will be 3-days for sure. 2016 didn't have any such, but yes, preconference for at least 1 day is a good idea

We will include this in the survey and see people's interest. Learning days will be very useful.

→ Pranayraj has joined

← Gramesam has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Rajasekhar1961

19:06:21

Preconference learning platform for some relatively newer wikimedians is a good idea. think about it.

IMahesh3847

19:06:37

There're a few non-Indian Wikimedians who also work primarily on Indian related articles. Are they included in?

mahir256

19:06:44

Would people not from a participating country be able to hold sessions/talks?

→ Gramesam has joined

← Saroj53 has left (Remote host closed the connection)

@KCVelaga

19:08:13

IMahesh3847 Scholarships will be available to people from India majorly, then also Nepal, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh. We can't support other countries, even if they are working on India-related topics from the conference budget

→ Rajeeb has joined

→ Atudu has joined

@KCVelaga

19:08:26

But they can participate on their own or remotely

IMahesh3847

19:08:35

@ok, thank you

← gnoeee has left (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

← Asrija has left (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

@KCVelaga

19:08:58

mahir256 yes we will keep the program open for remote sessions by people from non-participating countries

Rajeeb

19:09:17

Hello everyone, apology of being late

@KCVelaga

19:09:27

Hi Rajeeb, no problem thank you.

→ Tan61 has joined

→ Saroj has joined

← Tan61 has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Rajeeb

19:10:45

Thanks Krishna

→ Tan61 has joined

IMahesh3847

19:11:44

I think, it would great if a dedicated number of scholarships are reserved only for new Wikimedians. For ex: 2-3 for Wikimedians older than an year/language

→ Asrija has joined

← Harika has left (Remote host closed the connection)

→ Manav has joined

@KCVelaga

19:12:36

IMahesh3847 Yes definitely, we will have some diversity guidelines. We will include this there

Scholarships will be according to those guidelines

→ Harika has joined

Rajeeb

19:14:42

May be it has been discussed, still I like to point out one thing, how can we reward foreign participants for e.g. participants from Bangladesh who are integral part of Bangla Community

@KCVelaga

19:15:44

Yes, we discussed this. Apart from India, we will have Nepal, Bangladesh, and Sri Lanka. We won't be able to support Pakistan due to legal complications involved

← IMahesh3847 has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Rajeeb

19:17:03

ok that's sounds good.

@KCVelaga

19:18:22

any other questions?

← Tan61 has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Satdeep

19:18:36

For context, we did send invitation letters to certain Wikimedians from Pakistan during WCI 2016 but all of them got their visas rejected.

@KCVelaga

19:19:36

OK

→ mallikarjunasj has joined

Pavanaja

19:19:53

Are there Indic Wikipedians in Maldives? Just curious to know

@KCVelaga

19:20:11

But was there any common reason stated for rejection Satdeep?

Satdeep

19:20:27

Pavanaja I am pretty sure, No.

Squiggletrotter

19:21:10

How can we get involved? Will there be invitation for volunteers for support roles for the conference?

mahir256

19:21:15

At this point is there any specific overarching theme for the conference, or certain projects which will be promoted more than others?

@KCVelaga

19:23:13

No nothing yet, that will be based on the survey results.

Manav

19:24:31

KCVelaga I received a call from embassy. The reason for rejection was that we didnt inform the embassy or the govt about this conference or took permission

Satdeep

19:24:43

KCVelaga: The main reason I think was that we didn't have clearance from the Ministry of External Affairs to invite international delegates (We were just lucky with delegates from Bangladesh and Sri Lanka attending on tourist visa). Things are stricter now, I have heard.

→ Ananth has joined

Manav

19:25:06

+1 Satdeep

@KCVelaga

19:25:12

Squiggletrotter Only the Local Organising Team will be from Andhra and Telangana, the rest of the teams such as scholarships, program, communications etc. will include people from all communities.

Manav

19:25:19

They even do random checks to make sure verything is in compliance

Rajeeb

19:26:13

very true

@KCVelaga

19:26:28

Once the grant funding decision is out, there will be a call for organisers. Interested people can join then.

Manav Yes, we will keep that in mind.

mahir256

19:27:28

What sorts of procedures are needed from External Affairs for conference clearance? Starting every workshop/session with the national anthem? 😆

→ techfiz has joined

→ Suyash_Dwivedi has joined

← Gramesam has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Ananth

19:29:21

its problem if people from different countries take part in a conference with a travel visa. So to the conference visa we need to contact External Affairs.

@KCVelaga

19:29:24

mahir256 😆

← Pavanaja has left (Remote host closed the connection)

@KCVelaga

19:30:40

https://conference.mha.gov.in/FAQ.aspx there is this page which has the info, we will work with organisational partners for invitation letters and stuff

mahir256

19:31:12

And yet folks from Bangladesh and Sri Lanka got away with using tourist visas last time. What of them this time around?

Chaduvari

19:31:24

Okay guya, gotta go. Adios.

→ sravanth93 has joined

← mallikarjunasj has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Satdeep

19:31:51

mahir256 Things are stricter now.

Suyash_Dwivedi

19:32:14

Hmmm...

← Chaduvari has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Gopala

19:32:15

Better to apply for permission?

Satdeep

19:32:29

Yes. We need to figure out the process.

Manav

19:32:36

it will be easier for CIS to get the permission

← Asrija has left (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

Manav

19:33:00

they will anyways be the fiscal sponsors

Ananth

19:33:02

to avoid any problems during or after the conference it will be good if we take the permission from the Govt. Now a days its very strict than before.

← sravanth has left (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

mahir256

19:33:47

What about those from countries eligible for the eVisa (such as the US)?

Pavan-Santhosh

19:33:52

Manav I believe WCI team will figure these things out and even that will help remaining conferences happening

Ananth

19:34:03

last year when CIS had applied for this, it took around 10-11 months to complete the procedure.

Shypoetess

19:34:23

KCVelaga Satdeep Manav Were there any other issues apart from accommodation, venue and visa?

Manav

19:34:31

Well we are planning one before WCI

← Anant has left (#wci)

Pavan-Santhosh

19:34:47

Yes Manav, true.

@KCVelaga

19:34:49

mahir256 I didn't get you. We can't fund them obviously

Manav

19:34:52

Shypoetess.. Finance

hehehe

audit

Suyash_Dwivedi

19:35:02

Hehe

Ananth

19:35:14

mahir256 this applies for all the people taking part in the conference. it can be any country.

@KCVelaga

19:35:21

Please limit the conversations to WCI only, not other conferences

Manav

19:35:35

who is talking about other conferences?

Im not

Satdeep

19:35:40

Manav That was just humongous but not something that went wrong.

Shypoetess

19:35:41

Manav I've heard about that but the procedural issues were resolved I guess

Manav

19:35:43

Finances of WCI

@KCVelaga

19:36:02

mahir256 please elaborate your question

Satdeep

19:36:06

Okay. Coming back to the point.

mahir256

19:36:27

KCVelaga I think Ananth covered it

@KCVelaga

19:36:44

OK

Satdeep

19:36:46

Ananth Can you figure out the entire process and let everyone know in a week or two? Do we need to finalize the list of participants from other countries, in advance and any other things?

Manav

19:37:08

Satdeep: Not getting the funds in time is fdifferent from handling finances

→ Asrija has joined

Rajeeb

19:38:11

I agree with Satdeep we need to chalk out the list of participants from other countries

Ananth

19:38:34

as per my understandings we should provide the Name of applicant but will get to know the entire procedure soon and update you all.

Shypoetess

19:38:41

+1 That can make the process of visa clearance easier

@KCVelaga

19:39:29

Anyway, we will start an official conversation with soon formally, and figure these details

→ Mallikarjuna has joined

Suyash_Dwivedi

19:40:04

List of possible pariciping countries

← Navya has left (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

@KCVelaga

19:40:43

There is scholarships available to India obviously, and Nepal, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh in addition.

Ananth

19:41:49

Are we inviting people from Pakistan?

@KCVelaga

19:41:55

No

Not from the official conference budget

We still need to figure those details

Shypoetess

19:43:19

I'll have to sign off now. Good Night Everyone

Pavan-Santhosh

19:43:49

Hi @Ananth This was discussed and clarified with much details, already. Please go through the discussion once we publish it.

← Shypoetess has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Ananth

19:44:32

Sorry for missing the earlier part. Thanks for the clarification.

← techfiz has left (Remote host closed the connection)

mahir256

19:45:51

Would you sponsor visas for people located outside South Asia, even if you do not provide other financial support?

→ Viswa has joined

Manav

19:46:11

Ideally it shouldnt

@KCVelaga

19:46:15

So we have around 15 min left before closing the discussion. If anyone has missed any points, we will publish the log on meta, and share. If there are any other questions apart from the ones already discussed, please do ask them.

Satdeep

19:46:18

I will take leave now. I am really glad that Telugu Wikimedians has taken lead on this. I once again promise full support in my volunteer capacity.

@KCVelaga

19:46:27

@mahi

mahir256 do you mean like invitation letters ?

Pranayraj

19:47:15

Satdeep

mahir256

19:47:15

I guess, assuming that those people could not attend the conference on an eVisa

Rajeeb

19:47:24

count me in any volunteer work anytime, anywhere

Rajasekhar1961

19:47:29

Thank you very much Satdeep

← Satdeep has left (#wci)

Pranayraj

19:47:55

Rajeeb

← Viswa has left (Remote host closed the connection)

@KCVelaga

19:48:28

mahir256 Yes, we will provide such support.

← Atudu has left (Remote host closed the connection)

@KCVelaga

19:49:39

We will have more clarity regarding participants from outside India in the coming couple of months. As of now, these details are very much uncertain.

Manav

19:49:49

What!! KCVelaga...But what's the point of keeping scholarships open for international delegates?

@KCVelaga

19:51:05

Manav Not scholarships, but we will provide support for visas, like invitation letter

← Suyash_Dwivedi has left (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)

Manav

19:51:38

okkay

@KCVelaga

19:54:20

Roughly five more minutes left

Rajeeb

19:54:36

Are we planning a cultural tour for participants before the conference day or may be on the last day of the conference to see our rich cultural heritage.

Gopala

19:54:49

Are you planning to take sponsorships other than WMF?

@KCVelaga

19:55:15

Rajeeb probably yes, Program will be based on the Community Engagement Survey that is going to be conducted next month

Manav

19:55:15

Rajeeb.. lets be very careful about this... the cultural crawl at wikimania this year wasnt appreciated coz of many reasons

Pranayraj

19:55:18

Sure Rajeeb

Manav

19:55:24

people objected to the idea of having it

Rajeeb

19:55:57

oh really Manav, what went wrong?

Manav

19:56:09

post conference is good for people who r extending their stay or last day

@KCVelaga

19:56:23

Gopala yes, we will definitely try for non-WMF sponsors. Education institutions from Andhra and Telagana, especially Engineering college, would be happy to do such sponsorships

Manav

19:56:28

Yes, actually this time it was planned parallel to the learning days

→ Akbarali has joined

Gopala

19:56:59

KCVelaga Thank you

Akbarali

19:57:09

finished?

@KCVelaga

19:57:13

Rajeeb Manav This will be based on the survey results, whether to have such tours or not

Rajeeb

19:57:19

or even can we organise cultural events either in the campus or nearby auditorium

@KCVelaga

19:57:37

Akbarali almost

Rajeeb

19:57:50

oh ok Manav

← Asrija has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Rajeeb

19:58:09

I

Akbarali

19:58:13

I could come only now . UAE time 6.30

@KCVelaga

19:58:49

Akbarali no problem thanks for coming we will publish the discussion on Meta-Wiki soon, and share with the community.

Rajeeb

19:58:59

I really enjoyed the cultural event in SAARC Educational Conference

Akbarali

19:59:04

KCVelaga thank you

Manav

19:59:19

bye everyone

Jayprakash

19:59:22

Goodnight everyone

← mahir256 has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Rajeeb

19:59:33

Bye Bye thanks everyone

Manav

19:59:34

count me in for any support...would love to help.

@KCVelaga

19:59:44

Two minutes left .... final remarks, thank you everyone for participating, it was a very fruitful discussion.

Pavan-Santhosh

19:59:44

Thanks everyone for joining and also for support offered.

Manav

19:59:52

Thank you Telugu friends for proposing WCI

→ Suyash_Dwivedi has joined

Mallikarjuna

20:00:06

Thanks

← Manav has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Rajeeb

20:00:07

Looking to be counted for any volunteering!!

@KCVelaga

20:00:08

If anyone is interested to receive regular updates, please add yourself here, https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Global_message_delivery/Targets/WCI2020, if you are not already there

Rajeeb

20:00:31

Thanks KCVelaga

@KCVelaga

20:00:37

This is the link https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Global_message_delivery/Targets/WCI2020

The above one is faulty

Suyash_Dwivedi

20:00:55

👍

Gopala

20:00:57

Hey I need to go now. I believe this meeting gonna end soon. Will be happy for any support in my capacity. Thanks everyone Good night.

@KCVelaga

20:01:24

thanks again, the discussion ends now.

← sravanth93 has left (#wci)

← Gopala has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Rajeeb

20:02:04

Good night everyone!!

← Rajeeb has left (#wci)

← Pranayraj has left (Remote host closed the connection)

← Mallikarjuna has left (Remote host closed the connection)

← Ananth has left (Remote host closed the connection)

Saroj

20:02:25

Good Night! Best wishes to Telugu Wikimedians

Rajasekhar1961

20:02:55

Good night; Thank you very much for all the Indic wikimedians for supporting the Telugu community.

← Rajasekhar1961 has left (Remote host closed the connection)



END OF THE CONVERSATION