Community Wishlist Survey 2023/Wiktionary/Different alphabetical sortings according to languages

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Different alphabetical sortings according to languages

• Problem: For the time being, there is only one alphabetical order for a given writing system (used in Indexes, Categories, etc), even though alphabetical order can vary depending on a language. For example, in German o and ö are treated as one letter, but in Turkish first comes o and only then ö. Therefore the order: offensiv – öffentlich – offiziell – Offizier – öffnen – Öffnung – oft – öfter – oh is absolutely fine for German, but in Turkish: ocak – oda – ödemek – odun – ödünç – oğlan – öğle – öğrenci – oğul is completely wrong (it should be: ocak – oda – odun – oğlan – oğul – … – ödemek – ödünç – öğle – öğrenci), yet it is the only order that is found in all automatically prepared alphabetical lists. This way all Wiktionaries make fools of themselves, showing that they do not even know the correct alphabetical order. This problem affects each and every Wiktionary.
• Proposed solution: There should be a way to sort lists alphabetically in different ways, depending on the language in question.
• Who would benefit: All users of Wiktionaries, both editors and – first of all – their readers.
• More comments: As I was informed by Peter Bowman, the problem has already been raised several times (most recently in 2019, and again in 2020), but never solved. There seem to be a ready solution already available (see Phabricator tickets below).
• Phabricator tickets: phab:T30397#1039468
• Proposer: Maitake (talk) 17:32, 27 January 2023 (UTC)

Discussion

• I very much support this, even just using the Latin alphabet for this example comparing German and Turkish barely scratches the surface. What about letters that exist in one language using the same script but not another? For example, þ being used in Icelandic but not French, or Ғ being used in Kazakh but not Russian. This is definitely something that ought to be fixed, as it's quite the oversight. SalomeCzapiewski (talk) 19:44, 28 January 2023 (UTC)
• A dictionary with entries displayed in the right alphabetical order? Seems reasonable 😉 Noé (talk) 07:57, 30 January 2023 (UTC)
• "There should be a way to sort lists alphabetically in different ways".. what lists, where ? I'm assuming lists generated by the MW software, but it's not specified here. —TheDJ (talk • contribs) 15:28, 5 February 2023 (UTC)
  • @TheDJ: The categories. Drogosław^TALK 15:33, 5 February 2023 (UTC)

Voting

•  Support Sankoff64 (talk) 17:22, 24 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support —2dk (talk) 19:27, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Drogosław^TALK 19:40, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Xbypass (talk) 20:03, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Мурад 97 (talk) 20:11, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Geofferic (talk) 20:16, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Peter Bowman (talk) 21:02, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support - excarnateSojourner (talk | contrib) 21:18, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support – tsca (talk) 22:17, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Richiski (talk) 22:21, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Pamputt (talk) 22:24, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Ioaxxere (talk) 23:58, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Jesielt (talk) 00:14, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support KaMan (talk) 02:34, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Joseph (talk) 13:35, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Ignacio Rodríguez (talk) 14:24, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support OwenBlacker (Talk) 15:18, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Mike bzh (talk) 15:41, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Cantons-de-l'Est (talk) 15:45, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Romainbehar (talk) 16:42, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support CitationsFreak (talk) 17:56, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support We need this… Otourly (talk) 17:59, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Ahkei (talk) 01:51, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
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•  Support Thomas Kinz (talk) 01:16, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support 神秘美人 (talk) 08:10, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Sounds basics but it is a serious issue in every edition of Wiktionary. Noé (talk) 09:03, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support ✒ Bennylin 10:45, 13 February 2023 (UTC)
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•  Support Vulcan❯❯❯Sphere! 16:32, 18 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support This should be added as it can be useful for different languages (Chinese/ Korean/Japanese) Thingofme (talk) 16:33, 18 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support Limotecariu (talk) 17:34, 18 February 2023 (UTC)
•  Support · · · Peter (Southwood) ^(talk): 17:45, 18 February 2023 (UTC)
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•  Support Maire ♣ 16:56, 24 February 2023 (UTC)