Proposals for closing projects/Closure of Old English Wikibooks 2

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The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.

This is a proposal for closing and/or deleting a wiki hosted by the Wikimedia Foundation. It is subject to the current closing projects policy.


The proposal is accepted and the proposed actions should be taken.

  • A Language Committee member provided the following comment:
    Langcom proposed to the Board to close the wiki with the following rationale: Wikibooks is for textbooks and manuals, but nobody is writing them in this extinct language nor is there much reason why someone would want to /read/ them.
    Wikisource is the appropriate project for texts in this language. In fact, some pages on the wiki do belong to Wikisource, and should be moved there. This is also consistent with Langcom's previous decisions that ancient languages should above all have Wikisource, but the other projects are not all suitable for them. English Wikisource also hosts Old English texts, so there is not even a need for a separate ang-wikisource.
    Content should be moved to Incubator, or, where appropriate, to Wikisoure. --MF-W 10:54, 24 November 2014 (UTC) – After there were no objections, bug T78667 was created. --MF-W 14:44, 16 December 2014 (UTC)Reply[reply]

(See also the previous request, closed for procedural reasons.) There are several reasons why Old English Wikibooks should be closed:

  1. The project has no community. No meaningful activity within the last 30 days. No actual discussions have ever taken place at the community portal (b:ang:Samweorc:Gemǽnscipe Ingang).
  2. The project hosts no useful content. Much of the content consists of actual source-texts in Old English, which of course belong on Wikisource. Other content includes very stubby beginnings of textbooks (not worth keeping), attempts at translating texts into Old English (b:ang:Dracula:Capitol 1), and pages which do not appear to be educational textbooks (such as b:ang:Béowulf - In Níwre Wrítunge - I cannot read Old English, but this page does not look like it falls within Wikibooks' scope - and b:ang:Gotisc spræc, which looks like an encyclopedia article). There is some apparently useful content in the pseudo-namespace "Wicigeonga Cildrum Englisc:", but this alone is not enough to justify the continued existence of this wiki. Since it seems to be linguistic material relating to Old English, it should be moved to Old English Wiktionary as an Appendix.
  3. It is not useful to have Wikibooks projects in dead languages. To take an example, I cannot see why one would ever want to learn how to use b:ang:Mac OS by reading a manual in Old English, let alone why you would want to write such a thing.
  4. Visitors are very likely to confuse it with Wikisource, a much more useful project for an ancient language. (Keep in mind that Wikibooks is for textbooks and manuals, not for ancient source-texts.) They may unwittingly contribute their ancient texts to Wikibooks, where they will never be found, instead of Old Wikisource (angwikisource is locked). Or they may try to look for ancient texts on Wikibooks, in vain.

Plenty of reasons to close this project. This, that and the other (talk) 07:03, 21 January 2013 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Would you reconsider if I were to revive the project? πr2 (tc) 02:40, 30 January 2013 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Even if all the opposers agreed to reconsider if you were to revive the project, I doubt it could be done in a timely matter, especially by a one man army. That being said, I agree with the nominator. MJ94 (talk) 02:52, 30 January 2013 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I'm learning Old English and I could probably ask several people who could help save this project to contribute if it comes to that. In fact, I was just writing Old English text when I found this proposal. πr2 (tc) 03:00, 30 January 2013 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I have a question. Are the language learning textbooks on Wikibooks supposed to be listed in the domain for the language being learnt or the language in which it is being taught? Thank you. Božidar 18:27, 13 March 2013 (UTC)Reply[reply]
All content on Old English Wikibooks should be written in Old English. If you want to learn Old English by reading a textbook in Spanish (say), you will go to Spanish Wikibooks. This, that and the other (talk) 07:12, 14 March 2013 (UTC)Reply[reply]
So Wikibooks is primarily for living languages, I presume. With perhaps the exception of perhaps Latin, which as it happens is the official language of the Holy See? Thank you. Božidar 07:22, 17 March 2013 (UTC)Reply[reply]
To reply to JJohnson1701, it is nice that you are willing to contribute content to this wiki. However, I would be interested to hear your opinion on my third point in the nomination. This, that and the other (talk) 07:12, 14 March 2013 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Point number three is a good one. However, I should like to wait to cast my vote until I have heard back from the opposition to this proposal, hearing what they have to say. Thank you. Božidar 19:26, 16 March 2013 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Is that 'purpose' your invention? Afaics, it's neither the foundation's vision nor its mission. --Pi zero (talk) 20:05, 23 June 2013 (UTC)Reply[reply]
That sentence incorporating the Wikimedia vision expresses my opinion about the utility of dead languages for that purpose, and was not intended as statement of what that purpose is. I am not quite sure how you read it as a definition of something to which the previous sentence refers, but I apologize for any lack of clarity arising from the allusion.

As I understand it, and as indicated with emphasis in the proposer's points #4, the purpose of Wikibooks is to provide original educational textbooks. The intent of my comment was to indicate what I think is a useful medium for that purpose and, by implication, what I think is not. As such, it is an endorsement of the proposer's points #2 and, particularly, #3, and is an amplification on the underlying reason why I endorse them. ~ Ningauble (talk) 16:48, 24 June 2013 (UTC)Reply[reply]

  • Esperanto is not a fictional language. It is a very real language that has several hundred native speakers and maybe 100,000 second-language speakers. It is an artificial language, but not one fictional in the sense that it was created as part of a work of fiction.--Prosfilaes (talk) 05:50, 9 October 2014 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • There seems to be overwhelming support for this proposal, and it has remained open for more than a year already. I believe that's plenty of time for supporters and dissenters to have their say about closing angwikibooks. Would a LangCom member please take a look at this request? TeleComNasSprVen (talk) 06:19, 9 March 2014 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  • Support I don't see a single content addition in the last month. Hitting the Random Page button several times, it looks like all the content that is there was added by User:James, whose last edit on that Wiki was in January of 2009. I haven't seen a single edit in article space that needs knowledge of Old English besides that of this one editor, 5 years gone. Even were Old English a language with living native speakers, it would be hard to justify the admin time to keep it open.--Prosfilaes (talk) 05:50, 9 October 2014 (UTC)Reply[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.