Grants talk:PEG/WM RS/Wikimedia CEE Conference 2012

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Ok, so for the reading of it, it looks like is a IberoConf-like type of conference (please correct me if I'm wrong). I do love the idea of a regional group for CEE, and I congratulate all the organizers for doing it.

Talking about the grant, I dont see any red flags in the grant, but I have some questions:

1. Since the conference is due in 1 month, do you already have a number of how many chapters/working groups are planned to attend? I saw the doc with the 25 names, but I am not sure if those are official or just an list of "who might come".
2. I know is something with cost added to it, but there are any plans to create videos of the conference?
3. Is an english-speaking conference, or - like Iberocoop - do you have some 2-4 languages to work with? (It might be a stupid question, but I really don't know how similar the languages in that part of Europe are)

Thanks in advance! Béria Lima msg 05:21, 12 September 2012 (UTC)

Hi Beria. Yes, this is like your IberoConf and thanks for supporting the idea. (1) We expect attenders form ~20 territories. In the best situation we will have from 25. Registration started a few day ago and so far we have people from 10 territories who told they would attend. We expect in the next days we will have more. (2) Oh, I forgot to put that in the grant :) We have one camera and probably we will have some videos. (3) The main topic will be in English and about workshops will depend on the participants.--MikyM (talk) 05:45, 12 September 2012 (UTC)

Let me also add, that I appreciate the way WMRS has been presenting their grant proposals, it's much easier to browse and most of all well thought of and very detailed. Regionalizing is a good way of gathering Wikimedians who don't get the chance and opportunity to attend Wikimania but at the same time keep them in the loop and feel of the movement. -- Namayan (talk) 05:26, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
Thank you very much. I try every time to make a proposal understandable. Details and notes/comments can help in it. Thanks too for supporting the idea!--MikyM (talk) 05:45, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
Thanks for the fast answer, MikyM. And let me second Namayan here: Is a very well written grant, reading it was a pleasure. Every time I had a question about something in the budget, there was an explanation about it right after. Let's hope other people start to use this model, would facilitate our work in so many ways :D Béria Lima msg 06:02, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
Thanks! Yes I hope too people in the future will improve ways of writing and presenting their grants. That will save our time. If someone need help let me ask :) --MikyM (talk) 12:15, 12 September 2012 (UTC)

GAC member status for this application[edit]

No objection[edit]

  1. Béria Lima msg 05:20, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
  2. -- Namayan (talk) 05:26, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
  3. Abbasjnr (talk) 07:40, 12 September 2012 (UTC)

Objection[edit]

Waiting for more details[edit]

--Itzike (talk) 18:59, 12 September 2012 (UTC)

Abstaining[edit]

  • As I am about to decide about support for conference from Wikimedia Polska and probably attend the conference, I abstain from discussion Polimerek (talk) 11:20, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
  • --MikyM (talk) 12:07, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
  • I like the idea and have no objection concerning the draft budget, but I also abstain from discussion as participants from Ukraine are expected to take part in the Conference --Perohanych (talk) 13:44, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
  • I have to abstain because of my involvement in the discussion about the budget and the creation of this application.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 17:34, 12 September 2012 (UTC)

Another International conference?[edit]

Without even start checking the numbers in the request: as this request will costs the movement not only the grant cost, but a much much more as chapters will need to pay for flights and travel cost for this project.

Saying that. The conference is next month. I'm board member of WMIL - a chapter who also listed on the potential participates. Since when we holding conference from today to tomorrow? I can assure you 99% that WMIL would not participate in this conference even if the grant will approve. I first heard about this conference at Berlin, but never knew it really going to happen. WMIL didn't got any notice about that you are planning to have such a conference. We haven't budget that in our annual plan travel costs (neither this year, or even the next year budget which already been approve by the assembly). Did other chapters had been inform and reserve money to participate on this conference?.

I still didn't understand the idea behind this CEE initiative. I tried to search on Meta more information, protocols from the meetings that been mention, to understand who been there, what the talked about, what they decided to do and etc.. but didn't find expect this page.

As a chapter who listed as one who can participate, I don't really understand what is my culture connection to Germany, Serbia, Latvia and others (expect that everyone participating in the Eurovision.. :). I don't think we can compare this request to Iberocoop, which have something in common (like language, about the same WP to support..). Are the CEE initiative have already point of contacts in the chapters? are they all agree that they need to have international meeting? Did the CEE had a meeting of big part of there members in Wikimania? is there any online page about what been discussed, any work committee?

Again, looking on the schedule page, who is going to lead the session there? --Itzike (talk) 18:59, 12 September 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for your questions Itzik. I will give the answers to your questions because of my involvement in the grant application as well as being one of the main supporters of the CEE group.
The total cost of the project will be increased with the costs for travelling, but it doesn't mean that the chapters would have to pay it by their selves. We've never agreed on such thing and the idea is to offer scholarships for up to two persons from each country to participate on the conference. Further on, you cannot simply say that this is a conference from today to tomorrow. The initial idea to have this conference is older than a year and it is being realized now. Perhaps you've heard for the first time about it in Berlin but it doesn't mean that it won't take place and it's something that haven't existed before. Moreover, there were ongoing discussions among the members on our mailing-list and you should have got the same e-mails as the others as well. Else, it's not something to raise concerns about the communication if you are not member on the mailing-list. The program for the conference and its schedule have been already completed and now we're awaiting for confirmation about the participation. It is even noted that we will have a facilitator who will facilitate the discussions but this part also is in its finalizing stage as some interested persons may be taken into consideration for some of the sessions.
Since you mention the idea behind the CEE group, you really should read more about it on its specific page. You can note that Israel is a country that is not member of this partnerships but because of its geographical location it was the easiest way to group it with these countries instead of any others. We feel that it was the right decision and it, therefore, was invited to send delegates at the conference as the chapters and communities from the other countries will do. In addition, there isn't mentioned that "all the countries" of the group share many similarities or similar historical background, but "most of them"; it isn't even mentioned that Israel as a specific country shares similarities with any other countries. Thus, the fact that Israel doesn't share it with "most of the other countries" should not strike the statement that these countries have historically lived in countries with same establishment and that in most of them the Slavic languages are spoken. But if we consider that Israel is home for many Russian-speaking Wikimedians, it becomes evident that a similarity between the country and the others still exists.
Regarding the preparation for the conference, you can find more about it on the specific mailing-list for the conference. One of the main ideas to have it is to encourage participation of Wikimedians from countries that have never had the chance to send delegates at Wikimania or any other conference. Having a meeting at any other conference among the delegates from these countries is a good job, but not sufficient to agree on specific things that should be carried on in the time to come. Best regards.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 09:58, 13 September 2012 (UTC)
And 10 points goes...Anyway, shalom, Itzike. Thanks for your questions and comments. I saw Kiril responded and I will not repeat the same but will give few notes. For you this is maybe one conference more, but for some people is the first because they never had a opportunity to attend and talk with colleagues from the region. The Holy Land is not the part of CEE region but members who are, told that Wikimedia IL can participate if it wants. If not - fine, we have chapters/group who wants. Like in Iberocoop you have New York and Italy, in CEE group is some states/territories/group who are not directly in CEE region but believe can have a regional cooperation with CEE. So, it is up to you to decide do you want to be in some group or not. About invitation, sorry but I must disagree with you. I talked to you about this in Berlin. I asked you if you are interested and told about date (first or second week in October). You told your opinion and then I asked you to talk with your colleagues and email me are you interested or not. I am not sure did you share information about CEE, and I do not need to know your internal things, but i never got email from your. Maybe some is. So, if WM IL want to come - welcome, if now - well, we will still have conference. As, Kiril told, this meeting is planned more that one year and some chapters included in their annual budget funds for this.(Wikimedia EE, Wikimedia HU, Wikimedia PL, WM RS...). So there is some planes, funds and wishes. There is people who want this, see the reason for cee cooperation and works to make it possible.--MikyM (talk) 17:11, 13 September 2012 (UTC)
I got curious about something: Kiril mention a mailing list for the conference. Can you people share a link to it's page? The archives are public (if not is totally fine, but I would like the read then if they are public). Béria Lima msg 05:38, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
Hi Beria. Yes, we have two mailing list for CEE group (not only for conference). One is public [1] and one is not, so maybe you will not be able to read everithing.--MikyM (talk) 06:21, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

Bookkeeper[edit]

Hi MikyM, can you explain me a small detail? I understand you need bookkeeper, but I don’t understand “2 months – Unit Price 15,000 – Total Price 15,000”. I think Total Price should be Unit Price × Number of units. And did you mean that bookkeeper’s month salary is RSD 15,000? Thanks --Packa (talk) 15:12, 17 September 2012 (UTC)

Hi. The 15K is total price for bookkeeping. Bookkeeper will work during September and October. The presented amount is not for/per monthly work but it's for the entire project.--MikyM (talk) 15:22, 17 September 2012 (UTC)

Thank you for this explanation. In this case, IMHO, you should not use the “Unit Price” column (or fill it with “N/A” value, for instance). Could you review other tables and arrange them this way, too? --Packa (talk) 10:07, 18 September 2012 (UTC)

Hi Packa. Sorry for this late comment. This grant is funded so I prefer not to edit accepted request, in order not to making confusion. Thanks for the advice. We will consider it for the future request(s).--MikyM (talk) 00:17, 21 September 2012 (UTC)

Project completion date[edit]

While there is no completion date listed for this project, the conference concluded on 14 October 2012, which will be considered the official completion date. Regards, Winifred Olliff (Grants Administrator) talk 20:11, 12 February 2013 (UTC)